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I know there have been many questions about the "very low quality" flag. I've read quite a number of them. It is clear to me that the VLQ flag shouldn't be used for questions that should be closed but only for the ones that should be deleted. As Shog9 says:

Use VLQ for obvious, unarguable garbage.

And George Stocker says that VLQ means that...

This content should not exist. Delete it. Now. It is not salvageable through editing.

So I use the flag rarely. When I use it, it gets declined relatively often. Obviously there is something I don't understand about the flag.

For example, I flagged this question as VLQ. Not before I tried to make the OP improve his post. After a number of comments (some I removed) and my close vote (now evaporated) the question had turned from bad to worse. The current code doesn't even have any bearing on the question in the title. To me, this is plain garbage.

So please tell me what I don't understand about VLQ. Most of my other flags are deemed helpful and I'm sure my flag weight, if I could see it, is quite satisfactory. If my VLQs get declined so often I think I better don't use it. I also don't want to keep mods busier than they should be.

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  • I don't think your flag weight has any bearing on the decision on individual flags of yours - rather it'll present you with a ban from flagging if you have a sufficiently high reject rate. Out of interest (feel free to ignore this), what's your helpful: rejected ratio?
    – Wai Ha Lee
    Commented Jan 13, 2016 at 21:29
  • 11
    For what it's worth, I don't believe that question to be VLQ.
    – George Stocker Mod
    Commented Jan 13, 2016 at 21:32
  • 4
    Until somebody else weighs in, I have always thought VLQ is for posts like "I like turtles" - things that isn't rude or offensive, but adds nothing to the community and, as you've quoted above, can't be salvaged by editing.
    – Wai Ha Lee
    Commented Jan 13, 2016 at 21:34
  • 3
    @WaiHaLee 475 post flags, 50 disputed, 22 declined. I don't know if I'm with you about your VLQ definition. I think that severe formatting or content problems is a wider definition than I like turtles. But I'm open to any authoritative answer. I only want to know what I'm up to. Commented Jan 13, 2016 at 21:41
  • Why didn't you vote to close instead of flagging? Am I missing something here? Commented Jan 15, 2016 at 19:37
  • 1
    Ah fine, the close vote was by you. I thought it was someone else's close vote. As an aside, if you need some more help to close a question, feel free to join that language/tools chatroom. You can discuss with others whether you need to flag such stuff or just leave it aside. Commented Jan 15, 2016 at 19:42
  • If a lot of users just find their questions being deleted without it going through the long close and then delete process, I think they will perceive StackOverflow as even more unfriendly than they previously imagined it to be.
    – Warren P
    Commented Jan 15, 2016 at 19:47
  • @BhargavRao I know, thanks, but usually I just haven't got time for that. I'm happy to know how to apply VLQ now though: hardly ever. Commented Jan 15, 2016 at 19:47
  • 1
    True, Even after 2k helpful flags, I am scared to flag for VLQ. Out of my 15 declined flags 11 of them were for VLQ (2 NAA). Just like ML, VLQ is a learning process. Commented Jan 15, 2016 at 19:50
  • @WarrenP Not sure what you're referring to. All that's written here suggests that only a very small minority of users will be faced with this 'shortcut deletes' because they're not applied easily. Commented Jan 15, 2016 at 19:54
  • Totally get you, just pointing out that the high bar seems a very good idea to me.
    – Warren P
    Commented Jan 15, 2016 at 21:12

1 Answer 1

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Very Low Quality means precisely what I wrote before, and what you said in your question:

This content should not exist. Delete it. Now. It is not salvageable through editing.

Here's what I don't mean by that:

I don't think this content should exist.

or

This question sucks.

or

Someone could learn to use a spellchecker, amirite?

Very Low Quality literally means that no matter how many people you ask, they're all going to say, "This is garbage. It should not exist."

By flagging something as very low quality, you're asking for a straight pass to moderator deletion. No editing, putting 'on hold' by 5 members of the community, deleted by 3, or voting allowed. You want a moderator to skip that entire process because the question is so terrible that there's no way it could ever be salvaged through that process.

That's a really, really, really high bar to meet. This question doesn't come close to meeting that bar.

