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Spending some quality time in the Suggested Edits review queue, I am noticing more and more that there are lots of generally well-meaning editors out there who are not removing noise like "Thanks", actual name signatures, "Please help me I can't figure it out!", etc.

I'm not referring to folks who just add a few backticks and leave a ton of other problems. I'm referring to edits that actually fix pretty much everything else in the post, except the noise. Clearly the editor is doing the best he/she can, but where is the guidance that indicates greetings are noise?

If one peruses Meta at all, it becomes clear a) what constitutes noise, and b) that the noise should be removed (along with everything else wrong, of course). However, if one doesn't look at Meta at all, it must be much less obvious. Right now, as I understand it, the best way to communicate this directly is to accept the edit, remove the noise yourself, then tell the editor in the comments on the post that they should remove noise.

I don't particularly like this option, because it adds noise in the comments on the post itself. It's also going to get quite annoying, as it would have to be done very frequently. (The number of edits I see like this is growing)

My question - how can we give more specific editing guidance? In particular, the following is what is in the tips in the "Help and Improvement" queue:

Editing The Body

Read and understand the question! If you don't know what it's asking, skip.

  • Ensure the question begins with a problem statement!
  • Fix all spelling, capitalization and grammatical mistakes
  • Ensure all code is formatted and readable
  • Remove unnecessary introductions and closings
  • Rewrite demands and appeals to emotion
  • Add additional details left in the comments (shown below)

Is this (or something like it) shown to all editors? Excepting, of course, the review-queue specifics.

Note, that for some reason I cannot make any "How To Edit" box show up outside of review, even though I could swear I've seen it, so if there is one I can't verify what it currently says.

Some related meta posts, since folks on meta like research. The third one refers to editing answers, but my issue is most applicable to questions.

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    I like to point people to stackoverflow.com/help/behavior, third point. Commented Oct 22, 2015 at 2:23
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    Yeah, that's a good resource page. I just feel like I'm swimming upstream if I need to point out that page every fifth review. It's probably not quite that often, but sometimes it feels like it.
    – Ajean
    Commented Oct 22, 2015 at 5:44
  • I don't think there is a good solution. Just like newer users posting off topic questions, we can't force them to read the help center, all we can do is vote on the action and comment appropriately. I would accept and improve such edits, if they're good substantial edits.
    – Kevin B
    Commented Oct 22, 2015 at 14:50
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    I wonder if Improve Edit would be the way to go. You've indicated that their efforts were worth-while, but you also step in to remove the noise. The Edit Reason can then address the additional edit need. I always checked the approvals and edit history when an edit of mine made it through. Though not all users will bother to do this, they didn't bother reading How to Edit either - but it's one more possible exposure and isn't comment noise.
    – OhBeWise
    Commented Oct 22, 2015 at 14:57
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    Huh, I don't touch Help & Improvement much and as such have never seen any of this advice. But I'm not sure it's even all good advice. In particular, "Ensure the question begins with a problem statement!" is terrible. 4 out of the 5 highest-upvoted questions on Stack Overflow don't follow this - they start with a scenario description, and then follow up with the actual question (which I assume is what a "problem statement" is?) at the end of the post. And that's absolutely fine; why the heck are we telling people to reorder the content of these questions?
    – Mark Amery
    Commented Oct 22, 2015 at 15:09
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    @OhBeWise I was doing that for awhile, but as you mentioned I wasn't sure if any editors bothered to look at it. I suppose in that way it may instruct the OP of the post as well, which is a good thing too.
    – Ajean
    Commented Oct 22, 2015 at 15:11
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    @MarkAmery I was more interested in the "Remove unnecessary introductions and closings", that's one of the few places outside the help center I saw such a directive. Probably addressing the entirety of the H&I edit advice is for another question.
    – Ajean
    Commented Oct 22, 2015 at 15:13
  • Many of these users may not even want to do a complete edit to the post they just can't stand to look at the question without the code formatting. (I know I feel that way some times) Even <2k, making a suggested edit to format the code will format it for that user. It may not be complete, but it is still useful.
    – Daniel
    Commented Oct 22, 2015 at 15:32
  • What do you do now in this kind of situation? (In (1) a minor edit that just adds backticks, or (2) a comprehensive edit that leaves "Thanks" in at the end)? Commented Oct 23, 2015 at 18:48
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    You know who will remove all the noise for you? Arnold Rimmer, that's your guy. No, really, you guys spend your day by removing "Hello", "Thanks" and "Sincerely David" from posts? And you feel like you're the good guys? Commented Oct 23, 2015 at 19:14
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    @MarkAmery - Is it possible that "Ensure the question begins with a problem statement!" is actually referring to the question's title and not the body of the post? I think some people could stand to get to the point quicker but I'm generally also OK with the actual question being at the end. It's the posts where it's missing completely (or somewhere in the middle) that are really the problem.
    – BSMP
    Commented Oct 23, 2015 at 19:25
  • @TomášZato - Who's Arnold Rimmer? But yes, editing noise out of posts is considered a good thing.
    – BSMP
    Commented Oct 23, 2015 at 19:26
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    Arnold Rimmer is a character from the Red Dwarf British sitcom series. He's the guy that has always his clothes folded in a pile so well that it looks like a box. He's the guy who can't have fun in any consequences, but also doesn't do big deal with the job either. Which is exactly why this post reminded him to me. You could be answering questions instead of deleting smileys... Commented Oct 23, 2015 at 19:42
  • @Yakk I'm not sure what bearing that has on the question, the question is not "what should I be doing," it's "how can the SO community give better guidance to editors."
    – Ajean
    Commented Oct 23, 2015 at 20:28
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    Well, (1) I usually reject, but let me be clear that I'm referring to edits that backtick three words to get the 6 character limit but leave other egregious things wrong. (2), if they really are otherwise good, I'll usually "improve" (counts as an accept). But unless the editor goes and looks at the edit history, they don't get any sort of extra information as to how the edit was "improved".
    – Ajean
    Commented Oct 23, 2015 at 20:35

1 Answer 1

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A 'canonical' meta Q and A that addresses this - with plenty of examples. In help it would be too cluttered. Should explain why capitalisation is important (does i mean "me" or refer to a variable - and is a column "one" or A etc. etc.).

That "Any ideas?" is just as much "noise" as is "Thanks."

That unnecessary introductions include how long one has searched, how inexperienced one is, how urgently the answer is needed, etc. etc.

Plus all "the usual suspects" (tags in Titles etc. etc.).

It won't be read by those who post until after all this clutter has been posted but a meta Q&A would at least be somewhere to direct the OP to that might then reduce that OP's recidivism - and serve as detailed guidance for editors/those who suggest edits.

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  • I like this, makes tips for the editors slightly less roundabout. You're right it can't help until afterward, but may be the best viable option at this point.
    – Ajean
    Commented Oct 23, 2015 at 14:42
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    Thanks for the tip… although it'll have to wait until I'm back at a computer :)
    – Ajean
    Commented Oct 23, 2015 at 16:16
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    I created a proposal for an editing FAQ a while ago. Commented Nov 3, 2015 at 19:22

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