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Why would we want a forum?

Sometimes I just want to have an intelligent conversation with people that takes place over the span of a few days, maybe even a few weeks. The chat rooms aren't really ideal for this, since conversations happen in real-time. I find that some of the most intellectually stimulating discussions occur when users have adequate time to think and contemplate things, which real-time chat just isn't suited for.

In addition, I don't want to talk about things related to programming all the time (is that blasphemy?), nor do I want to constantly have debates about Stack Overflow on Meta, or debates about Meta itself on Meta. The Stack Exchange platform feels too restricting sometimes, with regards to how people communicate and express themselves...which, of course, is by design:

At Stack Exchange, one of the tricky things we learned about Q&A is that if your goal is to have an excellent signal to noise ratio, you must suppress discussion. Stack Exchange only supports the absolute minimum amount of discussion necessary to produce great questions and great answers. That's why answers get constantly re-ordered by votes, that's why comments have limited formatting and length and only a few display, and so forth. Almost every design decision we made was informed by our desire to push discussion down, to inhibit it in every way we could. Spare us the long-winded diatribe, just answer the damn question already.

I want to know if people would be interested in having a Discourse forum set up, where Stack Overflow users (or maybe even Stack Exchange users in general) can get together and just "hang out", and talk about whatever they want to talk about.

I realize that there's a chat room for this, but quite frankly, it's a ghost-town compared to the more popular language specific chat rooms:

Tavern chat statistics JavaScript chat statistics

and again, the chat rooms just aren't suited for deep, long conversations. They're possibly easier to derail too, with random users dropping in who suddenly want someone to pay attention to some post on Stack Overflow and Meta (I'm actually guilty of this).

So what do people think? Are there enough people interested in this to make setting it up, maintaining it, and moderating it worth it? Or is this just a terrible, terrible idea?

Related

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  • 8
    Finally, a place to put a boat programming thread!
    – icktoofay
    Commented May 12, 2014 at 5:12
  • "it's a ghost town" == "only the crazies visit that one"?
    – slugster
    Commented May 12, 2014 at 5:33
  • 1
    I think it means "No one ever goes there to chat because no one ever goes there to chat." Circles are fun.
    – Wooble
    Commented May 12, 2014 at 13:45
  • 1
    That particular chat room is kind of a bad example - if I didn't keep unfreezing it, you probably wouldn't even know it exists. The other tavern is the real tavern.
    – Shog9
    Commented May 12, 2014 at 17:22
  • 1
    I think it's fair to say that if we wanted to address the type of need described here (with the SO community that chose to participate), something like discourse would be a much better fit than chat in its current implementation.
    – Jaydles Staff
    Commented May 12, 2014 at 17:23
  • FYI, I've personally already lost interest in this feature, but feel free to vote for it if you want it.
    – user456814
    Commented May 12, 2014 at 22:11
  • 1
    It's a good thing votes on meta no longer affect reputation in any way, huh? :)
    – BoltClock Mod
    Commented May 13, 2014 at 6:00
  • @BoltClock I should stop making feature requests, regardless :/
    – user456814
    Commented May 13, 2014 at 8:36
  • Some of us are trying to get the SO tavern active. Admittedly apart from "morning" and "afternoon" not much is happening yet because we also hang around on the MSE tavern, but we're starting to have a few short conversations now and then :)
    – user247702
    Commented Jul 25, 2014 at 22:32
  • 1
    I was about to ask the same question. I got discouraged asking anything on Meta since each time I get down votes at once. Though I like SO for the QnA system, I dislike the lack of a possibility to simply discuss things.
    – qwerty_so
    Commented Oct 23, 2015 at 19:33
  • @ThomasKilian people use the chat rooms to discuss thing. There are also more chat rooms on different subjects at chat.stackexchange.com, as well as chat.meta.stackexchange.com (though the rooms at the final link tend to be about moderation of the SE sites in general).
    – user456814
    Commented Oct 23, 2015 at 23:33
  • I have looked into both. None of them seems to be a place to come up with a point to discuss. They are closed circles. A forum is an open place where your opinion is not judged.
    – qwerty_so
    Commented Oct 24, 2015 at 7:43

3 Answers 3

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I don't think you've made the case that chat is unsuitable.

