151
votes

In the event of this1
We’re removing “Hot Meta Posts” from Stack Overflow's sidebar for now; moderators now fully control [featured] we need to sort out as a community how we are going to handle featured questions.

The first two posts to be featured under this new system, based on custom mod flags are:

Embedding Facebook avatars enables tracking of Stack Overflow users

and

What's up with the breakdown in communication between Stack Overflow and the community?

Firstly a question for the community team: Are the rules around the number of featured posts changing?

Second, a question for the community.

How would you like us (the mod team) to handle which posts are featured?

1. RIP Hot Meta Posts

Related: How do mods think we should flag for "Featured" tag

13
  • 2
    one proposal is drafted in the change announcement - in the second part of the answer: "Moderators regularly post and feature surveys..." I plan to polish it a bit and repost here after a few days if the change isn't rolled back (if someone else reposts earlier than that I won't object)
    – gnat
    Commented Jul 24, 2019 at 12:12
  • 3
    @gnat the mods are in a position of "what do we do now" so we need some guidance. Mods are not trail blazers, we adhere to the policies of the site and community consensus. So we do need some help in this matter. We are currently making it up as we go along.
    – user3956566
    Commented Jul 24, 2019 at 12:14
  • 1
    How can a moderator mourn the death of "Hot Meta Posts" when it is the moderators who are killing it? Is there a civil war among the moderators? Who's in charge around here?
    – matt
    Commented Jul 28, 2019 at 14:32
  • 1
    So what's the proposed process for removing featured posts? (I presume that will happen with the removal of the [featured] tag from the post.) Will it be time based? view based? other? Commented Jul 28, 2019 at 16:23
  • 4
    @matt what makes you think the mods are in charge?
    – user3956566
    Commented Jul 28, 2019 at 19:58
  • 1
    @RoddyoftheFrozenPeas to be completely honest I have no idea. It's all knew to all of us.
    – user3956566
    Commented Jul 28, 2019 at 19:58
  • It seems there is not much change here anymore. Should we maybe proceed and somehow make a system go up and running? Or should implementation / details be clarified first? Commented Jul 31, 2019 at 21:39
  • 4
    @matt It's not the mods; it's the company. The moderators I've seen are actually against this.
    – MilkyWay90
    Commented Aug 1, 2019 at 1:58
  • 5
    The old Hot Posts used to change pretty regularly. How long will these new manually selected Featured Posts stay up? I see one has already been up for a week and it feels stale.
    – j08691
    Commented Aug 1, 2019 at 17:07
  • 1
    This question is no longer [featured] - does that mean a decision has been made?
    – OrangeDog
    Commented Aug 7, 2019 at 11:30
  • 1
    @OrangeDog would you believe No? I asked about it a few hours ago. Sorry about this. The mod team is dragging it's chain. I suspect we're tired. Feel free to come here for chat chat.stackoverflow.com/rooms/197438/the-meta-room
    – user3956566
    Commented Aug 7, 2019 at 11:31
  • I see you have accepted not the most voted answer. Does this mean we wont be implementing the HMP ourselves? If so, is there a reason for this, since it goes against top voted answer. Commented Aug 28, 2019 at 21:48
  • @NathanOliver Looks like it. Probably because the company doesn't like it. It was kind of nice to be asked, but it looks like mods are getting the worst deal of all. Little power, lots and lots of work and fire from all sides. Commented Sep 6, 2019 at 5:10

11 Answers 11

94
votes

Add the tag to the posts that need judgment, attention, feedback from the community. In other words, the things that the whole community should pay attention to, not just the higher meta-active community.

Instead of assigning to post that have high votes and views, assign it to those which needs attention from the community.


The categories of the posts that should be featured.

