122

Background

I recently posted a question on the main site, and later pointed out by another user that the question has been answered, not once, but a couple times already. Soon, I found a working solution, but I am still following that up to ask a little bit more.

The problem

However, the reason why my question got posted to SO in the first place is that I am obviously not searching well enough in order to pinpoint the exact problem I am trying to find. Specifically, I am using words vastly different from others, due to the lack of knowledge of jargon, or rather, the lack of knowledge on whether this jargon even exists. I am missing duplicates because I have poor searching skills.

Research effort

This is what PlasmaHH mentioned at his answer for How to ask a good question when I'm not sure what I'm looking for? They did not elaborate further because they concluded that they are unable to 'look into your head as for why', but for me, I am quite certain that I am unable to search for related items and words. The community wiki regarding how much research effort is expected also suggested that users should search, like mad. However, it seems to me that all searching is useless when my lack of skills directs me away from the questions I need to find.

I also searched for "stackoverflow research tips" and "stackoverflow search keywords" to no avail. I also visited different URLs but that does not answer my question.

Other miscellaneous information

I am not a native in English, which is why I am struggling in finding information in English in the first place. However, I want to make sure that in later questions, this same incident of 'duplicate due to insufficient search skill' will NEVER happen.

Question

To summarise my problem:

  • How, exactly, do I 'rephrase' a question in order to shine light onto my research, for example yielding a documentation, or popping an SO question?
  • If I am ultimately unable to search for the answer, how should I present my research effort? Specifically, how much is sufficient? Do I need to paste every single link I have opened during my research? If not, how should I filter my work?
  • Is the format used in this question, that is, the background-problem-research-miscellaneous information-question format, viable for use in the main site? If not, what are the problems lied within it?
  • Is there a comprehensive or definitive list of what errors have been made by users currently present in the Stack Overflow community? If not, is there a non-definitive list for the matter? If it is still not the case, how could I prevent myself from falling prey into traps of asking a question on SO?
  • Am I losing much on searching on DuckDuckGo instead of Google?
23
  • 19
    A good starting point, if you're not already using it, is to search Google using its site: operator. For example, with your question, searching Google using the query "remove blank parameter from URL generated by form site:stackoverflow.com" will yield hits specifically from SO. DuckDuckGo supports the same operator.
    – zcoop98
    Commented Apr 5, 2021 at 16:11
  • 51
    Props for the research effort and a comprehensible and level-headed post, not easy to come by across these days. More on point: show folks you understand what you are talking about. No amount of links will save you otherwise. As an example, If you got an error, post it verbatim. Then demonstrate the existing Q&As do not suffice: if you dump the error msg into search in quotes (optionally with site: stackoverflow.com (*varies depending on search engine), you are mostly guaranteed to find Q&As. Read the answers, write down (save somehow) possible root causes even if they are not applicable.
    – 0Valt
    Commented Apr 5, 2021 at 16:13
  • 13
    On a different note, this topic has FAQ potential. I'm honestly surprised we don't have a good list of this sort of knowledge anywhere in the FAQ already; it's not even in the "how much research is expected" one.
    – zcoop98
    Commented Apr 5, 2021 at 16:19
  • 3
    "show folks you understand what you are talking about." - Excellent point however, it requires understanding the terminology on the subject. Understanding the terminology of course is part of showing you have done the proper amount of research. Commented Apr 5, 2021 at 18:29
  • 5
    @SecurityHound - agreed, but I think at least some understanding of terminology is expected from an asker. Not specific jargon or advanced topics, of course, but at least basic knowledge. That is usually enough to ask a coherent question.
    – 0Valt
    Commented Apr 5, 2021 at 18:42
  • 3
    @OlegValter - The age old issue of understanding it enough to ask a question that makes it appear you know what the heck you are talking about (when you really don't)? Commented Apr 5, 2021 at 19:40
  • 4
    One major obstacle in finding duplicates (or questions asking something similar to you) is simply people being unable to word their titles in a way that would let you find them. It's more than just your own skill in wording questions. in order for you to find it, it too must be worded/tagged correctly.
    – Kevin B
    Commented Apr 5, 2021 at 21:07
  • 3
    This post does not reflect any research effort. You just say you got nowhere. You are just asking for us to rewrite presentations. Summarize your understanding & show how you applied it & explain how it didn't help. Take responsibility for an interpretation of what you read.
    – philipxy
    Commented Apr 6, 2021 at 3:29
  • 2
    My standard comment re searching/duplicates: Before considering posting please read the manual & google any error message & many clear, concise & precise phrasings of your question/problem/goal, with & without your particular names/strings/numbers, 'site:stackoverflow.com' & tags; read many answers. If you post a question, use one phrasing as title. Reflect your research.
    – philipxy
    Commented Apr 6, 2021 at 3:34
  • 3
    Most people on SO show no research effort at all. I would be happy to see just a very low level (say 3 search terms and summary of results) but not even that is happening usually. We are discussing here about the ideal case, which is not representative at all. In practice I would not mind at all even if you would use the wrong search terms and would not detect that your question is a duplicate as long as you presented your search. But only a minority does actually. Commented Apr 6, 2021 at 8:27
  • 11
    @Security Hound: Showing you understand what you're talking about doesn't necessarily mean knowing the terminology. Sometimes it's as simple as knowing what you're trying to do, and being able to explain interview-style (but not so rigorously), in plain English, how you think you ought to solve your problem. No code necessary.
    – BoltClock Mod
    Commented Apr 6, 2021 at 9:51
  • 1
    Just post on meta and it'll get reopened
    – Kevin B
    Commented Apr 6, 2021 at 21:42
  • 6
    How can you ensure you don't get a duplicate? You can't. There remains the possibility that someone else will, based on their greater understanding of the subject matter, make a connection to an existing question that would never have occurred to you. That's why you're posting here: to get the benefit of their greater understanding. Commented Apr 7, 2021 at 13:19
  • 2
    @TimRandall That's all true, but equally true is that many questions would not need to have been asked on SO if only people would have searched a bit more before asking. Improving search skills is important but I'm not convinced that all the people asking without showing research wanted to search but only didn't know how to do it. People may also post on SO because it's cheaper letting others do the research than doing it themselves. Commented Apr 7, 2021 at 13:50
  • 1
    In the end, if you're motivated and do your best, it doesn't matter. I have a gold badge in python, and I have asked duplicate questions about the language without realizing it, even after doing fairly rigorous research. It happens. Commented Apr 7, 2021 at 19:31