I've had many good conversations in there, and if someone wants to be disruptive, we just tell them to go away, ignore them and (if necessary) find someone with superpowers to kick them or ban them. It happens less often than you might think.

The most common disruption? Someone who wants to ask their crappy programming question in the chat room because it won't pass muster on the main site.

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  • 10
    I disagree. I think some individuals (probably like yourself) are more suited to interacting in a chat scenario. I, at least, can't get anything out of group chat. I go in and am immediately lost in the middle of a conversation in progress, and by the time I have something to say the topic has moved on to something else. Admittedly, it's been years since I've made an honest go at any sort of real-time chat, but I just stopped going in at all, because it doesn't work for me.
    – Jason
    Commented May 12, 2014 at 17:22
  • I think that Robert makes a fair argument.
    – user456814
    Commented May 13, 2014 at 19:30
  • @Jason. That depends on the room. Some are slower than others.
    – TRiG
    Commented May 30, 2014 at 15:07
  • 2
    In my experience, no room simultaneously moves slow enough for me to interact and fast enough to be interesting.
    – Jason
    Commented May 30, 2014 at 19:49
9

No, no, no, no, no.

We don't need any features that make [so] more like newsgroups. We don't need a place for people to come hang out with others they may assume share the same interests. Chat is as far from the original purpose of this site as we need to go - we don't need to go all the way back to what we were trying to improve on.

This would create a community with a fundamentally different purpose to that of the main community. This I can guarantee you that the preferences of that other community will begin to leak into the main community, and may even begin to take it over.

Take this idea away - far away. Create whatever forums you like, but do not in any way associate them with Stack Exchange.

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  • That's a fair argument.
    – user456814
    Commented May 13, 2014 at 4:20
  • @John, So you are saying it spoils the brand? It doesn't have taste?
    – Pacerier
    Commented May 13, 2014 at 8:06
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    It's more than a brand thing. I don't want such chaos associated with even the concept of Stack Exchange. If this were to exist, I would want it to the case that a user of the forums would not even be aware that the forums have anything at all to do with Stack Exchange. Commented May 13, 2014 at 10:17
  • 1
    Why do users come to Stack Overflow in droves to post crap questions? Because someone told them it's the place to come to post crap questions. Someone lied or else was too dim to understand. I don't want people coming to the forum then thinking that Stack Exchange is a place to go to do more of the same crap they're doing in the Forum. Commented May 13, 2014 at 10:19
  • 1
    Why then is there chat? Is it somehow immune to the arguments you make because it's even more ephemeral than a forum or newsgroup? Commented May 13, 2014 at 13:14
  • @KennyEvitt That's exactly why the chat system isn't horrible. Commented May 13, 2014 at 13:15
-4

I like your idea (in part because I had a similar one), but I think a forum for programming questions that don't belong on the site-proper would be better than a truly 'open-ended but somehow related' forum.

The forum should be a (welcoming) forum for everyone's "crappy programming question[s]", as Robert Harvey so pointedly put it.

Think how nice it would be if we could migrate low-quality questions to a much more suitable venue, where said OPs could (possibly) get the help they need, and yet there could be a Connection to The Canon of proper SO questions as well.

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    I don't have any disagreement with the idea of allowing programming questions that aren't a good fit for Stack Overflow on a forum, as long as old, un-answered threads get closed and deleted after a period X (like say 2 weeks?), to prevent them from being "bumped" to the top and dominating the forum front-page. On the other hand, I'm not exactly excited by the idea either. I'm neutral about it, so far :/
    – user456814
    Commented May 12, 2014 at 17:43
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    Also, like I said, I do have other interests besides programming :P
    – user456814
    Commented May 12, 2014 at 17:44
  • A place where questions go to die, infested by help vampires? Sounds like a sweet Stephen King novel, not so much a place I'd spend any time without pants full of garlic. Commented May 13, 2014 at 5:41

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