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Two days ago I came across a question where the OP had added an answer into the question itself, so I simply removed the answer from the question and pasted it into a new community wiki answer.

I noticed that the other answers under that question needed some editing so with my newly gained 2k powers I decided to edit as many of them into shape as possible.

To be specific I edited these answers (in no particular order):

  • 1: Removed unnecessary text.
  • 2: Replaced link with inline link, removed unnecessary text and added code blocks for paths/libraries (with version numbers), grammar corrected.
  • 3: Removed unnecessary text and replaced link with inline link.
  • 4: Bullets added.
  • 5: Replaced links with inline links, bullets added, tried to line up the code with the last bullet (failed there).
  • 6: Removed unnecessary text, and added code blocks for paths.
  • 7: Removed unnecessary text, replaced link with inline link.

Today I got a few comments in my inbox from OP:

@Yatin please see my other comments. Again, your edits are unnecessary and not helpful and ruin other people's answers.

Again @yatin, you are making needless and unnecessary changes to other people's answers. This is NOT USEFUL. It was perfectly fine as it was. Please leave this alone.

And another comment which has been since deleted, that went along the lines of "This edit isn't useful. Don't suggest edits that aren't helpful. Find something else to do with you time / contribute in more useful ways.". (I am typing this from memory. I don't remember the exact phrasing.)

Now, I don't think that my edits were useless but I am still open to constructive criticism.

Please educate me on any mistakes I made while editing those answers. I have just received 2k (a few days ago) so I want to know what my mistakes were before I go about editing other stuff. Please be specific. Please also feel free to comment on any my other edits.

Some of my edits were rolled backed by OP (1, 2, 3 and 4). Also note that OP went on an edit war over their question and got it ultimately locked.

I don't want to start an edit war so I would like to know my mistakes before I suggest any edits on top of the roll-backs.


To clarify, by "unnecessary text" I meant stuff like "Thank you", "Hope this helps someone", "Cheers", etc. Basically, the stuff that meta calls fluff.

Everywhere I look on meta, people strongly suggest removing it. There was even a 'witch-hunt' against "thanks in advantage": No Thanks, Damn It!.

Adding "thank you" to a post that doesn't adhere to site's standards is false courtesy.

