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Here are some pretty tight guidelines for product vendors that outsource their support to Stack Overflow. And vendors are not encouraged to do this too easily. All is well and good.

But even for a seasoned Stack Overflow contributor like me it's impossible to know all products that use this support model. So what frequently happens is:

  • User X asks a clearly support-related question about ProductA.
  • I vote to close this question, indicating that it belongs on the product's support forum.
  • X responds in a frustrated manner that he/she feels shuttled from pillar to post because the product's site tells them to post on Stack Overflow.
  • I admit I didn't know that ProductA referred to Stack Overflow for support and (may) retract my close vote.

That's a lot of clutter and uselessly spent energy!

Just one example is here. You see, by the way, that the OP even thought he was contacting product support directly here. ("Did you introduce a new bug...", "you french guys...").

In this case, in my opinion the product vendor, SonarQube, did a very poor job1 in instructing their users when and how to resort to Stack Overflow. And they clearly don't follow up sufficiently on questions in their tag (only an edit!). But that's beyond SO's control. Any product vendor can refer to SO in this poor (or even poorer) manner and lean back.

But there's more to it. Users typically won't read even the best and concise guidelines on product sites. They see "Stack Overflow" and there they go. So what we get is a lot of questions that can't even be answered here, only by the product developers themselves if they happen to be around. For instance -

  • Why is this feature implemented this way?
  • When do you expect to release version x.y?
  • I have this feature request....

These questions are totally irrelevant on Stack Overflow (in the past they would go down as "too localized").

So I would like to actively discourage this support model in some way. I know that this is hard to realize. Maybe there should be a specific flag for it. Is SO even capable (in term of human resources) of contacting offenders?


1Doesn't apply any more. They changed their support model.

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  • 167
    Never retract your close vote just because the OP was given incorrect advice by a third party.
    – Pekka
    Commented Jun 14, 2015 at 10:48
  • 3
    Just saying because your narrative suggested you routinely do that :) Re a specific flag, the way this has worked so far was that people would complain on Meta about specific companies. I don't think a flag can improve much on that, ultimately it's up to SO staff whether they contact the company or not. Not sure whether that has happened in the case of Paypal for eaxmple
    – Pekka
    Commented Jun 14, 2015 at 10:50
  • That one question may possibly be improved by changing the first paragraph - the "you" complaint.
    – Jongware
    Commented Jun 14, 2015 at 11:07
  • What's the reason for discouraging this? Most vendor support forums are absolutely terrible; as a user I'd rather use SO (and contribute both ways, not be a help-vampire of course). And in fact SO often provides better answers .
    – M.M
    Commented Jun 14, 2015 at 14:55
  • 27
    @MattMcNabb - It's fine to ask programming questions here, it's not OK to ask customer support questions here. This is OK: stackoverflow.com/questions/30821923/… but this isn't: stackoverflow.com/questions/18362813/…
    – BSMP
    Commented Jun 14, 2015 at 15:53
  • 2
    @BSMP Thanks for clearing that up. Agree that the 2nd one isn't appropriate
    – M.M
    Commented Jun 14, 2015 at 16:02
  • 3
    Oh, no, I didn't read it as anything like that!
    – Pekka
    Commented Jun 15, 2015 at 7:44
  • 6
    StackOverflow isn't here to hold the vendor's hand, nor should it IMO. It is the vendors responsibility to look after their clients. StackOverflow should only be concerned with whether or not a question is suitable for StackOverflow
    – Sayse
    Commented Jun 15, 2015 at 7:47
  • 3
    @GertArnold - StackOverflow is the one who is in control here. We set the fences by continuing to deter bad questions, eventually those from the company would see the communities feedback on their tag (I would hope) and need to consider how to adapt their approach. I suppose it could be nice if there was something written about "how to use SO for your support" to be emailed out to the offenders but then there may already be.
    – Sayse
    Commented Jun 15, 2015 at 7:58
  • 1
    @Sayse An SO-written "How to outsource support to SO" is a great idea. Do it before someone else does and get it right.
    – nwp
    Commented Jun 15, 2015 at 9:48
  • 2
    @Sayse - Personally I feel "eventually those from the company would see the communities feedback on their tag" is a bit reactive, while a more proactive approach is needed to prevent these things from happening in the first place.
    – BillyNate
    Commented Jun 15, 2015 at 9:55
  • 1
    All the responses to this issue seem to be about the vendor. Although the vendor is the "source" of the problem, the OP is the one confused. Why not try to educate the OP, starting by telling the OP that SO is not an official support forum, but an independant Q&A website. Helping OP to understand the context and maybe even rephrase the question (when applicable) could just remove (part of) the frustration.
    – BillyNate
    Commented Jun 15, 2015 at 11:23
  • 4
    @BillyNate There are more OPs than vendors, and it is easier to educate one vendor than the tens, hundreds, or thousands of people who use their product or will in the future. The mathematics of it show that proactive effort is most efficiently applied to the vendor. Commented Jun 15, 2015 at 12:53
  • 3
    For this particular case, leewangzhong pointed out in a comment on the original question that the OP tried posting this bug report elsewhere, but a SonarQube representative specifically directed him to post on StackOverflow instead. I've replied on that thread, directing the SonarQube representative to StackOverflow's official policy on this matter.
    – Ajedi32
    Commented Jun 15, 2015 at 14:09
  • 2
    Well, looks like SonorQube updated the wording on their get support page. It's a bit better now, in that it no longer says that bug reports should be posted on SO. See the mailing list discussion on this for more details.
    – Ajedi32
    Commented Jun 18, 2015 at 15:01

