138
votes

What It's Not

Another thread about close votes (starting with the disclaimer, "Another thread about close votes.") But!

To discuss any the above, kindly comment or post in the linked or related threads :-). If you're feeling especially impassioned, you might even consider joining the strike. Or, the counter-movement.

What It Is

This thread's about a chatroom where we'll be hanging out about once a week, reviewing close votes. We'll be there at

  • 6:30pm (18:30) UTC, or
  • 9:00pm (21:00) UTC / 4:00pm EST / 1:00pm PST

on the following pattern of dates:

enter image description here enter image description here enter image description here

That's every 6 days, starting on the 1st Friday of each month, skipping weekends. This means sometimes due to weeks getting split by months, there'll be 4 or 11 days between meetups.

Why

Many users are demotivated by a queue that seems to grow and grow despite individual effort. I get discouraged not being able to see the impact of my input—the queue keeps growing, seemingly no matter what I do:

enter image description here

If there are others who feel as I do, then maybe we'd all feel a lot more motivated if we banded together to attack the queue over a single hour each week—and maybe if we got enough of us together, we could put a recurring and visible dent on that plot!

I have reason to believe it's possible, because in the first meetup, this happened:

enter image description here

...and there were only 3 of us.

23
  • 17
    Wow. Commented Nov 22, 2013 at 22:11
  • 2
    I like this idea, because you can get some agreements immediately on whether a post should or shouldn't be closed. Is there any way you could attack "low hanging fruit" (say, votes to close based on off-topic or something that doesn't require a boatload of research) first? That would allow you to reduce the number quickly, which might take some of the intimidation away that some have complained about. Commented Nov 22, 2013 at 22:21
  • 1
    @JohnnyBones There is close vote filtering.
    – Undo Mod
    Commented Nov 22, 2013 at 22:23
  • @Undo - Yes, I'm requesting that they actually use that strategy to knock out a bunch of reviews quickly. Commented Nov 22, 2013 at 22:25
  • 4
    And your goal is to discuss each item in the queue on its merits, reaching a consensus, before deciding to vote to close or leave open, right?
    – Bart
    Commented Nov 22, 2013 at 22:29
  • Feel free to post ideas as answers (and edit additional ideas into your own answer, so we don't end up with pages and pages of ideas). @JohnnyBones - That's a good one. The great thing about this is that we're all gonna be in a chat room together, so you can suggest, "Let's all work on off-topic votes," and maybe everyone will agree. Commented Nov 22, 2013 at 22:31
  • @Bart - Haha. Oh, god. That would take forever. (I know you're kidding.) Users can of course discuss ambiguities and debate precedents as they wish, but consensus isn't the goal—just hangin' out and feeling like a team, is. Commented Nov 22, 2013 at 22:32
  • 7
    I'd be totally down for it, but I don't have 3K rep yet. However, I think this is an awesome idea and applaud you for putting it in motion. Commented Nov 22, 2013 at 22:33
  • 8
    Well, keep in mind that the goal of that queue is not to close everything that's in there. It's there to provide easy access to questions which might be candidates for closure, but might just as well be valid questions which should be left open. I have the uncomfortable feeling that such an assembly would end up in a close-vote posse, which might well be brought up on Meta again in some time. So try to avoid that at least.
    – Bart
    Commented Nov 22, 2013 at 22:35
  • 7
    @Bart - Ah, indeed, good point. Maybe we could make it a rule for the chat room to refrain from reviewing questions linked in the chat. Something like, "To avoid turning this chat into a close vote posse, we encourage users to refrain from reviewing/voting on questions mentioned by other users. That is, do use links to discuss and debate questions, but find your own questions to review :-) Thanks." Commented Nov 22, 2013 at 22:41
  • 5
    For those who'd prefer meetups at 2:00pm UTC (9:00am EST, 6:00am PST, 7:30pm IST), please upvote this comment. Commented Nov 23, 2013 at 9:40
  • 4
    I'd rather see the room open and populated at all times, but I like the idea of meetups as well (of course, we can have both) Commented Nov 23, 2013 at 10:20
  • 6
    +1 for actually proposing to do something about the queue, rather than either whining, or saying "move along, nothing to see here"
    – Benjol
    Commented Nov 25, 2013 at 6:50
  • 5
    Thought I should throw this out: cv-pls.com it's what the PHP chat uses to close vote PHP related questions. Source is available on Github and can easily be switched to display tags other than [php], version 1.2 is in the works and will add more features such as multiple tags, column sorting, and more. Unfortunately it can't access the queue as there is no API access to it, but rather accesses new questions in near real-time.
    – cryptic ツ
    Commented Nov 29, 2013 at 19:42
  • 3
    Why bother? Seriously. The queue is now out of sight, out of mind. Since the top bar came out and hid the extra review links the acceleration of the queue has moved to 7+ times the average. To put it another way, it went from ~180 a day to 1200 per day. The review queue is growing faster than Jon Skeet's reputation.
    – Travis J
    Commented Dec 12, 2013 at 15:50