  1. Burninations

    • Because here, we are moderating a piece of Stack Overflow. This should be done carefully and should be validated by feedback, especially the people who have a little idea about the tag which is about to be burninated and don't visit meta quite often and the answers below the burnination requests, stating their opinion also need feedback.
    • Given that when the tag is about to be burninated, it is automatically featured by our mods, Featuring it as soon as it receives a fixed amount of upvotes will only boost the process of burnination. e.g. Should we burninate [godaddy]?
  2. Feature requests

    • Most FR's are the ones that modify the regular UX and UI of the site. They too need feedback from users as these FR's will affect them too. Again, exposing them to the bulletin will gather attention and more cross-validated feedback. e.g. Add VueJS to preset snippet options
  3. Changes to some features on the site

  4. Exceptional posts

  5. Experiments

    • Experiments conducted by SE staff should be featured as they affect the main site and people should we aware of any experiments happening. e.g. Threshold CV experiment

What typically should not be featured

  1. Posts that are irrelevant.

    • They include highly downvoted tag burninations (not partially downvoted), synonyms request.
  2. Questions raised on actions taken by mods on questions

    • They are actions taken by mods and don't need feedback from regular users. Only mods need to see these posts and do what they have to. e.g. ,
  3. Bugs
    • They also, don't need any feedback from the community. The bug's seriousness can be validated by meta regulars and then they just need the attention from the SO staff, they are regular on meta. e.g.
  4. Subjective questions

    • These questions arise during special events that are not relevant to the community as a whole. They are time-consuming and are based on subjective analysis. Posts like used to make it regularly it HMP. e.g. How to better focus my time as an answerer?, Why was my answer downvoted?
  5. Support questions

If you think that your question should be featured

Flag for mod attention and be specific as to why you want this post to be featured. In detail here


P.S: Help maintain this list as I'm not sure that I have covered every category, some may be wrong too. Edits are required.

7
  • 18
    given that this is the only answer that doesn't try to mimic what the HMP did, I'm bound to up vote it but you are so vague on what makes a post in need of judgment, attention or feedback that it is hardly actionable, not by a mod nor the meta regulars. And featuring all posts with low views and low score is not enough to bring down a set of candidates enough to hand pick one or two and feature them. Please elaborate a bit more, give it some more brain-time and then update to something a bit more concrete.
    – rene
    Commented Jul 24, 2019 at 16:27
  • 1
    @Joshua any reason for "questions raised on actions taken by mods on questions" being given the top priority than other types of questions? They do not need to be in HMP as the user just needs clarification from mods that why was this step taken? or anything else that fits.
    – weegee
    Commented Jul 25, 2019 at 15:38
  • 1
    I feel that manually emulating the old behavior in a permanent link is better than this solution. As a user at the 30th percentile of involvement, I care about the quality of the site, but don't know all the rules. Reading the "dumb" questions that someone "ought to look up" has taught me much about the stack overflow community. Commented Jul 30, 2019 at 13:55
  • @JosiahYoder This criterion is created by taking into respect the reason for the drastic change that took place. Yes, we should aware users about meta and what is going on meta I agree but now we have to stick with what's left and accept the change and the reason for it
    – weegee
    Commented Jul 30, 2019 at 14:35
  • 1
    @weegee I'm reading between the lines here, but I thought the reason for canceling Meta was because of unconstructive conversation about the massive changes with the SO company, not because newbie questions were unconstructive. Perhaps I missed something. Commented Jul 30, 2019 at 15:51
  • They did not “cancel meta” and no thats not the core reason for the removal of HMP. I suggest you read the actual post that tells about the change @JosiahYoder
    – weegee
    Commented Jul 30, 2019 at 15:53
  • 1
    @weegee I did just before my previous post. Sorry, I meant cancelling HMP, not Meta. All I could find was "Lots of things are taking attention away from tag requests, moderators explaining actions taken, and similar things." To me (and what do I know?), newbie questions may fall under similar things or moderators explaining actions. Commented Jul 30, 2019 at 16:08
314
votes

Create a script that automatically features posts based on views and votes.