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  • 8
    Personally, I prefer doing simultaneous mass edits on a single Q&A thread like what you did to prevent multiple bumps, which I had done many times on other SE sites. Also, I don't really see any mistakes from your edits. But again, this is my personal opinion though.
    – Andrew T.
    Commented Jan 2, 2021 at 7:00
  • 28
    To me it seem a classical example of over editing. It's very annoying when people go and change all your formatting, that you may have spent considerable thought of doing, for clarity. You see, what's clear to you may not necessarily be clear to others. In addition it removes the original personality of the posts of answers, that make SO just a bit more personal and not only robot maintained. Now for beginner posters usually some editing is needed, in which case you're probably ok.
    – not2qubit
    Commented Jan 2, 2021 at 7:36
  • 18
    Your edit nr. 4 was good, in my opinion. It makes the post easier to read. Some of the other edits seems to be more your personal choice. Moving a link to the source to the end of the text instead of having it where it's part of the process doesn't necessarily make the post better. For example, I prefer them in the sentence where they're used, as in "From <link> I used ...". In nr 6. you completely removed the two links.
    – Scratte
    Commented Jan 2, 2021 at 8:31
  • 3
    Your edits seem to be very good. I enumerated a larger set of edit examples here.
    – halfer
    Commented Jan 2, 2021 at 11:01
  • 5
    The OP in this case rolled back your four answer edits. I think we have an ethic here that an OP does get some say in what their material looks like - if an edit is debatable and the OP wants to roll it back, we find in favour of the OP. However, we really don't like it if someone follows an editor around to undo their patient work (my experience is that moderators will find in favour of the editor in such cases).
    – halfer
    Commented Jan 2, 2021 at 11:33
  • 18
    I appreciate your enthusiasm, but you will end up running out of it soon. Correcting answers and questions in this way is like emptying the sea with a thimble. I suggest you limit yourself only to situations where the problem is evident. Forget the situations where at the end of the games the fix did not make significant improvements.
    – Steve
    Commented Jan 2, 2021 at 11:50
  • 12
    Please do not format prose as code unless it is code. Just because a name can be used in code doesn't make it code. Also it becomes hard to read. It's almost always a matter of personal style and the author made their choice. So don't add or remove it in edits.
    – philipxy
    Commented Jan 3, 2021 at 1:08
  • 4
    I wouldn't always call the context of how someone got to the answer "noise", though any variation of "I also had this problem" often gets a legitimate answer flagged as NAA. Inlining links is good but the text for the link should still tell the user where it goes.
    – BSMP
    Commented Jan 3, 2021 at 3:17
  • 9
    @TheCoordinator: sure, there are on the platform who wish to vandalise content. But the answers were not vandalised, so that does not apply here. Trimming chatty material, fixing case and spelling, etc are all good edits. "Most users are smart enough to understand what people mean" is not a sufficient reason to refrain from editing - if it is an improvement in some way, we generally want to keep it.
    – halfer
    Commented Jan 3, 2021 at 10:13
  • 4
    If SO wants to be more welcoming, they needs be less perfectionist, both before and after user interaction. Less editing and less moderation would add the humanity back to this site. As it stands, pedancy is rewarded. At least that's the way I see it. Like I said, anyone could read and understand the said Q&A page pre-edit. The edits might make a career editor happy, but they did not improve the page. Commented Jan 3, 2021 at 10:20
  • 33
    Edits are not personal attacks. This site is not designed to have any humanity, any more than Wikipedia has humanity. Leaving the page better than you found it is everyone's mission.
    – Cody Gray Mod
    Commented Jan 3, 2021 at 11:10
  • 5
    The idea of posts on SO is, that they contribute to a look-up-style database of Questions/Answers. Some users seem to have a sense of ownership and feel very protective of what they wrote. This is simply not how SO works. Your edits are great :)
    – Neuron
    Commented Jan 3, 2021 at 13:33
  • 6
    SO is not looking to add humanity back to the site. On the contrary, this kind of behaviour often bloats posts and is what drives people away. Heavy moderation is desired; it is what is needed to keep Stack Overflow afloat. Just because you can read a post does not mean that it cannot be improved. We need more editors, not less. We do not try to discourage people from editing posts, because that is precisely what we need. As long as you keep the original intent of the post, and your edits improve it, then your work is appreciated.
    – Dharman Mod
    Commented Jan 3, 2021 at 13:44
  • 4
    By posting on Stack Overflow you give Stack Exchange Inc. permission to use the contents of your post. It is no longer in your possession, but you remain the author. Anyone can come and build on top of what you posted and improve it. If you don't like this type of collaborative team work then Stack Overflow is not for you.
    – Dharman Mod
    Commented Jan 3, 2021 at 13:46
  • 11
    Edits looked good to me, I think his ego took a hit more than anything. Commented Jan 3, 2021 at 17:20

7 Answers 7

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Your edits look really good. Keep up the good work.

No edits will ever make the post 100% correct, but as long as you improve posts you are doing a good job. You should always aim to make posts easier to read and clearer. Remove unnecessary noise and apply correct formatting.

When it comes to answers added to the question body, such edits should always be rolled back. Whether you would want to add the answer as CW post or ask OP to do that should be decided on a case by case basis.

Some users are unappreciative of the work we do. Don't worry too much about it. If they roll back you should flag such harmful rollbacks so that moderators can lock the post and talk to the user if necessary. Try to avoid roll back wars and instead flag and ask moderators to lock the post for some time.

The comments you received were rude and condescending, and should be flagged for deletion. Don't engage in an argument with such users.

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Those edits vary in terms of the value they add to the post. I wouldn't want to enumerate every kind of edit which is suitable and always welcome, but here is a relevant subset:

  • Removing noisy meta-commentary such as "hope this helps", "please help me", "thanks", and "Happy New Year";
  • Removing an attempt to answer a question by editing the question;
  • Applying the right kind of formatting (itemizing enumerations, code constructs like this, quoting only where quoting makes sense, etc.).

Other kinds of edits may be under a grey line, but there is generally no reason to roll them back unless important information was removed.

