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I just answered this rather confusing question here on meta:

Why did SO ban me from asking questions for asking a "poor" question when i copied exactly the same question that was asked at least four other times in SO? IIf it was so poor a question that it can get someone banned, I would think the other identical questions would have been notated as "poor" or something.

It turns out, he was talking about the list that's displayed when you type in a title while asking:

Questions that may already have your answer ...

Now, you & I both realize that all of those questions are notated as "poor": they have negative numbers before them and "[closed]" after them. But... Perhaps this isn't always so readily apparent to folks new to the system.

In which case, this is actually something of a broken window.

Can we just filter out questions that are downvoted, closed, or both from this list?

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  • 9
    A question that is downvoted may still be useful to someone (maybe with a score of no less than -1, and even that depends on the tag), and duplicates aren't the worst thing to see in that list. What kind of thresholds did you have in mind?
    – Makoto
    Commented Sep 24, 2016 at 2:39
  • 2
    Duplicates are probably a good exception here, @Makoto. Otherwise, I'd say if it's closed and scores <= 0, don't list it. I'll see about gathering some data on what questions get hit from this next week, but as a gut-check this seems reasonable.
    – Shog9
    Commented Sep 24, 2016 at 2:41
  • 36
    Maybe add a "similar questions that were not well received" section. Or mark low quality questions in the list with red instead of green. It seems like hinting at quality is better than letting them post without warning.
    – davidism
    Commented Sep 24, 2016 at 2:57
  • 16
    Heh, that'd actually be a good quality-check all on its own, @davidism - if the top 6 related questions are all negatively-received, just block it outright.
    – Shog9
    Commented Sep 24, 2016 at 3:01
  • 7
    if you decide to show them red or somehow else prominently hinting that these are inappropriate (FWIW I support what was proposed by @davidism) please please make sure that closed questions are shown as "bad" ones no matter how high their score is. Closed is much more reliable indicator of question being bad, much more reliable than score (The Trouble With Popularity)
    – gnat
    Commented Sep 24, 2016 at 3:58
  • 1
    Related MSE feature request meta.stackexchange.com/q/280668/178816
    – Travis J
    Commented Sep 24, 2016 at 4:02
  • Any work on the question list feature would be welcome in my opinion.
    – Travis J
    Commented Sep 24, 2016 at 4:03
  • 1
    Well, since it topic is "that may already have your answer" shouldn't the answers be respected as well? If a poor question has a good answer (score >= 1 and accepted or whatever), then it still should be checked by OP if it already contains what (s)he's looking for. Marking it red, might prevent that.
    – Tom
    Commented Sep 24, 2016 at 8:44
  • 10
    I think you need to be very careful to use only colour to mark something as "bad". For example I've been told that in China red simple means "good luck" and doesn't have the same meaning as it does for Americans/Europeans. Also, some people are colour blind, and may not notice the difference in colour, especially various forms of red/green colour blindness (dichromacy) can be quite common in some populations. Commented Sep 24, 2016 at 13:34
  • meta-meta.stackoverflow? Commented Jul 18, 2018 at 15:21

6 Answers 6

16

We've implemented a new warning that bounces off some of the ideas in this question. Essentially, we're going to count the number of closed and the number of deleted questions that show up in the similar questions results after typing a title. If there are too many of them, the user will see this brand new warning:

Questions with similar titles have frequently been downvoted and/or closed. Consider using a title that more accurately describes your question.

The formula used: (downvoted + closed) / total > 0.25

The 0.25 is a site setting that can be changed depending on how often users see this warning (keeping in mind that a closed and downvoted question will count twice). By default, this will be off on all sites. We're only enabling it on Stack Overflow for the moment.

For now, this is also only a warning that will not actually prevent submitting the question with the given title. Depending on how this affects user asking behavior, we may consider a second setting that, when hit, forbids posting the question altogether until the title is changed.

Will be live shortly.

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    I feel that this may be a very timid solution, although in the right direction. Maybe is time of gathering more data about what users do/see when asking a question.
    – Braiam
    Commented May 5, 2017 at 17:49
  • 5
    While you are working in that space, would it be possible to consider tags in the similar questions search? Please?
    – Travis J
    Commented May 5, 2017 at 19:37
48

My biggest concern about entirely eliminating these poor/closed questions from the "dupe checker" is that it will only increase the likelihood that these [poor | closed] questions will be asked again and again.

If the author's (poor) question has already been closed many many times, why not just make it clearer (in the UI) that their question will not likely be well-received again… so they don't keep asking it over and over.

UI suggestion — Make it clearer their (duplicate) question stinks

By striking out those closed posts, it becomes harder to claim "I copied exactly the same question that was asked at least four other times in SO."

Dupe checking is simply a just-in-time way for the author to realize their question in may have been asked before. By hiding those closed or poor examples from that list, we are inadvertently eliminating questions the author should be looking at before they hit that submit button. If they are a dupe, those "poor examples" will likely have useful commentary about why their question might (potentially) not be well received.