SE basically gave control of the featured posts to the community, while removing the Hot Meta Posts at the same time. The community response to this was pretty clear, so let's just reimplement the same feature using the tag. Of course, this does not bar any other proposals for mods featuring content manually.


This suggestion was brought up by numerous people in different threads, so here is the option to vote on it. Details of the algorithm should be debated in a second question if people agree with it. If such a script is created, I believe it should be open source, e.g. hosted in a public github.

15
  • 9
    That sounds good and if we can still have posts manually flagged and remove the feature tag on specific posts if people wish.
    – user3956566
    Commented Jul 24, 2019 at 12:28
  • 116
    I upvoted this. I'd like for whatever criteria we settle upon to be 100% open and transparent.
    – Magisch
    Commented Jul 24, 2019 at 12:31
  • My only concern is the bumps this will make to those posts in the active tab/meta home, but if rotated once every two hour or less often that shouldn't be a real problem at all.
    – Tensibai
    Commented Jul 24, 2019 at 13:01
  • 1
    @Tensibai one solution would be to simply not bump a post when only the featured tag is added/removed. If SE is interested in implementing this for us is another question though.
    – l4mpi
    Commented Jul 24, 2019 at 13:10
  • 9
    Simply re-implementing Hot after SE basically said "the Hot algorithm is picking bad posts a lot of the time, we want this feature to be manually controlled" seems like an ... aggressive move. You might disagree with the removal of Hot, but how do you think it will go if you effectively overrule that decision? IMO the right path now is commit to manual control of the list, and discuss what human-based critieria/processes should be applied.
    – Blorgbeard
    Commented Jul 25, 2019 at 22:24
  • Please keep the comments to clarifications on the answer and objections to the answer; it looks like it went into an extended discussion about factors outside this answer; and for that your best bet is to post an answer or to post a new Meta question.
    – George Stocker Mod
    Commented Jul 29, 2019 at 19:18
  • 8
    A clarification for this answer: Using a script to assist with the feature tag would not be turning featured into "the new HMP" because moderators would have complete oversight (they could remove posts without having to close them, for example), and would be able to tweak the algorithm, with flexible criteria, at will.
    – forest
    Commented Jul 30, 2019 at 2:23
  • 7
    I haven't seen SE complaining about old selection algorithm. Rather opposite, it looks like they just don't worry about it. Which would be understandable, given that as explained in my answer the evidence suggests that algorithm is sensible. It is possible that they simply want more control over the selected content - which also would be understandable given their recent study of the impact of changes made to HNQ
    – gnat
    Commented Jul 30, 2019 at 7:10
  • 8
    @Blorgbeard Hey, if SO staff wanna play bureaucrats they can have all the plotholes that come with it, which may include mod "conveniently" featuring hot posts. Community votes are human based, so I don't see the issue.
    – lucasgcb
    Commented Jul 30, 2019 at 7:31
  • @lucasgcb my point is that SO staff have made their requirements clear, and at the end of the day they are in charge. If we try to be clever and exploit a loophole in their instructions, how do you suppose they will react? "Oh, I should have been more clear, oh well, nothing I can do now"?
    – Blorgbeard
    Commented Jul 30, 2019 at 15:27
  • 7
    @Blorgbeard well, no SE have not made their requirements clear at all. At least, I don't quite get the causal link between "SE employees have nightmares from having to interact with meta" and "let's remove the HMQs and instead have mods feature posts". And if SE expresses any concrete requirements, these can either be handled by the script (if automatable) or manually handled by moderators - which would be exception handlers for the featured list in any case.
    – l4mpi
    Commented Jul 30, 2019 at 15:37
  • 3
    @Blorgbeard: If SE didn't want us doing something like this, they should have consulted with us before shooting HMP in the head (even if only to give us time to come up with some manual process). The fact that they chose not to do so makes me extremely unsympathetic towards this sort of post-hoc rationalization of their position.
    – Kevin
    Commented Jul 30, 2019 at 20:50
  • I'm not talking about whether their decision makes sense, or is justified. My point is that it's their decision - it is their website. Any decision-making power that was given to the mods/community can be retracted at any time for any (or no) reason. So this combative attitude ("if they didn't want us doing ... they should have consulted") does not reflect the actual power-balance in the relationship between SE and the community. See: meta.stackoverflow.com/questions/387651
    – Blorgbeard
    Commented Jul 30, 2019 at 21:12
  • 5
    @Blorgbeard: Yes, they can do that. But for now, they have dumped the entire problem in the mods' collective lap with no warning, and with the expectation that the mods would "just deal with it." That will not fly, and we need to communicate such as clearly as possible.
    – Kevin
    Commented Jul 30, 2019 at 21:25
  • 5
    @Blorgbeard restating my earlier comment: once SE sets any actionable rules about which posts to feature or not feature, these can be integrated in the script. If they don't do so, well, then that would be their fault and not ours.
    – l4mpi
    Commented Jul 31, 2019 at 8:34
38
votes