It is unfortunate, but some people are too overprotective of their own posts, as well as for their "original" and "charismatic" form, while often even forgetting that by posting on Stack Overflow, they are handing over the right to distribute and edit them for the betterment of the platform.

Let's not forget why we are editing other people's posts: so that they become better resources for future visitors. That the poster wanted to say "hope this helps" should not override the ideal of improving clarity across the repository. Seeing the posts from the given examples, I wouldn't be surprised if you would want to slow down a bit, but it's not exactly these edits that we should be worried about here. This is just another example of someone being unappreciative of curation through editing, deliberately making a distorted assessment of quality for the sake of personal identity.

Should anyone (as happened in this case) leave one or more non-constructive comments about how anyone's edits on someone's "special" post are useless, flag them and move along.

See also:

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23

I frequently repost solutions as separate CW answers. We had a discussion on how to attribute a reposted answer here.

Your attribution text was as follows:

Answer on the behalf of OP:

I tend to prefer a slightly longer form:

(Reposting solution on behalf of the question author, to move it to the answer space.)

As an editor, I wouldn't correct your introductory text, but my phrasing has been developed after several years of feedback:

  • The acronym "OP" is not universally understood in all English-speaking cultures
  • I use brackets and italics to show the material is an aside
  • Some folks have not understood that the post is merely the question author's own material, so I now explain why it is being reposted

Other than that, it sounds like you are doing some assiduous editing work - keep it up! Most material authors accept edits without demur, but occasionally I bump into a high-rep user who doesn't believe their material should be edited. In such cases, if your edits are a clear improvement, raise a custom flag for a moderator, explain the issue, and then try to forget about it.

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  • 8
    The "OP" is just a terrible abbreviation, in my opinion. Use the actual username and the link to their profile. And refer to them as the "Question author" :)
    – Scratte
    Commented Jan 2, 2021 at 11:33
  • Thanks @Scratte. There was some difference of opinion on that very question in the linked post - I personally thought that linking to a profile was too much work, another contributor disagreed. A moderator (in the accepted answer) took the view that "question author" is an unambiguous statement of authorship, and if someone wants to see the author's profile, they know how to find it. However, yes, if someone wanted to repost answer material and link to the author's profile, that's totally fine.
    – halfer
    Commented Jan 2, 2021 at 11:35
  • 14
    ARAAA (Attribution Requirements Aside, Avoid Acronyms)
    – Cody Gray Mod
    Commented Jan 2, 2021 at 12:29
  • 2
    ARAAA? Hopefully YAGNI.
    – E_net4
    Commented Jan 2, 2021 at 13:06
  • 7
    We should ask for a new feature: [qauth] and [aauth] markdown shortcuts to insert a link to question and answer author without going to the user profile and start a copy/paste
    – Steve
    Commented Jan 2, 2021 at 16:33
  • @Steve, that would be a welcome improvement, and I would upvote such a feature request with zeal. Commented Jan 2, 2021 at 19:32
  • 3
    @Scratte Thanks for the "Question author", I was always in pain as to how I was supposed to say "OP" in my sentences.
    – Clockwork
    Commented Jan 2, 2021 at 20:46
  • @Steve You can also right-click their username and save the link to your clipboard "Copy link address".
    – Scratte
    Commented Jan 2, 2021 at 21:21
  • 4
    I prefer simply saying "asker", @Clockwork.
    – Cody Gray Mod
    Commented Jan 3, 2021 at 4:43
  • For some reason, my spell check does not seem to think "asker" and "answerer" are words. It does, however, have "inquirer", and both "responder" and "respondent". English do be like that. Commented Jan 14, 2023 at 7:45
18

I had a quick look at your edits.

  1. This was bad. I found it harder to read it after your edit.
  2. Good
  3. Mixed feelings. Your correction of the language was good
  4. Very good
  5. Very good except for the added indentation in the code block
  6. Good
  7. Is exactly the same answer as 2

In general, I think your edits are good. But I can understand that some people might find you a bit eager. It's one thing when I look at edits of other peoples answers and a completely different thing when I look at edits of my own posts. Many people (myself included) get a bit defensive about "my" posts. So it can be a good idea to be a bit careful.