12 Answers 12

105

First, thanks for having a decent attitude. Willingness to improve is about the only skill that can't be taught.

I think it has to be said that posting a duplicate question is not a bad thing. It can be a good thing if the terms you're searching for offer a different perspective of the subject, because others in the future might have that same perspective. Your question could be the missing search result that helps someone else find the same answer you were looking for.

You didn't link the question you had asked, so I'll only say generally - a duplicate question that is well-stated can be a great signpost to help others. If your best attempt at searching didn't find the answer that's already there, then your question is exactly what we need to fill that gap.

6
  • 49
    "posting a duplicate question is not a bad thing. It can be a good thing if the terms you're searching for offer a different perspective of the subject" It would be nice if this was the attitude that SO power users actually applied, but usually when asking or googling a question you just get closed as dupe with no further explanation or acknowledgement of the questioner's explanation of their perspective (which is what lead you there). A sentence or two would make those questions useful signposts instead of just more clutter. Commented Apr 6, 2021 at 14:40
  • 10
    Apple - totally agree... I know more people that spend time searching, only to not find answers specific to their need. Power users need to acknowledge that details matter, and while there are duplicates, sometimes an answer needs to be updated/improved to really provide the best updated data. I'm amazed at how many questions have been marked duplicate, but the original answer is outdated and/or not relevant anymore.
    – Sean Haddy
    Commented Apr 6, 2021 at 15:06
  • 8
    I'm amazed at how many people think an answer is "outdated" or "irrelevant" just because it's a few years old, not because the code doesn't work... Commented Apr 6, 2021 at 22:10
  • 3
    @Appleguysnake closing a question as a duplicate isn't so bad, if the linked question is actually able to help the asker. What really harms the site is the rush to delete questions so the search engines can't find the question with the alternate wording. Commented Apr 8, 2021 at 1:50
  • 1
    @HereticMonkey I've found an answer I needed that was 2 years old on a 7 year old question. It was answer number 7 in a list of at least a dozen. Practically every answer was useful because they gave history, context, diagnostic guidance, and covered scenarios that were what someone else needed. Even old and "outdated" answers can continue providing value beyond a simple "here's the fix."
    – Booga Roo
    Commented Apr 8, 2021 at 4:42
  • @MarkRansom Yeah, I'm not against the idea, but like you said it's the rush. In my case, I linked the canonical question and specified why the new question/answer was different and what wasn't covered, but it was just ignored. Most of the power users don't seem to read or comment on many of the questions they close. It's a shame because if that's the desired result, we could easily create a bot to do that, but instead people waste their real human time and energy doing mundane cleanup work. Commented Apr 8, 2021 at 14:18
24