I'd imagine something that does not rely on individual mods making editorial choices would be prudent, something like

a post that has

  • x many votes (maybe a net score of +5 or so?)
  • y many views (maybe 40-45 or so?)
  • z many featured flags (maybe at least 2 or 3?)

gets to be featured for either

  • x fixed time (maybe a flat week to weed out unequal attention due to activity windows?)
  • until superseded by another post in the y slots (seem to be 5 slots presently, reduced by blog posts and featured MSE posts)
  • for at least x time and then when superseded by another post in the y slots. (maybe for at least 3-4 days, or 4-5 days when featured on a weekend)

Obviously, the moderators can and should still exercise discretion and disallow obvious gaming of the new rules, but I think that it would be a tall order to ask our moderators to exercise full editorial control over the content of featured meta posts.

Not only would it break one of the oldest paradigms of SE moderation, namely that moderators do not need subject matter expertise, but it would open them up to all sorts of criticism and accusations of bias. I'm sure they get enough of these as is without us further fueling the fire. The more concrete and less subjective the policy for featured tag use becomes, the less attack surface is created to attack the moderator team.

6
  • 5
    @YvetteColomb As per Shog's Explaination, we get at least 1 featured spot, but only one is guaranteed. The ordinary maximum of spots in the bulletin is 4, but 1 featured spot is guaranteed. Meaning with the current situation, having a blog post, two featured MSE questions and 4 featured MSO questions, 2 featured MSO questions are truncated, presumably by age of featuring.
    – Magisch
    Commented Jul 24, 2019 at 12:41
  • 10
    We should also look at an option to define "hot" as being something heavily discussed and therefore possibly with lots of downvotes. The announcement to this change certainly deserves to be "hot", but it wouldn't meet the "net score of +5" requirement. Looking at the "total votes per hour" or something like that might be a better indicator for "hotness".
    – Secespitus
    Commented Jul 24, 2019 at 12:52
  • 4
    Echoing @Secespitus, considering how votes work on meta, wouldn't it be better to count the total number of votes? Meaning that -0/10, -10/0 and -5/5 posts all would be seen as equally important.
    – AkselA
    Commented Jul 25, 2019 at 11:08
  • 1
    @AkselA That would indiscriminately feature all the unremarkable highly downvoted questions.
    – duplode
    Commented Jul 25, 2019 at 12:02
  • @duplode: And all the unremarkable highly upvoted questions. Obviously we need further criteria.
    – AkselA
    Commented Jul 25, 2019 at 12:05
  • 1
    @AkselA I think the highly upvoted questions are quite more likely to be remarkable than highly downvoted ones. Although one with quite mixed reception (close number of downvotes and upvotes) is definitely remarkable and would probably warrant more people looking at it and weighing in.
    – VLAZ
    Commented Jul 25, 2019 at 19:58
20
votes

I would want that regular Stack Overflow users be well aware about meta - because it provides the most inclusive and powerful way to impact how site works:

most powerful moderation tool is given at really modest rep 5: participate in meta. This tool (if used wisely) allows one to even overrule decisions of diamond moderators and change the way how Stack Overflow operates - what can be more powerful than that?

