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Inspired by Number of "User was removed" increasing rapidly I would like to simply ask why do people go through the trouble of creating voting rings?

What benefit does it bring them? Do these rings sell their voting services to new users that ask bad questions?

Am I missing something obvious? Are these rings being used in ingenious ways?

I understand the reasoning behind the efforts to remove and mitigate this issue but I am curious to know the transgressor's motive for doing this in the first place.

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    I won't and I don't think other moderators would go into details as to why people try to defraud Stack Overflow. We don't always know for certain what their motivations are, and I really don't want to go give people ideas either. We catch most cases pretty quickly, but I don't want to encourage anyone with grand ideas either.
    – Martijn Pieters Mod
    Commented Sep 5, 2018 at 14:54
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    Fortunately we've added "new member" icon for questions posted by sock puppets, so everyone will be sure to follow the Be Nice policy towards them. Remember -- the sock puppet is new here and we need to welcome it and help it understand SO voting ring policy.
    – C8H10N4O2
    Commented Sep 7, 2018 at 16:34
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    @C8H10N4O2: remember, without moderator tools you cannot ever be sure that an account is a sock puppet. Leave handling such accounts to moderators, flag and don’t engage.
    – Martijn Pieters Mod
    Commented Sep 9, 2018 at 9:32

3 Answers 3

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I've handled thousands if not tens of thousands of sock puppets over the years, and some patterns do emerge from their behavior. The single most popular reason for people to coordinate voting on this site is to evade question bans. People who rely on this site to do their job will do whatever it takes to keep asking questions here. Even accounting for size, Stack Overflow sees far more instances of voting fraud than any other site on the network, and this is why.

Beyond evading question bans, in certain industries located in specific parts of the world, it is assumed that you will vote for your coworkers or your boss in order to elevate them. We have been told that some companies even teach new employees, formally or informally, how to create sock puppets or participate in voting rings. In these cases, that again is largely used to evade question bans.

Having a higher Stack Overflow reputation is a boost in some job markets, I've heard, but that mostly isn't the case. Some people can assume this is true and use puppets or rings to boost themselves in pursuit of this. That largely backfires once all their fraudulent votes are invalidated. One consulting company listed all their employees' Stack Overflow profiles on their front page, and became quite upset with us when they all were suspended at the same time. I imagine that didn't help them get clients.

For non-moderators, I know there's this impression that sock puppet operators are criminal masterminds, but when you look behind the scenes you realize just how lazy people are. This morning alone, I removed three sock puppets that had the exact same name as their primary account. When the driving factor is to evade question bans, which are in general triggered by a lack of effort, you can guess how much time they'll put into covering their tracks.

Every now and then, we will get a case where someone built a larger and more sophisticated network of puppets. I've found that half the time these tend to be connected to spam in some way (subtle promotion of products or platforms hidden in otherwise innocuous questions and answers). The other half, it's someone who decided to spend a little more time inflating their reputation. Once all the votes are invalidated, that time is wasted.