4 Answers 4

35

There is already an official policy on this, addressed to the company in question, in the Help Center: https://stackoverflow.com/help/product-support

It explicitly covers your three examples of questions that shouldn't be asked here, and where the third-party should direct users instead:

  • I have an idea/request -- file an issue (on your own site)
  • Why do you? -- your own community (developer forum etc)
  • When will you? -- your own community

There's only really a need for staff to get involved if the company involved refuses to change their wording. The first thing to do would be for someone (i.e. you!) to send them a link to that policy, and ask them politely to tweak the wording. Remember to assume good faith - they probably just didn't spend long enough drafting the text, and didn't mean any harm.

See also my previous answer on the subject.

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  • 1
    As I did. It annoys me though that it seems to be the only thing we can do. But maybe if more people start doing this eventually "the world" will get the message. Commented Jun 15, 2015 at 10:03
  • 5
    The world would be a better place if everyone is more like IMSoP: Meaning no harm and assuming good faith all the time. A policy on what to do with a third-party that does not listen (even after a lot of good faith) would not be unwelcome though.
    – BillyNate
    Commented Jun 15, 2015 at 10:03
  • 4
    I tried Googling what IMSoP was, came to the conclusion it must be "International Medical Society of Paraplegia" before realizing the answer is by @IMSoP. :(
    – Mave
    Commented Jun 17, 2015 at 10:02
  • Any ideas on how we could do something more pro-actively? Just as most users hardly ever bother to read the help center, it may never occur to third parties to read instructions on how to guide their users to SO. Somehow it should become common knowledge that vendors shouldn't take this lightly. Commented Jun 17, 2015 at 12:39
  • @GertArnold I can think of ways of pro-actively warning users, such as setting tag pop-up messages for tags where we know there are unresolved issues (e.g. "Please be aware that this site is not affiliated with company X..."). But that doesn't get to the heart of the matter, which is the vendors giving wrong guidance in the first place. Unfortunately, inbound links are fundamentally not something which can be controlled on the web; blame Tim Berners-Lee ;)
    – IMSoP
    Commented Jun 17, 2015 at 13:03
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    Thanks @IMSoP for your answer. We (SonarSource) agree that our "Get Support" page was not clear enough so we updated it to have it aligned with SO policy detailed at stackoverflow.com/help/product-support. I hope things are clearer now (feel free to give feedback). We've always been monitoring SO because our users started asking questions there a long time ago even though we used to have a user mailing list at that time (it was unfortunately shut down recently due to the end of the Codehaus forge which used to host open-source projects like SonarQube). Commented Jun 18, 2015 at 12:51
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    @Fabrice-SonarQubeTeam Much appreciated :). The Entity Framework team did a similar thing after I dropped them a line. Great when people cooperate. Commented Jun 19, 2015 at 19:10
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I think that unless the company has support staff active on Stack Overflow, any links to Stack Overflow’s “ask a question page” should result in a page saying that Stack Overflow is not a support site for XXX.