In the past this was achieved by providing a convenient and easy to see sidebar reference to current interesting meta topics. Suggest that we stick with this way because I am not aware of a better way to do this.


In the past, selection of advertised meta topics was based on community rating expressed via votes. Suggest that we stick with this way - again, because I am not aware of a better way to do this.

Moderators can intervene here and correct possible mistakes in exceptional cases. (Part about moderators should be obvious for those familiar with how system works and I added it only to simplify reading for those who don't know.)


Suggest that selection of topics to advertise was based on clearly defined criteria which would be easy to check for regular users. This is to ensure that system works as intended and help quickly find possible mistakes.

On a surface, this may seem unimportant because it's easy to find and correct a single mistakenly selected post when it's widely advertised to SO sidebar. But if the very criteria is tilted suboptimally, we better have an efficient way to analyze and correct that, instead of wasting efforts on permanent manual corrections.


Given technical limitations of functionality available for above (specifically, absence of randomizing and overzealous caching of featured posts) I think that simplest technical solution would be to have a single permanently featured ("pinned") post referring visitors to regularly updated list of promoted meta topics.

For an example resembling what I have in mind, see features change log at MSE.

With regards to selection of topics for that list, a reasonable starting point is I think to use criteria for prior hot meta posts (as suggested in top answer). It is important to note that prior to removal, HMP were widely advertised at sidebar to tens thousands active SO users - day by day, year by year, for many years. And all these years nobody complained about it, neither about promoting bad posts, nor about hiding good ones. These years of a "silent approval" of such a highly visible feature make fairly solid evidence that algorithm is sensible.

Summing up, the old selection algorithm has proven to serve us fine for many years and if you take into account an option to edit out inappropriate references, it looks like a safe bet to use while we discuss and settle on possibly better criteria and procedure for selecting promoted topics.

4
  • 5
    The idea of a pinned features change log is a good idea.
    – user3956566
    Commented Jul 25, 2019 at 15:48
  • 2
    That quote from your answer doesn't seem all that accurate anymore.
    – Kevin B
    Commented Jul 26, 2019 at 19:19
  • 1
    well yeah @KevinB I've been pondering this myself when drafting this post, thinking maybe to keep only the part about mod decisions and cut the rest. In the end though I decided to add this quote, partly since one can argue that it applies because you can get bugfixes done through meta, and partly because one could point to last half year changes recorded in features log at MSE and insist that we're probably heading back to the times when this quote applied fully...
    – gnat
    Commented Jul 26, 2019 at 20:20
  • ...I'd rather revisit this in few months from now and cut that part of quote if MSE change log will show that negligence is back
    – gnat
    Commented Jul 26, 2019 at 20:20
15
votes

Whatever the criteria chosen to select posts - don't let the featured list stagnate: keep it fresh and dynamic.

Under the old system, the featured posts changed frequently enough that, even if recycling featured posts, most every day I would see something that would pique my interest, simply because the list was fairly dynamic.

In the last few days - granted a practice hasn't been established yet - the cycling has slowed. The same three or so posts have been featured over the last few days and I have already seen them. It feels like everyday is a slow meta day now when viewing the featured posts. The featured posts feel almost static.

My visits to meta are often triggered by a featured meta post, and from there I'll follow linked posts, check out new questions or active questions. The featured meta posts provided a springboard that allowed exploration into community dynamics, events, mores, and norms. A relatively frequently updated featured list reminded me that there is lots of discussion happening. Seeing this discussion helped create a greater sense of community.

The risks with manually choosing featured posts are that moderators might not want to bump the posts selected by other moderators too quickly (slowing cycling of topics), that moderators might not feature the extent of meta discussion that was previously promoted quasi-randomly (reducing scope of featured posts), and that infrequent meta visitors/users may not see as many or as diverse headlines as to what is happening on meta (making a visit less likely).