If users see the dupe checker as a validation of what they can ask, that is a failure of the UI ← Fix that!

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    "Your question has been asked many many times, and therefore is allowed" is what everyone sees.
    – Braiam
    Commented Sep 24, 2016 at 17:18
  • 11
    However, a question titled "what's wrong with this code please" is very likely not a duplicate of another question titled "please help me with this code".
    – Tunaki
    Commented Sep 24, 2016 at 17:33
  • 2
    @Tunaki: So? It very likely is another question with the exact same lack of quality, which we should be using to inform the asker-in-potential.
    – Ben Voigt
    Commented Sep 24, 2016 at 18:41
  • 5
    "only increase the likelihood that these [poor | closed] questions will be asked again and again. " how about if we actually test it before making conclusions. Data driven development FTW?
    – Braiam
    Commented Sep 24, 2016 at 18:45
  • 7
    @Braiam: How about not reworking the entire system on the complaint of one troll? (Yes, he's trolling; his comments have made clear that not one single thing he said in his meta question was actually accurate)
    – Ben Voigt
    Commented Sep 25, 2016 at 1:27
  • 4
    @BenVoigt Shog is already suggesting a change, I only say that if we're doing it, at least do it right.
    – Braiam
    Commented Sep 25, 2016 at 2:49
  • Couldn't agree more with your answer. The only thing needs changing is that title, to "Similar questions have been asked and answered so you might not have to ask yours!" or "Similar questions have been asked and answered, please study them before asking yours!"
    – Will Ness
    Commented Sep 26, 2016 at 13:45
  • 3
    UI sketch in rev 13 looks good, although it can be improved if you find a way to fit this image into it
    – gnat
    Commented Sep 26, 2016 at 16:27
26

I'm going to take a bit of a contrarian view. The type of user who sees that list of questions and waves it around as an invitation to post more without ever viewing any needs more than a "quick fix" before becoming part of our community. They don't have the attention to detail which programming requires. Even if they are pointed to resources, they ignore them. A user actually trying to learn from their mistake would visit those questions without being told by a moderator, even if they did so too late (after having their new question closed).

Leave closed questions in the list for the sake of the users who take a hint from the fact that their question is more similar to trash than anything else on the site.

The one thing that I can see that needs some attention here is that "closed" doesn't unambiguously mean "trash". Other Q&A sites will mark a question "resolved" in the title once an answer is accepted -- closed can be confused with that. Or simply when a question becomes too old, especially on Q&A run by statistics-driven support departments.

So instead let's surface the reality. If those questions instead of "closed" said "[unacceptable: too broad]" or "[unacceptable: off-topic]", then no one would consider it an honest mistake for a user to point at them as evidence that asking more of the same is ok.

I still think a user should be responsible enough to actually take a look at the "most similar" questions and learn from others' successes or failures. But we can make the state clearer, so let's do so.

"Close(d)" is good terminology for the flag, and doesn't really matter to the post owner because they get an entire paragraph of accompanying explanation. It's not ideal for someone in the process of writing a question, so let's use different verbiage on the writing-a-question page (most likely for all question lists, both this list generated from the title and also the sidebar of related questions generated later from the question body).


In case it wasn't clear, don't put the "[unacceptable]" marking on questions closed as duplicate, we've long recognized that their status is unique among close reasons and they already get distinct marking.

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    We probably wouldn't even need the word "unacceptable" in there; just labeling the questions [off-topic], [unclear] or [too broad] should signal their badness clearly enough. Commented Sep 25, 2016 at 1:00
  • 2
    @IlmariKaronen: By that same argument, [closed] and a negative score should have signaled badness... we're explicitly looking for ways to be more explicit, and not require the user to infer that "off topic" implies unacceptable.
    – Ben Voigt
    Commented Sep 25, 2016 at 1:11
  • 7
    The problem, as Shog notes, is that "closed = bad" is Stack Exchange jargon. On many other sites, "closed" can mean "solved" or just "no longer active". Admittedly, "off-topic" is a bit jargonish too, but hopefully still less ambiguous. In any case, I would not object to including the "unacceptable" part in that specific suggested dupe list, but I don't think it would be a good idea to add it to all closed question titles in general (both because it's too verbose, and because its bluntness is likely to offend too many question askers and thus cause needless complaints). Commented Sep 25, 2016 at 1:19
  • @IlmariKaronen: I am specifically calling for (in the answer's last paragraph before the break) having different verbiage in lists shown during asking a question.
    – Ben Voigt
    Commented Sep 25, 2016 at 1:25
  • Ah, OK. You might want to phrase that a bit more clearly, then. Commented Sep 25, 2016 at 1:28
  • @IlmariKaronen: Elaborated. Does that clear it up for you?
    – Ben Voigt
    Commented Sep 25, 2016 at 1:31
  • A bit. I'm still not 100% sure what you mean by "good terminology for the flag", and it might not be obvious to all that the "entire paragraph of accompanying explanation" refers to the box shown under closed questions. (At least, I assume that's what you mean; I don't think I've ever had a question closed, so I'm not sure if question owners see something else too.) And what I was kind of hoping you'd clarify is whether you're proposing this change only for the Ask Question page, or for closed question titles in general. But it's probably pointless to keep picking this particular nit anyway. Commented Sep 25, 2016 at 1:41
  • @IlmariKaronen: It now says "so let's use different verbiage on the writing-a-question page". I'm not sure how anyone could think that means a global change.
    – Ben Voigt
    Commented Sep 25, 2016 at 1:42
  • 2
    The only real thing I disagree is with the labeling. Duplicates aside, if these questions are closed for any other reason, why should we bother differentiating them? If we had users that got the hint that your "what's wrong with this code" isn't all that well-received, we wouldn't have so many hits for it when it matches in a title.
    – Makoto
    Commented Sep 25, 2016 at 2:13
4

