9

Apparently I missed out on quite a few developments regarding the stance towards partial edits. Looking at it now I largely agree with my flag being declined, because a.) the flag didn't contain any links to problematic reviews, and b.) the edits I thought of as "problematic" are not actually problematic, given the current stance towards those edits.


Christmas came early for me this year. In this case, it was in form of a declined flag. This happens from time to time, and - as most of us are humans - that's perfectly fine. Sometimes the user that issued the flag misinterpreted something, sometimes the moderator handling the flag didn't look close enough, so I generally don't care that much (even though it ruins my statistics!!!).

Here's the custom flag (including freehand-drawn red circles):

Custom flag

However, in this case, it's a blatant robo-reviewer, and blatant means blatant.

Just take a look these reviews, and then tell me again that this flag was worthy of being declined.

Reject: Edit to show the picture

Approve: Changes to code

Approve: Changes to code

Approve: Changes to code

Approve: Changes to code

Approve: Changes to code

Approve: Superfluous edit

Approve: Edit to remove noise, left 50% of the initial noise untouched

Approve: Changed the original intent

Approve: Moved one line of code

If someone feels the need to dig deeper, go ahead.

The question that I now have is - as already stated in the title - why that flag was declined, for waffles sake. Am I missing out on something? Are changes to code - as shown in the reviews above - now suddenly okay?


This flag was one of two that I issued at basically the same time. Both also happened to contain basically the same text, the only difference being that the other one was marked as "Helpful". Also, both flags were handled by the same moderator, which only adds to my confusion.

What I did not do in either case was adding links to problematic reviews. I didn't think about that, and I should have done that. Still, that shouldn't be a reason to decline a mod flag (IMO).

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  • 26
    You realize you just gave Martijn Pieters another secret hat? Decline a flag from the mod queue and get called out for it later on Meta
    – rene
    Commented Dec 28, 2016 at 9:22
  • 1
    @rene My stats for his hats? =(
    – Seth
    Commented Dec 28, 2016 at 9:22
  • 4
    I would have additionally linked to a couple of problematic reviews in the flag description. Bah.
    – Tunaki
    Commented Dec 28, 2016 at 9:31
  • 2
    @Tunaki Probably should have done that. Regardless, the reviews that were done before my flag were pretty clear. Also, I flagged another user with basically the same flag-reason, that one got approved.
    – Seth
    Commented Dec 28, 2016 at 9:35
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    I have looked at all of the links above, and (except for a few that I'm uncertain about) I'd say that Jeff is the one who got them right. I'm bookmarking this guy so I can go back and reapply the edits that didn't make it through. Commented Dec 28, 2016 at 10:44
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    @NisseEngström If you actually intend to reapply edits like this one... Meh. Go ahead. Don't blame me if you get penalized for that.
    – Seth
    Commented Dec 28, 2016 at 10:55
  • @Seth: No, I have no idea about that one. I probably won't have time to do it anyway, so don't worry too much. Commented Dec 28, 2016 at 10:58
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    @rene: Bah, humbug, it wasn't my decline and I didn't get the hat now! :-(
    – Martijn Pieters Mod
    Commented Dec 28, 2016 at 11:13
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    frantically declines all the remaining 2000 moderator flags and waits for a meta post
    – Bhargav Rao Mod
    Commented Dec 28, 2016 at 11:16
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    An early Christmas on the 28th? A whole year early‽
    – deceze Mod
    Commented Dec 28, 2016 at 15:11
  • @deceze Indeed! (Truth be told, I still have not wrapped my head around the fact that christmas is over already) =| And I really didn't think much of it when writing this question.
    – Seth
    Commented Dec 28, 2016 at 15:17
  • 4
    @MartijnPieters you're just the usual suspect ever since your election, when folks learned about these 3 days you blatantly missed in 2012
    – gnat
    Commented Dec 28, 2016 at 15:27

1 Answer 1

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Just take a look these reviews, and then tell me again that this flag was worthy of being declined.

Let's see...

Reject: Edit to show the picture

I agree with you: bad rejection.

Approve: Changes to code

I don't entirely agree with you. The edit genuinely fixed code that was genuinely broken. I don't think it was a good edit - if somebody's answer is fundamentally broken (and it's not locked to the top of the page by being accepted or highly upvoted) then you should comment, downvote, and post a competing answer instead of editing it - but you can see why someone would think this was a good edit. Not evidence of robo-reviewing.

Approve: Changes to code

I'm not qualified to judge, but half of the other reviewers thought this was a good edit and the post author has been online since without reverting it, so I'd tentatively guess it was good?

Approve: Changes to code

I disagree with you. The edit is a stylistic improvement that doesn't fundamentally change the meaning of the answer; approving it was fine.

Approve: Changes to code

I don't speak C++ so I can't judge this one.

Approve: Changes to code

Perfectly defensible approval; the edit fixes a broken snippet by adding the dependencies needed for it to run, without fundamentally changing the answer.

Approve: Superfluous edit

Meh. The edit is minor, but I can see why people would prefer the version afterwards to the version before. Doesn't look like a roboreview

Approve: Edit to remove noise, left 50% of the initial noise untouched

Still a good edit and a good approval. A substantial minority of dissenters notwithstanding, most of the community believes that minor edits be good.

Approve: Changed the original intent

Hmm. Seems like a pointless edit that should've been rejected, though not for the reason you give. It looks like the editor believed that they were replacing a reference to a deprecated library with a reference to its newer replacement, but was in fact just replacing a reference to the library's variable name in code with a reference to its package name on NPM.