If a subset of the posts tagged featured are randomly selected periodically to be shown as featured, keep the list relatively large so that a wide range of titles is shown, albeit, two at a time, and they frequently change. Currently only three posts have the featured tag - this does not allow for much in the way of exposure to different topics and headlines.

3
  • 3
    I agree with this. In fact we've just left the last featured posts as is, I'm not sure we have an agreement yet of what to do with them. There is an issue with featured post being heavily cached, so it's not actually feasible to rotate them quickly. They can sit there for many hours after being unfeatured. We are also struggling for slots. There's a total of 4 and the blog uses these. So it's really not the same. I too was drawn into meta on the hot posts and the mod flags. I'm not sure, yet, what the solution is. Hence the question. A cyclic comment hey
    – user3956566
    Commented Jul 26, 2019 at 23:59
  • @YvetteColomb, if the caching is the same as previously that might be fine - the old featured list did rotate relatively well. The lack of slots is definitely a problem though. Commented Jul 27, 2019 at 17:14
  • 3
    since this whole thing started we became acutely aware of it and we were waiting what seemed like half a day for the post that had been removed from the featured posts to go from the side bar. Shog told us it was affected by 3 different caches iirc. And yeh basically having two net spots, there's not going to be anything like the hot posts again on here :/
    – user3956566
    Commented Jul 27, 2019 at 20:02
12
votes

Thing is about Meta, it's where to keep up with how the site works and what the current problems are. With HMP it was fairly easy to keep an eye on this without needing to go to the Meta listing. Someone else has also mentioned Meta's importance for initiating people new to the site in how the site works, which I also consider important.

For these reasons, I upvoted and support the Community Wiki suggestion (weegee's).

I really don't need to see the "how do I make my question better", "why was I down voted" and similar posts that occasionally made it to HMP. Regardless of the number of views or votes, those don't carry information important to using or maintaining the site.

What could be helpful/useful would be a button that allows Meta readers to vote for featuring (or not) a Question - separate from the current upvote/downvote. That would give the moderators some guidance in their decision about what the community considers worthy of advertising on the side-bar.

2
  • 1
    As a user at the 30th percentile of active users, I DO need to see "how do I make my question better" sorts of questions -- or I did in the first few years. That's how I learn the rules (both written and cultural) of operating within the site. Commented Jul 30, 2019 at 14:04
  • @JosiahYoder you can visit numerous existing threads on meta for that. Also, what about other people who don’t need to see that?
    – weegee
    Commented Aug 3, 2019 at 6:47
4
votes

I want a userscript that puts a little box called "Hot Meta Posts" below "Featured on Meta" on the right-hand side of the screen. The box should contain posts that would have met the criteria of Hot Meta Posts had the feature not been removed.

Even if this only affects "0.015%" of users, I'd still want it, because those links were convenient to me.

7
  • I believe you mean 0.015% and it is unclear how that number was calculated. Commented Jul 30, 2019 at 13:51
  • @JosiahYoder Please take a look.
    – S.S. Anne
    Commented Jul 31, 2019 at 12:59
  • Thanks for your edit. On the first paragraph, I don't feel I can support the userscript solution because most users would still not see it. Perhaps you could also add that one of the four links includes simple, newbie-friendly instructions for how to install the userscript. Commented Jul 31, 2019 at 13:23
  • @JosiahYoder Active meta users liked the feature, and I like it too. There's no way to get the "real thing" back, but this is probably the best way for users that used HMP
    – S.S. Anne
    Commented Jul 31, 2019 at 13:25
  • As a non-meta user, I relate to your statement that you liked it too. But I don't feel this addresses the larger concern of Meta being hidden from new and less-connected users. Commented Jul 31, 2019 at 13:30
  • @JosiahYoder Honestly, I don't think "new and less-connected users" care all that much. They just want answers to their questions.
    – S.S. Anne
    Commented Jul 31, 2019 at 13:32
  • It appears a solution nearly identical to yours has gained much attention. All users were once new users. We don't know which ones care and which ones don't. Commented Jul 31, 2019 at 13:35
-8
votes