I want to make sure 'duplicate due to insufficient searching' will NEVER happen again.

You can't avoid this entirely. Your goal should just be to reduce how often it happens, and try to understand how someone might've found the original for every duplicate closure of your own questions and questions of others.

Duplicates are also not always a bad thing. Sometimes posts are just really hard to find and having another post with a different phrasing pointing to it could help others find it.

I am not a native in English, which is why I am struggling in finding information in English in the first place.

English-speaking ability is important, but searching is also a skill in and of itself that improves as you do more searching.

How, exactly, do I 'rephrase' a question to get better search results?

You could try rephrasing your question by putting it into a different grammatical tense or using a synonym or something, but it's often going to be more helpful to come up with searches that approach the problem from different angles or more or less broadly.

These could all be different ways to search for the same problem:

Why does {string format function F} return {value R} when given {input I} in Python?
Why does {similar format function F2 that's more commonly used} return {value R} when given {input I} in Python?
Why is {input I} formatted as {value R} in Python?
Why does string formatting return {value R} for {input I} in Python?

Here are a few more you could try, but I would expect such rephrasings to be less likely to give you the answer than the above:

Why does {function F} return {value R} in Python?
Why is {function F} returning {value R} in Python?
When would {function F} return {value R} in Python?
Why doesn't {function F} work when I pass it {input I} in Python?
Why doesn't {function F} work when given {input I} in Python?

How do I find documentation?

You typically don't find documentation by rephrasing your question.

You find documentation by specifically searching for it.

Often you can type just the name of a function or class (plus the language or API and "docs" or "api") into Google and one of the top links will be the official documentation (or the documentation used by most people, which may not be the official documentation).

If you know what the official documentation is called or its URL, you could add that to your search as well (possibly with site:...) if you can't find it another way.

How should I present my research effort in a question?

The goal of presenting research effort should primarily be to help others understand and answer the question.

First and foremost, you should try to address anything people are likely to point you towards (such as documentation or highly related posts) and explain why those don't answer your question. This could be 0 links or 5 links; there isn't a clear rule here, because it depends on what you actually found.

If you just have a list of links (and explanations) somewhere in your question, you probably shouldn't have more than say 3 links there. Although it's usually better to try to integrate the links into your post so it flows naturally. In that case there isn't really a clear upper limit on number of links (although 3 is probably still a good rule of thumb and you should question whether all links are important if you find yourself adding more).

Failing that, you could also just say you couldn't find anything too closely related and the closest you found was X, Y and Z.

Although providing links is only really necessary when the links actually add some important context to the question. I wouldn't add links just for the sake of adding links.

"Research effort" also includes debugging, constructing a minimal example, digging a bit deeper (by say trying some different inputs) to really get to the heart of the issue and taking the time to write a good, clear and concise question that's specific enough to be easily answerable, but that's also written in a way that would help others who have the same problem.

What format should the question be in?

The background-problem-research-miscellaneous information-question format used in this question is okay.

I'm not personally such a big fan of adding headings as a rule to all questions, as this makes it easier to add a lot of optional information that isn't actually necessary to answer the question and it would be better if that information were just removed altogether. It also means you might put less effort into structuring your question in a way that's easy to read from top to bottom.

Good questions are often short (while providing all necessary context) and well-structured to a point where headings isn't necessary at all and adding them might even make the question worse.

Things like "Example", "Input", "Output" or "Code" (if the code block isn't enough already) might make for useful headings though. It could be helpful to provide a clear separator between the more sentence-focused part of the question and some raw data (and obviously to tell people what the data actually is).