1 Answer 1

43
votes

This answer is left here for historic reasons but is no longer maintained. For an up to date status say hi in the SOCVR room or check our Tour and FAQ.

Next Meetup

3,000,000 close vote reviews celebration, December 19th, 17:00 -18:00 UTC
bring your comics, haiku's, comments to celebrate your and our moderation effort

Keep track of the CVQ

Register for regular events here

FAQ

Visit our extended explanation

Credits

Thanks to many for making these events possible and keeping them going: (in alphabetical order) @bjb568, @codemagic, @crypticツ, @Davidism, @DennisMeng, @Dukeling, @easwee, @Emracool, @GabrielePetronella, @godel9, @gunr2171, @HamZa, @hichris123, @JanDvorak, @JonClements, @joseph-quinsey, @OGHaza, @pnuts, @ProgramFox @Qantas94Heavy, @mehow, @rene, @RichardTingle, @Sam, @TGMCians, @TravisJ, @Undo, @user00000000, @Wayne-Conrad, @WouterJ.

Please don't hesitate to leave a message in chat if I've inadvertently left you out of this list!


Announcements

May 26th, 2014. "Life" happened and I've been taking a break from SO. I'm indebted to @rene et al for dutifully and cheerily keeping the effort going. This will be my last update on this thread, with an updated plot of the size of the close votes review queue (click for larger resolution):

enter image description here

Jan 15, 2014. The meetup time has been changed to 21:00 UTC (4:00pm EST) henceforth. Also, some fancy graphs coming up, based on data collected so far—

enter image description here

Dec 22, 2013. Moved cron job to a Linode. Now tracking all 3 numbers found on the stats page (as opposed to just current queue size). Planning to make CSV files available to public in 6-8 weeks.


Tracking

I've been tracking the size of the close votes review queue with a makeshift cron job.

#
#   crontab
#
* * * * * /home/andrew/cron/PollCVRQ.sh
#
#   PollCVRQ.sh
#
curl https://stackoverflow.com/review
    | grep dashboard-num
    | head -1
    | sed 's/^.*<div class="dashboard-num" title="\([^"]\+\)".*$/\1/'
    | sed 's/,//g'
    | sed 's/^/'`date +%s`',/'
    >> /home/andrew/cron/cvrq-primary-epoch.csv

This outputs:

1387381921,100825
1387381981,100830
1387382041,100830
1387382101,100830
1387382161,100826

For details on running this on Windows/Cygwin, see this thread, but for the love of all things holy do not use the code there—I used ISO-8601 thinking it was the international standard of time formats—not realizing what a nightmare it was to convert to and from other formats, especially with timezones involved. The above code uses the good ol' seconds-since-epoch (sample output below).

And here's the plot as of Dec 18, 2013. The intermittent drops are due to a weekly task that deletes old, abandoned questions. The crazy drops of late are due to having fixed some technical difficulties with the expiration of close votes—which, I hope, might render these chat events obsolete :-)

enter image description here

For those with Mathematica who wish to play with this data themselves, ping me in chat and I'll upload my latest data to this directory. (I didn't take data collection too seriously, else I'd have run the script on a server. @Emracool generously supplied me with a ton of missing data—and I was able to fill some other gaps with data collected on my roommate's computer.) The script previously formatted time in ISO-8601 (a huge mistake), but now uses seconds-since-epoch. The following Mathematica code includes functions for importing in either time format, and plots all datasets.

