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I've read a lot of the discussion on Meta about how we no longer have "too minor" as a rejection reason for edits. It's because we think the cost (of reviewing them etc) is worth the gain (more readable posts, increased professional appearance of Stack Overflow).

That's great, but I'm sure that many of the very minor edits that come through the queue were not motivated by how much better SO would be if this were edited, but rather the rep from getting an approved edit.

Look at this one as an example:

https://stackoverflow.com/review/suggested-edits/5919444

Others I see regularly like this are where someone "K&R's" the indentation of code, or changes the odd 'i' to 'I'. If they really think this is improving the site, I'm all for supporting them and approving. But what I'd like to be able to do is check the "very minor edit" box, and thus have the improvement made, but it doesn't earn anyone any rep.

I suspect this would sort out who's improving posts because they need improvement and who's just making work for everyone to get rep, with the intended result being we get appropriate edits being approved, without people wasting time on improvements they don't genuinely care about.

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  • If such change can be combined with approval not counting against badges... (maybe even with single approve) Commented Oct 4, 2014 at 2:56
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    I imagine this would cause argument about what constitutes a "very minor edit". And the easiest solution to stopping rep-motiviated edits is to just not give rep for suggested edits. We already don't give rep for edits made by 2k+ rep users, but for some reason we do it for lower rep users even though their edits are on average of a lower quality.
    – Boann
    Commented Oct 4, 2014 at 4:32
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    I thought about the argument about the grey zone, but I think that in practice it becomes entirely "who cares!?". Does it really matter whether you got that 2 points for the edit you made? If it got judged as "very minor", just do more significant ones next time, if your motivation is rep rather than improving. If your motivation is improving the post, them just be glad your edit was approved: the post is better, who cares about 2 points. Commented Oct 4, 2014 at 4:35
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    "Who cares" indeed! As long as it's an improvement, why be stingy with the +2 rep? As others have mentioned, the benefit is cut off after hitting +2k rep, so clearly the rep is there (even for minor edits) to encourage editing by newer users so that they get the experience to write better quality edits in the future. If you make it frustrating and (seemingly) arbitrary, you're sending the wrong message. If you don't want to give rep to anyone for any edit, that's another matter. Commented Oct 4, 2014 at 6:34
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    My proposal is to give rep to folk who can show that they can edit posts in a way that substantially improves them, while still allowing for "tweaking around the edges". The current system encourages newer users to hunt down missing commas and reformat code arbitrarily just to get rep. This proposal is that during this pre 2k period, they should learn (by experience) what is an edit that improves a post and what is just tweaking. The benefit is in the encouraging newer users to actually use judgement, and in not subjecting edit-reviewers to "for the sake of rep" tweaks. Commented Oct 4, 2014 at 6:53
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    I understand where you're coming from, but if everyone's using a different yardstick to measure what's considered "substantial" then you create frustration on the part of the low-rep editors -- even those trying to do the right thing. IMO, review queues should only be concerned with approving improvements and rejecting things that don't. People in the review queue shouldn't be concerned with whether it might give rep to the recipient or not. Commented Oct 4, 2014 at 7:29
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    Character limits invite pollution of the "Just adding this to hit the character limit" type. And in a programming context, one character can be very important.
    – alexis
    Commented Oct 4, 2014 at 13:39
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    There is already a character limit on body edits, @AndréDaniel - folks love it. We don't enforce that for title edits because fixing even very minor typos in titles is still pretty important.
    – Shog9
    Commented Oct 4, 2014 at 15:25
  • @Shog9 my bad, didn't know about that.
    – user2629998
    Commented Oct 4, 2014 at 15:29

1 Answer 1

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No.

In fact, it was this exact feature-request that motivated the recent changes to how we handle review of "minor" edits:

  1. The meaning of "too minor" varies widely between individuals. Are trivial changes always too minor, or only too minor when they ignore other, more damning problems with the post? The edits you provide as examples illustrate this nicely - even the last one isn't problematic so much because it's minor but rather because it introduces more problems than it fixes!