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  • 3
    Doesn't VLQ on questions push things (back) into the triage queue any longer? Commented Jan 13, 2016 at 21:48
  • 6
    OK, crystal clear, thanks. I only wish the description of the flag was that decisive. Commented Jan 13, 2016 at 21:49
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    In the H&I queue there is no "send it back to triage, the reviewers are on glue" button. Editing, or flagging as VLQ are your only options to get the question out of the queue. If the question should just be closed, and cannot be edited by the community (i.e. the triage reviewers should have chosen unsalvageable), the only option is to flag as VLQ, which sends it back to triage, but ends up getting us declined flags when they get processed. So... what exactly should we be doing in that situation?
    – user4639281
    Commented Jan 13, 2016 at 22:58
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  • 3
    @Shog9 So I should edit the crap questions and send them to the homepage? That seems to defeat the whole point of Triage / H&I stopping bad questions from being shown there.
    – user4639281
    Commented Jan 14, 2016 at 2:50
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    why are they still crap after you're editing them, @Tiny?
    – Shog9
    Commented Jan 14, 2016 at 2:54
  • 2
    I'm referring to "If the question should just be closed, and cannot be edited by the community" as said in my first comment here. Sure I can submit an edit that will remove it from the H&I, but that won't make the question any more on-topic, and goes against my own advice to not edit off-topic questions if I cannot make them on-topic @Shog9.
    – user4639281
    Commented Jan 14, 2016 at 2:56
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    You have three choices, @Tiny: Edit, Skip and VLQ. VLQ is the "ejector seat" button - not only are you unable to edit it, you're convinced that NO ONE can edit it into something worth having around.
    – Shog9
    Commented Jan 14, 2016 at 3:08
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    You're over-thinking this, @Tiny. At the point where you're saying to yourself, "self, I think this may just be salvageable. Verily, the makings of a good question are buried in this fetid ground. But self, dear self, WHO could be trusted with such an undertaking?" - that's the point where you've overthought it. Back up a bit, before you undertook this archaeology and reflection, to when the scent of the question first entered your nostrils and you cast around frantically for any sign of intelligence - THAT'S when the decision to flag or not is made.
    – Shog9
    Commented Jan 14, 2016 at 3:18
  • 2
    ...and yes, I realize that we're sorta locked in a pattern here, where I try to tweak the system to do the right thing in response to how folks behave, and you try to alter your behavior to make the system do what you want... But those don't actually HAVE to be opposing goals.
    – Shog9
    Commented Jan 14, 2016 at 3:21
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    OK, so we just had this happen where a post in the H&I was way too broad to be salvaged by any member of the community without drastically changing the intent of the question, it was flagged as VLQ because no one could edit it, then triage marked it as Looks OK, boom mod flag in the mod queue. Of course the question should just be closed, it should never be in the mod queue, so the flag should be declined, but what option do we have available to us to do that? Sure we can vote to close it, but that doesn't get it out of the H&I queue until/if it is ever closed. @Shog
    – user4639281
    Commented Jan 14, 2016 at 3:34
  • 4
    I just really don't know what the right thing to do here is. Basically, don't review. Triage doesn't work because the well meaning users there are constantly choosing the wrong options, and the H&I doesn't work because we don't have an option to get it closed and out of the H&I.
    – user4639281
    Commented Jan 14, 2016 at 3:35
  • 5
    @Shog the "culture" of the H&I is to flag as VLQ if it should be closed, that's just how they do it there because that is the only viable option available to them. That doesn't actually work because Triage doesn't work, which is why I don't review in Triage. Why not give us an option to make it go to the close queue, instead of the futility of sending it to Triage again? Solve the entire problem by giving us an option that actually works instead of wasting everyone's time.
    – user4639281
    Commented Jan 14, 2016 at 3:44
  • 2
    BTW, @Shog9 and Tiny Giant, that chat made a lot of sense to me. Dealing with abstractions is what programmers do. Might be worth writing up in an answer...? Commented Jan 14, 2016 at 15:44
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    "literally means that no matter how many people you ask, they're all going to say" - there is literally nothing in the world about which this is true. Not one thing.
    – AakashM
    Commented Jan 15, 2016 at 10:00

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