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I have been reviewing Help and Improvement queue from about a week. Whenever I see a post that should be closed I click "question is very low quality" link. I want to know if the reviewers, who reviewed such posts and marked them as Should Be Improved instead of Unsalvageable repeatedly, get affected by the number of posts sent by them to Help and Improvement queue by marking them as Should Be Improved which go back to the Triage queue via question is very low quality as they are supposed to be Unsalvageable.

In short my question is

Do reviewers get affected such as banned or suspended when a number of posts they send to Help and Improvement queue go back to Triage queue?

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  • As far as I know no. I would hope that audits are catching them and they are getting reviewed banned if they are always picking should be improved. Commented Jun 23, 2015 at 20:00
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    The hope is slim, considering the audits are mostly blatant spam rather than typical VLQ posts.
    – user3717023
    Commented Jun 23, 2015 at 20:32
  • Maybe I don't understand "Should be improved". For all of those, there's obvious ways the question could be improved (often given explicitly by the comments). If OP will put in the time and effort, they could even become great questions. To me, "Unsalvageable" says "spam" or "cat walking on keyboard". In fact, I only recently discovered that "Unsalvageable" is closer to flagging, and brings up the flag dialog. Does this mean that "Unsalvageable" should say "Flag to close/delete"?
    – Teepeemm
    Commented Jun 24, 2015 at 13:22
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    @Teepeemm Should be Improved means it should be improved by the community rather than the OP even though its not explicit there. As you can see in the flowchart in this post, all Should be Improved posts get fed to the Help and Improvement review queue for community to improve them not the OP. If you feel the OP need to improve it by flagging to close it via Unsalvageable with a reason like too broad or unclear what you're asking or primarily opinion-based based on the post for the OP to improve rather than Should be improved.
    – Ram
    Commented Jun 24, 2015 at 13:36
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    @Teepeemm The triage queue is horribly broken, because the labels for the actions and what they describe do not align with what the actions do. "Should be Improved" talks about the author (or others) fixing it up: but instead, it sends it to other stack overflow users to fix it up in the help&improvement queue. There, the users can choose "edit", "skip" or "question is very low quality". In effect, the system puts eyes on a question twice for no good reason if the author needs to fix it up. This may be fine, as reviewers are free for stack overflow, right? Commented Jun 24, 2015 at 14:43
  • Be aware that clicking "question is very low quality" causes you to flag the post. You can end up flag-banned if too many of your flags are declined.
    – Kenster
    Commented Jun 25, 2015 at 16:50
  • Define "affected". Commented Jun 25, 2015 at 17:14
  • @LightnessRacesinOrbit banned or suspended
    – Ram
    Commented Jun 25, 2015 at 17:14

1 Answer 1

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Users in the Triage queue are doing exactly what they are being told to do.

If a question can be fixed by either the Author or other Users, they are told to click "should be improved".

Should Be Improved for questions where edits by the author or others would result in a question that is clear and answerable

"Should be improved" then says "send it to help and improvement"! Here, users can "Edit", "Skip" or search in the bottom right for "question is very low quality", where they can flag a question as "needs to be closed" because the problem really is that the author did not provide the information needed to solve the problem, actually get around to asking a question, etc.

This system basically tells triage to waste help and improvement's time. To be fair, this does let triage review questions that they have almost no expertise on.

So long as there are sufficient reviewers, this is not Stack Overflow's problem. Reviewers are free labor. Having one queue toss work at another queue, so long as the queues are mostly empty, is free.

A way to improve the H&I experience might be to provide triage with another exit stream:

  • Ok
  • Help & Improvement Queue
  • Author needs to add Information
  • Unsalvageable
  • Skip

but this arguably makes Triage more complex. It does make the action of "Needs Improvement" more clear.

An alternative would be to add "Author needs to add Information" as a top-line option in Help & Improvement, instead of hiding it on the side under a dialog. This way, in a perfect world, every question passed to H&I from Triage would have a top-line option that H&I should use. Any use of the "very low quality" in H&I becomes a sign that the Triage users where imperfect.

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    Instead [Unsalvageable] should be [Unsalvageable without author input]
    – user4639281
    Commented Jun 24, 2015 at 15:09
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    @TinyGiant: That's what it already is. Though the labels are bad. Commented Jun 24, 2015 at 15:30
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    @Deduplicator that's the point I was trying to get across
    – user4639281
    Commented Jun 24, 2015 at 15:31
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    @Deduplicator no, that is not what it already is. From the Triage queue: "Should Be Improved for questions where edits by the author or others would result in a question that is clear and answerable". the author. The system explicitly tells triage users to send "the author needs to edit this for it to be usable" to Help and Improvement. I guess a tortured parsing could say "this only applies if edits by other users would be sufficient", but as far as I can tell, this routing of questions to H&I is by design. Commented Jun 24, 2015 at 16:54
  • Seems not to be so based on all the other sources of information. As I said, the labels are bad. Commented Jun 24, 2015 at 17:33
  • @dedup I am not talking about the label. Go to triage, there are explicit instructions that if the post can be fixed by an author edit, to click "Needs Improvement". I paraphrased it in my answer above. I will put it into a quote block to be more clear. Commented Jun 25, 2015 at 17:28
  • Yes, you quoted the right text. But you gave it your very own emphasis and thus interpretation: "Should Be Improved for questions where edits by the author or others would result in a question that is clear and answerable" This changed emphasis means if only the author can do it, it is not "should be improved". That demonstrates the point that the text is completely unclear. Commented Jun 25, 2015 at 19:27
  • @Deduplicator So, you think it means if "edits by others would not result in a question that is clear and answerable" while "edits by the author would result in a question that is clear and answerable", then the condition is false? That seems like a really strange way to treat or in that sentence, and definitely not standard English. "A turn does not matter if turning left or right gets you to your destination" is wrong, corrected it is: "A turn does not matter if turning either left or right gets you to your destination". either or both is required to get that meaning. Commented Jun 25, 2015 at 19:42
  • It can be interpreted thus. And doing that certainly gets one to more useful triaging. The reason is that natural language is sloppy, so really nailing something down is hard. Commented Jun 25, 2015 at 19:44

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