Approve: Moved one line of code

This edit (and acceptance of it) are reasonable; the grouping of imports and exports before was confusing and had been commented upon.

If someone feels the need to dig deeper, go ahead.

I opened up another half-dozen reviews and they looked fine.

I don't see any reason for action to be taken against this user, and I think the mod was right to decline the flag. There are definitely a couple of outright mistakes in their reviewing, and a couple more decisions that I don't quite agree with, but the evidence you've put forward doesn't suggest that the user is a "blatant" robo-reviewer as you believe them to be, and a quick skim of their review history - while showing significantly more accepts than rejections - doesn't give that impression either.

Furthermore, your flag (and the examples you cite here) seem to be largely based upon the idea that code edits are inherently wrong. This isn't the case. Precisely what kind of code edits should or shouldn't be allowed is a fiercely controversial topic, but even the When should I make edits to code FAQ entry pretty clearly implies in its first paragraph that accepting code edits is sometimes the right thing to do. Basing your flag upon the fact that the user has approved code edits was probably a quick path to getting it declined, because approving code edits isn't a bad thing.

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    First of all, thanks for answering! The thing is that the "blatant robo-reviewer" part was not part of the initial flag that got declined, and there were quite a few edits that were superfluous / straight up bad that got approved, and atleast one that should have been approved but was rejected. I think in this case one could say "Flag should be marked as helpful", or one could say "Flag should be disputed", but I heavily disagree with the declination of the flag being right, because, again, there were cases of this user not following the guidelines regarding reviews.
    – Seth
    Commented Dec 28, 2016 at 17:44
  • @Seth: Even if they weren't following guidelines, that doesn't automatically make them a robo-reviewer. I haven't done as deep a dive as Mark has, but I find myself not disagreeing with his assertions.
    – Makoto
    Commented Dec 28, 2016 at 17:46
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    I recommend everyone willing to participate in this discussion to do exactly that, dive deep. Because you may stumble upon reviews like this one. And that is not the only one. I spend a bit of time checking the first 5 pages of reviews, and there are roughly 2 clear cases of completely wrong reviews and a bunch of highly questionable reviews per page.
    – Seth
    Commented Dec 28, 2016 at 17:51
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    @Seth what's wrong with the review you've linked to? I know little about Android development, having never done any, but after a quick Google I think that strings.xml is not in any way specific to Android Studio (e.g. there are references to modifying it in Eclipse at stackoverflow.com/q/6106088/1709587). Surely that means the Android Studio tag was irrelevant (and being used contrary to its usage guidance), that the edit removing it was correct, and that everybody apart from Jeff reviewed it wrongly?
    – Mark Amery
    Commented Dec 28, 2016 at 17:58
  • @MarkAmery My bad. What about this one? Or that?
    – Seth
    Commented Dec 28, 2016 at 18:03
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    @Seth: I was the mod that declined the flag. I came here to post an answer, but I'd largely be repeating what Mark has said. I went through the user's latest page of reviews to process your flag, and disagreed with the accusation in your flag that "the user frequently goes against the majority". I agreed with his action in almost all of the edits I checked.
    – Matt Mod
    Commented Dec 28, 2016 at 19:11
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    @seth You obviously have very different standards than me, Mark, and Matt for what constitutes a good edit. You suggest that this edit is bad? In what way? There's only one problem there, and that's that it failed to remove a salutation. That's not a reason to reject it! It was even approved by the OP. Perhaps it's you that we need to have an intervention with?
    – Cody Gray Mod
    Commented Dec 29, 2016 at 12:10
  • @CodyGray You can intervene with me any time you want, I personally do not see how you'd do that, but feel free to do as you please. Regarding the edit: If you honestly think that the salutation left in there was the only problem with the edit, I'd suggest you take a look at the messy code formatting. This was a superfluous edit, doing what? "Improving" formatting (actually not), and "fixing" grammar, and leaving arguably bigger problems untouched. That is in no way an edit that should've been approved.
    – Seth
    Commented Dec 29, 2016 at 12:31
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    We had the debate a long time ago about whether you're supposed to reject an edit for failing to fix 100% of the problems with a post. It was widely agreed that you are not. They even removed the "too minor" rejection reason. So none of that has anything to do with whether the edit in question should have been approved or not, @seth.
    – Cody Gray Mod
    Commented Dec 29, 2016 at 13:17
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    @CodyGray No need to adress me, I get the notification without it. I was under the impression that edits that did not fix the main problems with a post were to be rejected, partly due to meta content like this answer. Am I right to assume that what you just said is now considered community consensus? If so, then I've been wrong in my doing, and I sincerely apologize.
    – Seth
    Commented Dec 29, 2016 at 13:22
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    @Seth: One of the problems with "incomplete" edits was that non-English speakers may not feel comfortable attacking grammar or similar pure linguistic issues because of their lack of confidence in their own proficiency and yet they could still meaningfully improve posts. Another problem is that since not all people would agree on what needed editing and what did not, the feedback could be subjective, depending on reviewers. Yet another issue was that it seemed silly to leave a "crappy" version of a post visible to everyone just because no-one could manage to change everything needed at once. Commented Dec 30, 2016 at 15:35
  • The C++ one looks good, but should clarify two things: 1) The first line creates a temporary object, then swaps it with t; it should clarify that boost::thread::swap() takes a boost::thread&, and thus can't bind to temporary objects (and therefore, to swap with a temporary, you call the temporary's swap() and pass it the permanent object, as the first line of code does). 2) It should clarify that boost::thread has both a move constructor and a move assignment operator, and thus temporary objects can be either used to construct or assigned to it (as the second line of code does). Commented Dec 30, 2016 at 21:40

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