This can be done by Stack Overflow looking at where a user has come from before deciding what content to show and having a list of web pages we do not wish to get people from.

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  • 3
    Are you really suggesting to scrape sites around the internet for references to SO? What a job. But even then, many links to SO will be perfectly legitimate. And I think it's hard to determine whether a company has (or still has) active SO users. Should they officially be registered as XXX employee? I appreciate your input, but I think it shows how hard it is to tackle this. Commented Jun 16, 2015 at 17:39
  • 4
    @GertArnold, No, the HTTP headers tells you where someone has come from. Meta posts can be used to ask for a "ask them" page to be added to the "blocked" list. If the tag is coping well with the incoming questions, there is no need to to anything. If it is not coping then the company that has created the problem must step up! Commented Jun 16, 2015 at 22:02
  • OK, but I wonder how many people will directly arrive from a third-party's support site. Commented Jun 16, 2015 at 22:17
  • @GertArnold, it is a BIG problem for a handfull of tags. For most tags it is not an issue. Commented Jun 16, 2015 at 22:33
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    Ex: "We see that you are arriving from xxxx.com. Please be aware that Stack Exchange is an independent community of volunteers that does not provide official support for any outside programs or lbrariesi. If you've been directed to this page for customer support purposes, please return to xxxx.com and inform its maintainers to this message." Dialog has to be closed to continue; certain sites can be whitelisted by request if they happen to word their links well.
    – Katana314
    Commented Jun 17, 2015 at 18:51
  • Something like this could actually work I think, although in the beginning this will probably produce many many false positives. Commented Jun 19, 2015 at 14:46
  • Another possible advantage is that we could resolve this by community moderation (white-list product sites). Commented Jun 19, 2015 at 15:00
  • @GertArnold, or the system can look at close votes and down votes and lean it's self. Commented Jun 19, 2015 at 15:03
  • And I agree with @GertArnold, I feel that this answer is very reasonnable. FYI, we (SonarSource) would have never asked our users to use SO without making sure that our dev team is actively monitoring the "sonarqube" tag => the most active users for this tag are all (except Mark O'Connor) SonarSource guys: stackoverflow.com/tags/sonarqube/topusers. Commented Jun 22, 2015 at 9:17
  • This would come up against the "interaction algorithm" problem almost immediately (e.g. Facebook's products showing you posts with people you interact with the most meaning you get silo'd in with the same few people more and more over time). How can the support staff become active if users are not able to post questions about the product here?
    – TylerH
    Commented Jan 25, 2019 at 15:45
9

In Fall 2014, I enrolled in an edX class (CS169.1X) that recommended SO for general Ruby/Rails questions; however, for questions specific to the class, students were directed to the class StackExchange forum. Unfortunately, I cannot find the class forum, and cannot link to it for reference.

I think there should be stricter guidelines for third-party product support. By stricter, I think that products/services used by programmers are acceptable (eclipse, vim, firefox), as long as there is a developer aspect involved. But using SO as a bug support forum takes away from the Q&A quality of the site. As @Gert referenced, someone posted in the question offensive remarks targeted at the company. For another SO user to stumble on the question, it would seem like OP is venting.

As others have pointed out, this is not a perfect world, and companies will continue to reference StackOverflow -- partly because it is already free, and partly because it's already there (rather than making their own support forum and hosting it). I do not know if there are legal/attribution obligations on these companies, but they should only be allowed to post on SO iff there is a pre-existing or to-be approved tag.