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    "One consulting company listed all their employees' Stack Overflow profiles on their front page, and became quite upset with us when they all were suspended at the same time." - haha.. aha.. AHAHAHAHAHAHA
    – Mysticial
    Commented Sep 5, 2018 at 16:09
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    I am curious to know how many reputations has reached the most ingenious voting rings before it was disassembled. As a side note, why we don't add any warning somewhere on the site to new users about such things, it can probably reduce such behavior Commented Sep 5, 2018 at 21:13
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    @TemaniAfif - Largest set of sock puppets I've handled amassed 10k in reputation for the central account before that was dismantled. That was years ago, and we have better tools for catching these earlier now. I don't think we need to have explicit warnings for "don't cheat the voting system", because that's just common sense. The people doing this aren't going to bother paying attention to any guidelines in help or elsewhere. Some just-in-time warnings by the system if someone starts targeting votes at another person might be something worth exploring, and I know that's been proposed before.
    – Brad Larson Mod
    Commented Sep 5, 2018 at 21:40
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    @BradLarson This one? meta.stackexchange.com/questions/178714/…
    – Mysticial
    Commented Sep 5, 2018 at 21:42
  • I have a related question, but it can probably be answered yes/no so not worth posting a new question - Why would people in rings bother to vote for others - is it to try to "camouflage"? Commented Sep 7, 2018 at 8:44
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    @NickCardoso meta.stackoverflow.com/a/373575/7147233 Commented Sep 7, 2018 at 8:47
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    "Once all the votes are invalidated, that time is wasted." And so is the moderators' time...
    – TDG
    Commented Sep 7, 2018 at 15:36
  • If they've put a little more energy in contributing instead of contrabanding SO theire Rep would go up naturally... Commented Sep 7, 2018 at 15:42
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    Clearly sock puppeteers need to spend more time training AIs to gain rep by giving legitimate and helpful answers to basic questions and maybe even participate in simple tasks like flagging spam. xkcd.com/810
    – JDB
    Commented Sep 7, 2018 at 15:45
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    @PatrickArtner Honestly, the consulting company anecdote made me smile from ear-to-ear and probably makes all the moderator efforts worth it.
    – MonkeyZeus
    Commented Sep 7, 2018 at 15:49
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    I don't know if you are watching also tor external nodes, or the SE does it, but if you don't do, I suggest to do it.
    – peterh
    Commented Sep 7, 2018 at 18:12
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    @BradLarson Thank you for your continuing work towards keeping Stack Overflow clean. Commented Sep 7, 2018 at 22:57
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    @TDG: i volunteered for the job, and there is satisfaction in cleaning this kind of stuff up. I keep telling myself that every time I slog through a large pile of plagiarised answers...
    – Martijn Pieters Mod
    Commented Sep 9, 2018 at 9:39
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    @TDG - Like when dealing with trolls, as long as the time invested by moderators is miniscule in comparison to the effort they put in, the balance works in our favor. We can destroy a puppet ring in minutes that they spent days or months assembling. We can delete troll accounts in seconds and block network access that may take them a half hour to work around and recreate. If we add just enough friction to make this not worth their while, we see that people quickly lose interest and stop.
    – Brad Larson Mod
    Commented Sep 10, 2018 at 14:46
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Stack Overflow uses Gamification as a mechanism to encourage participation. Voting rings are basically like people who cheat at games. The goal of any cheater is to win the game, regardless of whether such a victory serves the purpose of the game itself.

Thus, the goal of voting rings is to win the game. To get more upvotes and rep than other people, without having to actually know things or otherwise meaningfully contribute to the goals of the site.

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  • "The goal of any cheater is to win the game, regardless of whether such a victory serves the purpose of the game itself." yep. This is nicely evidenced by the fact that people use aimbots to win at online FPSes, despite there being no money at stake and the aimbot rendering the game (and the victory) meaningless.
    – Mark Amery
    Commented Sep 7, 2018 at 15:35
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Honestly, they likely just think they'll be the ones smart enough to get away with it, and get out of a ban, or get a lot of rep to impress potential employers, or even just get enough rep to do some thing or another on a site.

Otherwise, maybe they're bored. Or maybe they're hoping that their nefarious deeds will give them some sort of leverage to ruin "that evil Stack Overflow site" or something.

And in still more cases, they don't even realize they're doing something wrong- It's just a group of friends or coworkers upvoting each other's posts without knowing they shouldn't do that.


Honestly, we can't know for sure. These users aren't likely to tell us, unless they fall into that last category I mentioned above. All we can do is guess. This is like asking why people break laws when they know if they get caught they'll go to jail or pay a fine, and not breaking the law takes less effort than breaking it and not getting caught.

I'm sure there are sites out there where you can arrange a voting ring. I've heard of sites where someone will use your account to post good posts, getting you rep so when you get the account back, you've got whatever you want. A site to arrange a voting ring, for pay or otherwise, doesn't seem that far-fetched.

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  • In the case of law breaking, there are potential tangible benefits you can point at, or behavioural causes.
    – Raedwald
    Commented Sep 5, 2018 at 16:17
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    And in the case of voting rings, there are potential benefits you can point at, or behavioral causes: More rep, looking better to employers (potentially), extra unlocked privileges, getting out of a question ban.
    – Kendra
    Commented Sep 5, 2018 at 16:18

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