This is far from a rule though and may be a bit more subjective. I would judge it on a case-by-case basis. I'd suggest looking at other questions, seeing what other people do (and how they edit your question) and seeing what you find particularly easy to read to guide you in formatting your questions.

Is there a list of question-writing errors others have made? How could I avoid the same mistakes?

There are probably way too many different types of mistakes you can make in writing a question to list here.

Read through the Help Center, check the Meta tag and pay attention to the comments, votes, closure and edits on your question and other questions. If a question is received poorly or received well, try to understand why and learn from that.

It would also help to engage with the Meta community and read lots of other random Meta posts, although that's probably less important.

Making some mistakes is okay. The more important parts are doing sufficient research, into the question you have, into the broader topic it's about and into SO and how to ask questions and what's appropriate here, before asking a question and not making the same mistakes multiple times.

Am I losing much on searching on {insert search engine} instead of Google?

You're almost certainly at least making it a bit harder to find what you're looking for.

I would expect most of the major search engines to at least do a moderately okay job of returning relevant results, but you could always try Google if the others aren't giving you the results you're looking for.

0
20

A question that has been marked as a duplicate isn't necessarily bad.

A correctly marked duplicate (with different wording) will act as a proxy to its duplicate target.

This is helpful for everybody - it means that people who call a certain method/technology/whatever by that different term will be able to find the answer they're looking for after your question has been closed.

When this happens - congratulations! You've just successfully made it easier for people in the future to find the answer to their question which is the entire point of the site. Your contribution in that case is useful, desired, and welcome.

The "bad" duplicates are the ones that use the same wording, or generally fail to contribute any extra useful keywords that may help search engines out. These are the ones that show a lack of research effort and are a burden to those who contribute answers to this site. People (question askers and answerers alike) are far too quick to assume that ANY duplicate is of this category. But if you've done your googling and Stack Overflow's suggestions when making the question don't help then as far as I'm concerned, you're in the clear.

Your question being marked as duplicate is not an insult, nor does it necessarily imply that anybody on Stack Overflow is upset or angry at you. It's just another way of having your question answered.

6
  • 5
    Why do you think this is an unpopular opinion? I would only say what I firmly believe is true: duplicates are neither good nor bad, they just are. If they are useful (a unique situation, for example), they are good, if not - they are bad (no matter how many keywords they add).
    – 0Valt
    Commented Apr 7, 2021 at 1:11
  • 3
    @OlegValter it's merely based on observations. Askers (such as the one above) either do everything they can to avoid them, or get angry/confused/hurt when their precious question is marked as one. Answerers rant about them both here and on various socials. I'd argue that the perceived "toxicity" of stackoverflow comes in no small part from this misunderstanding on what a duplicate is.
    – Shadow
    Commented Apr 7, 2021 at 1:27
  • 1
    I just meant that it is probably less unpopular than you think :) Look at the answers in the Q&A, all are in favour of duplicates as long as they comply with general guidelines. Regarding avoiding closure - I think this is mostly a conditioned response to how help desk sites / bug trackers work (which askers are usually more familiar with) where "closure" means "being resolved". They submit a ticket, get a response, and a mod marks the issue as resolved. So when they and are hit with the closure here on SO, they consider it as a hostile action. That is very similar to your point, though.
    – 0Valt
    Commented Apr 7, 2021 at 14:31
  • @OlegValter it arguably is exactly my point :P Perhaps it's a terminology issue then - I wonder if they'd receive it in a hostile manner if "Closed" got renamed to "Resolved"...
    – Shadow
    Commented Apr 7, 2021 at 22:39
  • :) Methinks this rename would not work as only for the duplicate closure it means "resolved" as I am sure you know. SE is very unlikely to add a whole 1 conditional check for just rendering a word differently. Something tells me there is nothing we can do to remedy the "hostile" feeling they get until we remedy the root cause: the awful onboarding system and lackluster quality checks for new questions (a better dupe suggesting system would go a long way in reducing the number of duplicate questions in my opinion).
    – 0Valt
    Commented Apr 7, 2021 at 22:45
  • 1
    Closing a question as a duplicate indeed increases the discoverability of a solution. This is a good thing, not a problem. What we need to fix instead is this: 1 Better communicate to askers, why their question is still valuable, even if closed. 2 Produce a better pool canonical Q&A's we can refer to. Commented Apr 15, 2021 at 22:54
14

Web search for the problem that you are having at any given point should not be your only option. Believe it or not, people learned how to write software before the Internet.