Have a way for the Featured Posts to be different for established users vs brand new users. For example if a new user gets a number of questions closed right away they are most often duplicates or poorly asked and the list might include a link to https://stackoverflow.com/help/minimal-reproducible-example or a post on how to find things easier/more effectively. For long term users it might not have those type of "interesting" links but something more catered to them.

4
  • 1
    I don't think that this would be very helpful. Relevant links to the help center like that one are already included in the close reasons where it applies, so it would just be redundant information. If the user isn't looking to improve their question based on the feedback given directly in the closure, I doubt they'll be looking to improve it based on more general posts in the sidebar.
    – Davy M
    Commented Jul 29, 2019 at 19:24
  • Given the number of questions from new or infrequent users that do not really meet that criteria, it seems to not be working a it is now. Anything to get new users eyes on that might be good. Commented Jul 29, 2019 at 20:42
  • 1
    We have an entire wizard built for helping people write a well structured question. Both the wizard and the traditional view contain explicit links to "minimal, reproducible example" and other help pages. The tour does as well. Every page contains a link to the help center. Then there are the close reasons I already mentioned. I wholeheartedly agree that it's not working as it is now, but I can't support the idea that just adding another link is any different from what we already have that's not working.
    – Davy M
    Commented Jul 29, 2019 at 22:17
  • I don't see how this answer the question, which is about telling the mods how to use Featured Posts. This answer proposes something that would almost certainly require changes from the SO developers, i.e., not something the mods can do.
    – npostavs
    Commented Jul 31, 2019 at 23:52
-8
votes

Let's use statistics and AI!

Imagine this:

  • An algorithm chooses some posts as featured.
  • The algorithm logs what users do, after having clicked on a featured link.
    • The user posts an answer, a comment or edits the question/answers? Let's enforce the choosing of similar posts.
    • The user leaves the page right away, votes down or flags? Let our algorithm learn not to choose similar posts again.
  • Next time the algorithm will choose posts, whose combinations of tags, texts and existing votest/posts look promising to it.
-9
votes

After reading the debates I decided to post yet another idea.

Make two or three or four different userscripts that rebuild the HMP based on either the browser endpoint (https://meta.stackoverflow.com/?tab=hot) or the API endpoint with slightly differing filtering criteria as different people have different ideas what HMP is for.

Kudos to NobodyNada for the root suggestion for this idea. I thought a bot would have to do active tracking but nope it's already implemented.

After the first one is written, varying filters won't be hard.

5
  • 12
    I'm not a fan of a userscript because only active Meta users would take the time to install it -- and these users would see the posts anyway, even without a userscript. Hot Meta Posts is valuable because that sidebar is seen by the entire SO community, not just the .015%.
    – NobodyNada
    Commented Jul 26, 2019 at 20:51
  • 2
    @NobodyNada: I can't say that I blame you but we're running thin on good options.
    – Joshua
    Commented Jul 26, 2019 at 20:52
  • 1
    @NobodyNada It is unclear how the number 0.015% was calculated Commented Jul 30, 2019 at 14:01
  • 2
    @JosiahYoder The exact percentage isn't really relevant here -- my point is that Hot Meta Posts is a way to reach the broader Stack Overflow community, not just the small percentage that browse Meta regularly.
    – NobodyNada
    Commented Jul 31, 2019 at 15:25
  • @NobodyNada I like that way of putting it. I don't browse Meta regularly, but I like to see hot meta posts to get a sense for how the community works. Commented Jul 31, 2019 at 15:28
-23
votes

We elected moderators to be human exception handlers and to show good judgement. If community moderation could be reduced to an algorithm there would be no justice.