Another advice is to not edit answers shortly after they are posted. I really hate having to deal with other people editing my answer while I'm still in the process of editing it myself. It's better to wait a few hours or a day, depending on the situation. Before that, use comments to tell the author what you want to be done.

18

There's a lot of misinformation and hyperbole being bandied about in the answers here, on both sides of the debate. On the one side, you have folks who appear to have had their ego bruised by someone editing their content, fundamentally missing the fact that Stack Overflow has been, since its very inception, a collaboratively-edited site, where all users are encouraged to leave a page better than they found it. On the other side, you have the reactionary view to that, with people defending all of the edits with a broad brush, simply because they want to reassure you and clarify that edits to posts are welcome.

The truth is—as ever—somewhere in the middle. Edits to posts are strongly encouraged, but edits should be substantial and leave the post better than you found it. They should also always strive to be consistent with the author's intent, as best as it can be determined. Edits are the lifeblood of the Stack Exchange model. The "wiki" aspect is as much in our DNA as it is in Wikipedia's.

I don't want to discourage you from editing, but at the same time, you've asked for honest feedback (which is great), so I don't want to just give you lip service about how editing is a thankless job.

  1. This edit (revision #2) was perhaps a bit too heavy-handed. I would not have removed the indication that the user experienced a similar problem; I believe that is relevant information that puts the answer into context and suggests that it's been actually tested. But ultimately that's a judgment call. The bigger issue is, if you're going to take time to edit that post, you should be correcting other, more severe issues with it, like the comma splices (apparently used in place of periods).

    Subsequent edits by other users have also been a mixed bag. The next one did exactly as I suggested and fixed the grammar (periods between sentences), and it also added a sentence clarifying what the block of code actually was, which is great. But it added superfluous inline code formatting, which doesn't make the post any easier to read.

  2. This edit (revision #2) is much better. I see almost nothing to nitpick about here, really. I would have fixed the grammar ("After downloading any…").

    A subsequent editor saw fit to introduce a precaution that the provided download link was not an official one. That's fine, but it isn't an argument against your edit. You didn't invent the link out of whole cloth; it was there in the original revision. What isn't fine is that the subsequent editor went further, removing the download link entirely. That's not legitimate. It violates one of the conditions stated earlier, namely that edits should strive to be consistent with the author's intent.

  3. A similar thing for this edit (revision #2). In fact, I really don't like that edit at all. The post did need to be edited, but your edit wasn't really much of an improvement. The major source of improvement was removing "Hope this will help someone", which is a start, but the rest of the edits were not improvements. I admit to being heavily biased against dumping a "Source" link at the bottom of a post. That doesn't meet our attribution requirements.

    I've made some pretty heavy edits to that answer; check them out as a guide for future actions.

  4. This edit (revision #2) is fine. One simply cannot argue that the bullet points were not an improvement over the original. Are there other things to fix? Yeah, probably. Is that revision #2 the best possible form of the answer? Nah. But that's too high of a bar to impose on individual edits/editors. You just need to leave the post better than you found it, and adding those bullet points definitely makes it more readable.

    On that basis, the rollback of that edit by another user is…inexcusable. If they'd found some other way to improve the readability of the post, then that'd be fine with me. But they didn't. They just dumped it back to its original, less readable state. Huh? No. (Their ultimate attempt, revision #6, is much better. It definitely left the post better than it was in the previous revision, #5.)

  5. This edit (revision #2) is also a clear improvement, for precisely the same reasons as the previous edit. Again, there are plenty of additional improvements that could be made. I'd have made them. I also have very good grammar skills. I don't expect all editors to have those same skills. If you're improving the readability of a post, then you should go ahead and edit, even if you cannot achieve perfection. And, again, we can quibble about whether links to a dubious download site are useful, but the link was in the original (you didn't add it), and so removing it without finding a replacement does not seem to add value or respect the author's intent.

  6. This edit (revision #2) is excellent. Well, mostly excellent. Again, I'd nitpick about grammar. There doesn't need to be a comma after "Simply". That's an adverb, not an introductory phrase. Still, your edit left the post better than you found it, which is the cardinal command. None of that noise you removed was helping anyone find or understand the answer.