CVRQImportISO8601[path_, offset_: 0] := (
   data = Import[path];
   data = {StringReplacePart[#, {" ", ""}, {{11, 11}, {-5, -1}}], #2} & @@@ data;
   data = {DatePlus[#, offset/24], #2} & @@@ data;
   data
);

CVRQImportEpoch[path_] := (
   data = Import[path];
   data = {AbsoluteTime[{1970, 1, 1, 0, 0, 0}] + #, #2} & @@@ data;
   data
);

primaryOld = CVRQImportISO8601["C:\\cygwin\\home\\Andrew\\cron\\cvrq-primary-iso8601.csv"];
primaryNew = CVRQImportEpoch["C:\\cygwin\\home\\Andrew\\cron\\cvrq-primary-epoch.csv"];
secondaryEST = CVRQImportISO8601["C:\\cygwin\\home\\Andrew\\cron\\cvrq-secondary-iso8601.csv", 3]; 
secondaryPST = CVRQImportISO8601["C:\\cygwin\\home\\Andrew\\cron\\cvrq-secondary-iso8601-offset.csv"]; 
emracool = CVRQImportEpoch["C:\\cygwin\\home\\Andrew\\cron\\cvrq-emracool-epoch.csv"]; 

styles = {
   {ColorData[1, 1], PointSize@Tiny},
   {ColorData[1, 8], PointSize@Tiny},
   {ColorData[1, 15], PointSize@Tiny}
};

DateListPlot[
   {emracool, secondaryPST, secondaryEST, primaryNew, primaryOld},
   PlotStyle -> {styles[[2]], styles[[3]], styles[[3]], styles[[1]], styles[[1]]},
   ImageSize -> {GoldenRatio*360, 360}
]

Finally, an additional function for zooming in on a segment of the plot:

CVRQZoom[data_, start_, end_, low_, high_] := DateListPlot[
   data,
   PlotRange -> {{start, end}, {low, high}},
   PlotStyle -> {PointSize@Tiny},
   ImageSize -> {GoldenRatio*360, 360},
   Joined -> True
];

CVRQZoom[{primaryOld}, "25 Nov 2013 20:30:00", "25 Nov 2013 22:30:00", 95600, 95700]

enter image description here

12
  • 2
    Can you update this answer with the new date(s) and hopefully nice graphs when you have the oppertunity?
    – rene
    Commented Jan 9, 2014 at 15:10
  • There may not be much to do anymore... :-) but I'll be there. Thanks for keeping these threads updated and the room alive, @rene. Commented Mar 3, 2014 at 10:45
  • 1
    It just cleared... :-) mission accomplished
    – rene
    Commented Mar 3, 2014 at 10:48
  • @rene: that's just a illusion -- there's still tons to do! Commented Mar 3, 2014 at 11:05
  • @Qantas94Heavy Ohh, but...how...the numbers never lie...or do they... :-)
    – rene
    Commented Mar 3, 2014 at 11:10
  • Has your data been affected by the new close votes display change?
    – durron597
    Commented Mar 6, 2014 at 15:20
  • 1
    On the not sharing review of questions, the main problem seems to be the inherent bias that one can vote to close without being able to vote to keep open. I've created a feature-request question that asks to fix that: (meta.stackoverflow.com/questions/252010/…) Commented Apr 24, 2014 at 22:23
  • Just out of curiosity: How did the numbers drop from the approximately 100k shown on these graphs to the 10-12k they are now? While I can't join these events (day job...), I've been trying to do my 40 reviews every day. Commented Jul 23, 2014 at 7:45
  • @RetoKoradi - That was due to this, and the subsequent increases were due to the restoration of posts with 4, 3, 2, etc. votes. Commented Jul 23, 2014 at 7:55
  • @rene do you by chance know if CV Reviewers are aware of recent initiative: Clean up “looking for [something]” questions?
    – gnat
    Commented Jan 16, 2015 at 7:07
  • 1
    @gnat Not specifically but I do notice I get a lot more library requests in any tag we filter on. I did one daily close raid on free. I'll put the post on our starboard
    – rene
    Commented Jan 16, 2015 at 9:21
  • 1
    thanks @rene - per my observations, this initiative progressed pretty well first few days. Then it somewhat slowed down, making me feel that folks driving it rather lack experience in long term cleanup efforts. Which naturally made me recall of you folks successfully running your gig for over a year now (!)
    – gnat
    Commented Jan 16, 2015 at 21:47

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