Yes, remove such poor questions from the list.
The whole purpose of that list is for the user to: (1) click on a few of the links, (2) discover that his problem has already been solved, and (3) not post a duplicate question.

Looking at your example, those titles are so utterly generic that it would be a miracle if the user was able to recognize his problem at the other end of one of those links.

Having poor questions in the "Questions that may" list severely cripples the utility of the list.



A related problem:

... i copied exactly the same question that was asked at least four other times in SO ...

We've clearly failed to psychically scar this user with the proper quailing terror of asking a duplicate question.

A bunch of question-links with essentially the same (completely non-SEO) title, hints that asking duplicates may be okay after all.

Removing poor questions from the "Questions that may" list is an easy way to reduce this problem as poor questions are more likely to share (useless, generic) titles.

2

Why not explicitly call out with an explanatory note. Either

a) Questions with titles similar to yours have been poorly received, check these ones out to make sure you're not falling into the same traps they did.

or

b) Here are some other well questions with well received answers that may be relevant to your question, check them out before asking yours.

One or other of these messages could be displayed depending on whether the similar question title matching algorithm comes up with poorly scored matches or highly scored matches.

If we simply remove all poorly scored questions we're missing an opportunity, however unlikely it is to be acted upon, to dissuade users from asking questions with titles along the lines of "I have a problem?" If we show them nothing at all (because there are no good questions with such a title) then they have nothing to go on.

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    "If we simply remove all poorly scored questions we're missing an opportunity" no we are not. SE doesn't delete anything anyways and we can use this data to block them outright from asking the question they are about to ask, as suggested elsewhere
    – Braiam
    Commented Sep 25, 2016 at 22:00
  • 3
    The object is to get the best possible questions out of people in the first place and not have to block them at all. Commented Sep 25, 2016 at 22:14
  • Quite backwards, they had the opportunity to search their question before they even typed the title and find a possible duplicated somewhere. Then the box is in just in case that wasn't enough.
    – Braiam
    Commented Sep 25, 2016 at 22:18
  • 1
    The point raised in this question is that they don't realise what that list of duplicates is for. Commented Sep 25, 2016 at 22:19
  • 1
    The purpose of that list is not to try and prevent every single type of bad question (a fool's errand). The purpose is one last gasp at helping a user find his answer before he posts. Don't try to shoehorn in extra complication at the expense of the primary function of this list. Note only will it make all the checks less effective, it will muddy the UI and even further confuse the user. Commented Sep 25, 2016 at 22:57
  • @BrockAdams Exactly how "what's wrong with this code" would help the user find his answer? You can't even be sure they are about the same language!
    – Braiam
    Commented Sep 26, 2016 at 10:49
  • @Braiam, that's entirely the point of my answer. Glad you agree; now go upvote it. ;) ... But this answer would make it even worse, by cluttering up the UI and attempting to get the user to check for two things instead of one. (And the user has already ignored several prompts about both at this point.) Commented Sep 26, 2016 at 15:57
-9

Don't show closed, downvoted questions in the “Questions that may already have your answer” list

How about if we delete more aggressively? I mean, if there's no examples that those questions are "fine" you effectively removed the broken window and made the site more cleaner overall. I say how about if we ignore the accepted vote when running the closedAbandoned and the RemoveDeadQuestions checks and move on?

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  • RemoveDeadQuestions only works if there are no answers (regardless of accepted status or not).
    – Tunaki
    Commented Sep 24, 2016 at 17:20
  • 1
    Probably related, maybe we should feed these questions to the quality filter so they are blocked outright.
    – Braiam
    Commented Sep 24, 2016 at 17:20
  • @Tunaki maybe we need another check that runs at the 60 days? Or that only takes into account if it's answered and has score > X?
    – Braiam
    Commented Sep 24, 2016 at 17:21

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