As Moderators, our focus for meta is:

  • To ensure that issues salient to Stack Overflow (the programmer community) are discussed, debated, and resolved.
  • Raise issues that help ensure the community remains healthy.
  • Promote issues that need promoting to ensure we have a healthy community.

To this end, part of electing us means trusting that we're going to do that, and of course if we don't you should raise an issue on meta and raise awareness for it.

Now that top-down company feedback won't be raised on meta (by and large) that means that we're watching for content from you, the community, that meets the following criteria:

  • Has wide community interest
  • Needs community input
  • Publication on the "Featured" is the best way to raise awareness of the issue.
  • prioritized against the other featured items (in terms of age, topic, amount of 'weighing in' the community has done), still should be featured

That means that it'll be a manual process using our judgment. If you'd like to raise an issue for featuring; then you should take the following actions:

  • flag the post with a custom moderator flag; detailing why you want it featured. Something like:

This should be added to the featured list because it affects a large portion of the community and needs community input

Once we've featured an item, we'll continue to manually keep items featured or de-featured them depending on circumstances. For instance, the Facebook post was 'de-featured' because several pressing items (not the least of which is the post that necessitated this question) came up, and its priority fell below that (and it had been around for two months, had a Meta.SE sibling, and had based on its views and votes had been seen by a significant portion of the community).

If you feel like a post has been de-featured prematurely, feel free to raise a flag and explain why you believe it should be re-featured.

10
  • 11
    This feels like a "This is definitively how this will 100% definitely be handled, regardless of how the community feels about the other answers here" rather than a suggestion for how things should be prioritized according to what the community wants. Is that how you'd intended this answer to come across?
    – Kendra
    Commented Jul 29, 2019 at 19:38
  • @Kendra Without talking to other moderators, I can't say definitively what we're going to do. I will say that at this moment the above process is our process (by default). I will say that we need to talk internally, because there are definite problems with the highest voted answers on this post that keep them from being viable solutions.
    – George Stocker Mod
    Commented Jul 29, 2019 at 19:39
  • 1
    Just wanted to verify if that was the case. I didn't feel like this question itself was at a "resolved" state, so your answer was a bit jarring with how it read to me. Thank you for the clarification. (That also might be part of the reason for the downvotes, were I to guess. I hadn't voted yet, in case this was the case.)
    – Kendra
    Commented Jul 29, 2019 at 19:41
  • 1
    @GeorgeStocker Is there anything that keeps weegee's answer from being viable? Quibbles about the categories there aside, it is merely an attempt at setting community standards about which kinds of things should be flagged for featuring. As far as I can see, that is compatible with what you are saying here.
    – duplode
    Commented Jul 29, 2019 at 22:26
  • 4
    Statements like "That means that it'll be a manual process using our judgment." read as this is the final judgement of the moderators no matter what the community says and is now implemented (with the rest of the answers from the community here being disregarded) if this is not your intent I would re-word this answer (the rest of the post also has a declaration/authoritative tone that seems dismissive of community feedback and also seems to ignore the tone, at least from what I've read, from several other mods) Commented Jul 30, 2019 at 1:56
  • 3
    You're not really addressing any of the points brought up by Bhargav here, so IMO this answer is not very useful.
    – l4mpi
    Commented Jul 30, 2019 at 13:58
  • I would put large bold letters stating "This is our current process until we figure out something better" at the top of this answer. Commented Jul 30, 2019 at 14:00
  • 4
    "[...] there are definite problems with the highest voted answers on this post that keep them from being viable solutions" - then please write an answer detailling these problems so that we can keep them in mind when creating the solution.
    – l4mpi
    Commented Jul 30, 2019 at 14:08
  • I'm not sure how algorithmic assistance would ever be in a position to override direct moderator actions.
    – forest
    Commented Aug 2, 2019 at 5:16
  • One quick question: How often are elections held?
    – S.S. Anne
    Commented Aug 5, 2019 at 2:50