  2. Implemented as you describe, it's nothing more than a rep-denial mechanism. "I like your edit, but not enough to reward you for making it". There's no way to enforce its use in cases that actually justify it, meaning the actual application is likely to be seen as capricious. See also #1...

It's worth noting, until we addressed that feature-request, this feature kinda already existed - there was a checkbox that let you apply a suggested edit (with additional edits), but mark it as "unhelpful" - which in practice meant that the edit was still applied, but the editor received no credit for it (neither reputation nor attribution). This feature was almost never used, which is just as well because...

  • It was really confusing for the editor to see his edit applied with someone else's name on it.

  • "Rep denial" mechanisms are always troublesome to explain. The best examples of this here are the daily reputation cap and Community Wiki, and you won't have to look hard to find examples of folks confused when they stopped getting reputation for upvotes due to either. Now imagine how much more confusing it would be if you could opt, when upvoting a post, to make your vote "rep-free" - that's essentially what we're talking about here.

  • It made no sense for edits that were actually harmful - the edit was still applied! Also, it didn't feed into the same systems as outright rejection, meaning in theory an unlimited number of edits could be "rejected" this way without blocking the editor.

  • The results violated the spirit - if not actually the letter - of our own attribution requirements.

With the revised system, things are much simpler:

Reject and Edit

If the edit is really so trivial that you don't think it was worthwhile, put your money (well, time) where your mouth is and make a less trivial edit via the "Reject and Edit" review option. The suggestion will be discarded and your edit will go live immediately. If that sounds like a lot of work, then maybe the edit wasn't all that trivial...

Note that a few additional changes to the default rejection reasons are due to roll out some time next week, which should help reduce confusion surrounding certain types of edits that were previously being rejected as "too minor" (but which should've been rejected for other reasons).

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    There's a not-so-subtle difference between "This edit does not help" and "This edit does not help, but the post really needs cleanup and I want to do it now!". That's most of the flak you got over that change on your referenced post. Commented Oct 4, 2014 at 15:27
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    And there's a (apparently really subtle) difference between "This edit helps but is small" and "This edit does not help", @Deduplicator. But whatever; we fixed the former and the latter will be fixed next week - that just leaves complaints from edit-reviewers who don't themselves like editing, which I have zero sympathy for.
    – Shog9
    Commented Oct 4, 2014 at 15:32
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    Good to hear that part will be fixed soon. Regarding making reviewers edit too, I don't know. Any chance for a later post on how well you think it worked out, with some statistics? Commented Oct 4, 2014 at 15:47
  • Post a request for that at least three weeks after the last set of changes is live. Or just use SEDE - the data is all public.
    – Shog9
    Commented Oct 4, 2014 at 15:49
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    The problem with this approach is the same as it's always been: some edits (especially attempted grammatical fixes) are both trivial and frustrating for the author, yet not necessarily 'invalid' per se.
    – sapi
    Commented Oct 5, 2014 at 7:44
  • What I hate is trivial edits on questions that are unlikely to get seen by many people apart from the front page effect from the edit being approved. Commented Oct 6, 2014 at 8:17
  • Its hard to "put your money where your mouth is" when someone edits a one sentence long question because they think it should have a question mark added to the end of it
    – Sayse
    Commented Oct 6, 2014 at 10:03
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    If a lack of punctuation is the only deficiency you can see, and someone fixes that... Then where is the problem, @sayse?
    – Shog9
    Commented Oct 6, 2014 at 13:55
  • @Shog9 - Apart from the OP's original point of people just doing edits for the sake of reputation, I'm sure there is some storage cost that must be had to store the previous revisions of a question. Is it worth saving a revision for one character that was probably just put there for the gained reputation?
    – Sayse
    Commented Oct 6, 2014 at 13:57

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