Also, the Internet is, to some degree, part of the problem, since there is so much inaccurate and blatantly incorrect information on the Web.

For many beginners, the problem is that they don't know the language and/or framework well enough yet. Exhaust all of the reference materials you can find first, whether they come from the Web or in print.

Asking a question on Stack Overflow should be the last resort, especially for beginners, because it's odds-on that their question has been asked already.

9
  • 2
    Most SO answers are vetted - to a fault sometimes (but I think that's a good thing). Most other "answers" on the Internet must be scrutinized a little more. If you are a cut-and-paste developer, and don't actually understand the code you are "using" (other than renaming variables to get it to "compile"), you deserve what you get. Even utilized SO code should be understood.
    – franji1
    Commented Apr 6, 2021 at 19:07
  • 2
    This doesn't answer the question. The OP is asking how to do better at research, and all this is saying is to "do more research", not how to do it better. Commented Apr 6, 2021 at 23:36
  • Also this is only true for some tags - try researching Microsoft Graph APIs when the tech changes so fast and the docs aren't even kept up to date Commented Apr 7, 2021 at 0:32
  • 1
    "Web search for the problem that you are having at any given point should not be your only option". What are the other options you have in mind? I've been a computer nerd for 30+ years. At this point, almost 100% of my available documentation is on the internet. I sold or gave away my hard copy books long ago. Are you not suggesting the use of off-internet resources, but rather just saying that there's a different mechanism for finding what you need on the internet besides "web search"? What are you really suggesting here? ( btw, I agree with the general sentiment of this post.)
    – CryptoFool
    Commented Apr 7, 2021 at 14:39
  • 2
    I am amazed at questions like "is it possible to do X with Y". I was taught at an early age to just try doing X with Y first, then ask if what I was doing was possible (or rather, how to do what I wanted to do, noting that I had tried doing X with Y and was unable). I don't need the internet for that. Just the language and a compiler/environment in which to run it. I wouldn't have thought of using the language without having read the reference materials first. I read the HTML spec before starting as a web developer many years ago. It was easier, because it was a lot shorter :). Commented Apr 7, 2021 at 14:59
  • 2
    @HereticMonkey - probably a different breed of people. I never feel compelled to ask a question as 99% of the problems can eventually be figured out by oneself, but it seems like this is not the way for many. Something tells me this behavior is tied to being impatient (which is a critical skill to lack in dev in my opinion, but it seems like it is a widespread thing)
    – 0Valt
    Commented Apr 7, 2021 at 15:06
  • 2
    @OlegValter True. It's really about where you turn when you're curious. My first avenue is toward myself; trying to figure out the answer, getting sidetracked discovering 10 other things I didn't know along the way to finding it... Nothing better to my mind. Others hate that; their first avenue is the phone, either to ask someone or get online to ask virtually. Rarely to look something up on Wikipedia or some other reference. Oh well. Takes all kinds. Commented Apr 7, 2021 at 15:13
  • 3
    "Asking a question on Stack Overflow should be the last resort, especially for beginners, because it's odds-on that their question has been asked already." Statistically speaking it may well be. There may be lots of beginners who just engage read-only with SO and the large number of repeatedly asked question might actually come from a minority of beginners but because there may be so many beginners, that's what we got. But probably there is still margin available. Beginners could search still more (and better but mostly more I guess) before asking. Commented Apr 7, 2021 at 15:33
  • 2
    @HereticMonkey yeah... That said, what would we all do without this type of people for constructive procrastination? :) Seems like an ecosystem (although I am starting to worry about its well-being as the balance is clearly shifting towards askers).
    – 0Valt
    Commented Apr 7, 2021 at 15:33
12

How can I make sure the question I'm going to post is not going to be duplicate?

You cannot. No search system is perfect and there are millions of questions on Stack Overflow and some might be worded much differently from what you might expect. Don't try something that is impossible.