    Again, it seems that the person who rolled back your edit was operating out of extremely bad faith. They know what a good edit looks like, and ultimately made one (revision #5). However, rather than trying to make the site better, their initial edit was just trying to undo your edits. This is not constructive. Fortunately, it ended well—largely thanks to this very discussion.

  7. The edit you linked here is the same as edit #3—no fair in getting credit twice for the same edit!

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    I can live with this. I admit that I over reacted or something to the OP's original edit and then to the other edits on other people's answers. I'm sorry - I got my back up and it wasn't pretty (see My 2 answers on this page). There is a balance, a happy medium and it is not easy to achieve at all times. My sincere apologies for getting into it with @Yatin. I'm blaming COVID :) But seriously, I like your take here and I think this is a good feedback we can all use in some constructive way. Commented Jan 7, 2021 at 9:09
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    @TheCoordinator Thank you for understanding. I have also understood that I should be far more careful while applying/suggesting/approving edits. I have read and understood all answers and I want to thank everyone for being patient and explaining their perspectives to me. I learned a lot for this. :)
    – Sabito
    Commented Jan 7, 2021 at 10:44
  • 3
    @Yatin Again, I do sincerely apologize for reacting the way I did. It was not constructive. I almost wish the system had not sent me the email notification that it did "3 new items in your Stack Exchange inbox" for these edits. I probably would not have minded if they were just edited and I discovered it at some later date. However, I got the usual emails, checked the site, and then did some head scratching about this admittedly very old question. Commented Jan 7, 2021 at 18:58
  • 1
    @Cody Gray Perhaps there needs to be a way to fine tune the email notifications to unsubscribe from small edits (use some sort of metric/AI to determine this). I will post a question in Meta to ask about that and maybe the powers that be here can look into it. Some people might not want to receive emails if something is just a grammatical change or very minor edit. Commented Jan 7, 2021 at 18:58
  • 7
    Yeah, @TheCoordinator, I can see why getting an email notification about those edits would be annoying. Personally, I would find it annoying to get email notifications about any site actions, since I get many dozens of notifications in my on-site inbox every day. Either way, thanks for reassessing your position and being rational about it. Along with votes, edits are part of the lifeblood of this site, so I really don't like developing a reluctance to edits because of the noisiness of the notification system. Also worth noting that age doesn't matter on Stack Overflow.
    – Cody Gray Mod
    Commented Jan 7, 2021 at 23:10
5

Your edits look fine, and other answers already talk about that. I just wanted to raise a few points.


Some people have mentioned that edits should only be made when they are desperately needed. If the question and the answer(s) can be understood, then no editing is required.

This is wrong on many levels, allow me to explain myself.

Take the below answer, which is similar to this edit:

Hey there! Welcome to Stack Overflow. I had the same problem as you

The code isn't working because [java techy stuff here].

Here is the code to solve the problem:

smart java code here

That should do it.

Hope this helps!

Now, already as an editor, I see a lot of mistakes. "Hope this helps!" is just meta fluff and should be removed.

There is also unnecessary text that the post can do without. It makes the post more streamlined and better for future readers to read. Why would a future reader care if the answerer had the same problem? Why would the answerer care if the question asker is new to SO?

Also, it's innately obvious that the code in the answer will solve the problem. There is no need to state the obvious. Just keep it short and sweet.

The post should be edited into this:

Hey there! Welcome to Stack Overflow. I had the same problem as you

The code isn't working because [java techy stuff here].

Here is the code to solve the problem: 1

smart code here

That should do it

Hope this helps!

After editing, the answer is so much easier to read for many people. This is the kind of thing SO exists for: collaborative editing. When you post an answer, it's not really yours when you post it. It's everyone's to edit and get help from. Technically you have the post and you benefit when people upvote the answer, but apart from that it is no longer yours. It is Stack Overflow's answer, under the CC-BY-SA license.

The age of the question is also irrelevant. We edit any question or answer that can be improved upon.

As stated in the help center, when you post a question or answer, it is free to be edited by anyone.