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    The class forum you are referring to was shutdown I think meta.stackexchange.com/questions/231208/…
    – rene
    Commented Jun 15, 2015 at 16:45
  • @rene That makes sense. Why was it shut down? Did the edX partnership with SO end? The link you sent was from May 2014, and I took the class Fall 2014.
    – user3373470
    Commented Jun 15, 2015 at 17:42
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    The comments are from june, 8th and I saw a comment earlier (maybe in chat) that the sites were no longer reachable. Jaydles comment is the most official stuff I have...
    – rene
    Commented Jun 15, 2015 at 17:52
  • That is very strange. Being in the class, I think the sites were removed maybe to discourage "cheating". I use quotes because although the instructors allowed questions about the homework, edX may have viewed some responses/answers as violating their honor code.
    – user3373470
    Commented Jun 15, 2015 at 17:53
  • I can see how there is a thin line between an asking a honest question and having someone else doing your (course) work. It requires discipline from all parties involved
    – rene
    Commented Jun 15, 2015 at 17:57
  • Yes. I feel that if edX allows forums for its classes, it should lax its honor code. That is why I had to move my work from github to bitbucket, so others could not find it and copy.
    – user3373470
    Commented Jun 15, 2015 at 18:00
  • Haha, I was once doing an online course on a rather obscure language, and very curiously, there would be a rather specific and familiar looking set of duplicate niche questions on that language coming up on SO every time an assignment deadline came up...
    – Kerrek SB
    Commented Jun 20, 2015 at 11:47
-7

People do this because it looks like there have been exceptions to this rule.

Or at least there have seemed to be.

When devs see the Facebook graph subsite that was actually just StackOverflow, they think their own venture can use StackOverflow in the same way for their support forum. Or they eventually go work for one of the companies that also did this.

It is also faster to get answers on stackoverflow than some company's neglected subsite.

This post alone is more surprising to me than anything "this site is suddenly discouraging this?" but in reality it is just certain kinds of questions that are being discouraged, which is understandable, but I think it is going to be hard to enforce that distinction

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    There haven't been exceptions to this rule. Companies are more than welcome to point users to SO for questions about programming problems using their product, instead of using in-house customer support for those questions that have always been on topic on SO. It has never been acceptable for companies to send otherwise off topic questions to SO and have them be appropriate. Some have tried, but SE has not accepted the questions.
    – Servy
    Commented Jun 15, 2015 at 15:58
  • "Companies are more than welcome to point users to SO for questions about programming problems using their product, instead of using in-house customer support for those questions that have always been on topic on SO." @Servy we actually agree. It is the title to this question that I was commenting about
    – CQM
    Commented Jun 15, 2015 at 16:04
  • 4
    Your answer seems to be claiming that there have been cases where sites have been allowed to direct questions to SO that wouldn't normally meet the site's standards. That has never been the case. Some companies may have done it despite the fact that they weren't given permission, and where the questions weren't welcomed.
    – Servy
    Commented Jun 15, 2015 at 16:06
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    @Servy "where sites have been allowed to direct questions to SO that wouldn't normally meet the site's standards." ah, no, just using SO for developer support. Which it seemed this post was also trying to discourage, at first. I am pointing out that OTHER people don't know this distinction. One company uses SO for developer support and everyone else sees that as general support so they try it. There isn't anything obvious to these other people to deter them from trying it
    – CQM
    Commented Jun 15, 2015 at 16:13
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    So you're saying you didn't actually read the question to understand what it was really asking, and as a result answered a completely different question than what was being asked?
    – Servy
    Commented Jun 15, 2015 at 16:14
  • @Servy I didn't say that and I clarified
    – CQM
    Commented Jun 15, 2015 at 16:15
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    So then you statement that there have been exceptions to SO's rules is just wrong. Your answer also doesn't say anything about people mistakenly thinking that they can direct inappropriate questions to SO when they can't.
    – Servy
    Commented Jun 15, 2015 at 16:16
  • @Servy alright, I edited the wording
    – CQM
    Commented Jun 15, 2015 at 16:36
  • Let us continue this discussion in chat.
    – CQM
    Commented Jun 15, 2015 at 18:01

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