1 It's OK to have that line there, it’s your choice.

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    1. The Answer is still yours! You own it. You just gave Stack a license to show it. 2. Removing "Here is the code to solve the problem:" leaves the Answer like it's missing something from explaining what isn't working. Something needs to go there. Else it's just part of what isn't working. 3. It bothers me when users edit their own flavour into a post. Like changing from British English to American English, or something that the author never said, and never meant to say.
    – Scratte
    Commented Jan 3, 2021 at 21:42
-17

I don't mind my posts being improved. I totally respect the site's need for editing and general encouragement to edit posts that are not readable. However, where edits do not substantially improve a questions and answers in a meaningful way, they are best left out.

When someone makes minor edits to a 7 year old question, then goes on to edit 6 of the answers on the same page, making almost no difference to the readability or information the original user presented, it does nothing other than alienate users from their own posts.

As Theodor Zoulias artfully said in their now deleted answer:

this is indeed the point of this answer. That by editing other people's posts too aggressively and without an obvious reason (ugly typos, dead-links etc), you alienate them from their own posts. Everyone wants to return now and then to something they created in the past, and see that their personal signature has been preserved in time. It's not a nice feeling when there is nothing left to your creation that you can identify with.

Theodor gets it.

What we don't need as a site is marking behavior. Just because you can touch something doesn't mean you should. Sometimes less is more.

I think everyone appreciates that a question or answer still looks like something they wrote, even years later. And that is a feature if you ask me -- I don't expect a community site to represent a Wikipedia style dryness. I expect it to look like real life humans made questions and got answers - even imperfect questions and imperfect answers (as long as the actual answers get voted on indicating the correct or most liked answer.)

People are always free to post a better worded answer that isn't a direct plagiarism. And that answer can be voted up by other users.

After rolling back the OP's original edit, I would have expected them to rethink whether the contribution was really necessary and move on. It was a 7 year old question and also with aged answers. Obviously, the question and answers survived this long in their original form. The provenance being preserved would have been a good thing in my opinion.

As for users comments indicating to the effect 'reread the terms and conditions, users sign over 100% to StackOverflow' etc., well ... that isn't helpful either. People don't engage here to have their engagements unnecessarily changed, or to be reminded that their contributions are appreciated only in the sense that StackOverflow and its affiliates are benefitted.

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    The age of the question is irrelevant. Stack Overflow is a Q&A repository. >99.9% of my questions are already asked and answered here. When I find a post that might be relevant to my question, whether it was posted yesterday or 7 years ago, I'd like to be able to read it easily. I don't care about the personalty of the person that posted it. It's just about the information in the post. That information must be accessible. The less cruft the better. Typos and salutations are annoying when you're trying to get to that information. Commented Jan 4, 2021 at 5:39
  • 11
    Most old questions don't need to be improved for style and formatting, but it's not a bad thing when they are. Having an answer as part of the question is never ok, completely against how Stack Overflow is supposed to work. Your arguments for preserving individual character / style make some sense for things like whether to have a bare URL or have a link like [this](url), but that doesn't come close to justifying rolling back a helpful edit that moved the answer out of the question. Lots of "lazy" stuff like that slid under the radar years ago, but don't work against efforts to improve! Commented Jan 4, 2021 at 5:39
  • 17
    Of the 9 years I've been on this site, it has never been acceptable for an answer to be anywhere but the answer field; eg, not in the question body, so I'm not sure why you'd roll that back, much less get in an edit war regarding that improvement. That someone missed this when the question was originally edited to have that content is not an argument to continue breaking that rule. Plenty of bad things are missed daily because of the constant surge of content; that doesn't mean they should stay or remain unmoderated.
    – Daedalus
    Commented Jan 4, 2021 at 6:44
  • "it has never been acceptable for an answer to be anywhere but the answer field". Yes - I think you are correct about that. However, as for that question, on that page, I think the answer actually was properly part of the question. Why, because the fact that Oracle accidentally forgot to put the tools.jar in the exe install file for just that version is very unexpected. That is why I included it in the question, because the question was really an answer for people that were scratching their head initially like I was. Commented Jan 4, 2021 at 21:12
  • The answer wasn't there by accident. I put it there because I wanted others to see the original problem (an exe bug shall we say) and context clearly and to have curated quick fix. Perhaps I failed in that. That was my intent. This isn't an installation issues. It is a problem with the exe file that oracle delivered in that specific version. Commented Jan 4, 2021 at 21:22

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