Try instead to minimize the chances of your question to become a duplicate by doing and showing a decent amount of research. That is totally within your control and would already be way more than what most of question creators do. If I personally have the impression that you did your research, I'm more than willing to help out with my expertise and point you to the right location as long as you learn from the answers and next time ask and search even better.

Some useful practical tips:

  • General questions are likely already been asked. The more basic your level of understanding of a topic is, the more likely you are to ask a question that already has been asked by others before. Don't do that. Instead, search a lot and only then ask. The less you know the more you should search and read and the less you should ask. (Current lived practice on Stack Overflow is different.)
  • Don't rely on Stack Overflow alone as learning resource. Tap into other knowledge bases as well (books, tutorials, ...) to expand your knowledge and the amount of search terms available.
  • Everyone has a different opinion about the sufficient amount of research and the goal should not be to only do an sufficient amount but rather a good amount, but I think that searching for say 20 minutes and citing as well as discussing the 3-5 best research results you found sounds like a decent amount of research that I would approve of. This includes the reasoning why the search results didn't solve your problem. Of course if you didn't find anything relevant, you should only present the used search terms.
  • I use DuckDuckGo and Google and from my experience they both present results from Stack Overflow quite prominently and typically both give relevant results. I would be fine with you using either of them.
5
  • "there are millions of questions" - Millions is nothing. Seriously. That's a tiny corpus. It's a database that fits into RAM. On my mobile phone. "No search system is perfect" - Yes. But there's a wide spectrum between "being perfect" and "being completely and utterly useless". Stack Overflow's search engine has consistently been in the latter department. It gets 4 out of 5 suggested tags wrong. It never produces significant duplicate/search results. And all that within a mind-numbingly constrained search space. I'm at a total loss how SO accomplishes to get it this wrong. Commented Apr 15, 2021 at 23:09
  • 2
    @IInspectable "Millions is nothing." Then try to memorize them. They may fit into your mobile phone but certainly not in your brain. The point I wanted to make is that most people will need to rely on search engines and even the best search engines aren't good enough to reliably return relevant information. It's even worse for not so good search engines. Commented Apr 16, 2021 at 10:55
  • 1
    Agreed that the number of questions makes it difficult to find duplicates. Many questions are duplicates because the issue / code is equivalent, not identical. Search engines usually do not offer that level of abstraction. Naive searches without knowing what to look for are very hard in these cases. Commented Apr 16, 2021 at 11:11
  • 2
    @MisterMiyagi At least two times I was so close to ask a question but found the solution on the stackexchange network only at the last second because I missed crucial keywords and search engines don't process fuzzy walls of text well. Maybe I should have pushed the ask button and immediately voted to close as duplicate, just to have one more differently worded search target available. Commented Apr 16, 2021 at 11:24
  • 1
    Search engines are great, almost indispensable even. Not a question. The point is, that Stack Overflow's search engine is complete garbage. Its relevance has been consistently outperformed by just about any general purpose search engine. Engines, that cannot assume that "Python" doesn't refer to a reptile, "Cargo" is not a synonym for freight, and "Windows" has nothing to do with buildings. With a search space this narrow, and historic data that spans more than a decade, one would assume that SO's search engine would reliable generate relevant results. It doesn't, it just right out sucks. Commented Apr 16, 2021 at 11:25
8

I recently posted a question on the main site, and later pointed out by another user that the question has been answered, not once, but a couple times already.

Yes this happens very frequently, since the site is mature and most questions have already been asked.

I am obviously not searching well enough in order to pinpoint the exact problem I am trying to find.

Maybe, maybe not. If you have tried searching in your book/manual, on SO and on Google, but came up with nothing still, then go ahead and ask. That's already far more research effort than the average user puts into their questions. Do mention your research efforts so far though, when posting the question.

I am missing duplicates because I have poor searching skills.

Or more likely, because finding duplicates on SO is a nightmare, even for veteran users. The search system and the auto-suggestion system are mediocre at best. Partially since they are based on titles and tags.

If I were for example trying to search for the all-time #1 FAQ in the C language, I would type "why should I not mix ++ with other operators [c]" and then hit search. All that search yields is irrelevant nonsense.

If I type the same in Google, I get a lot of relevant links directly, none of them from SO. After re-phrasing it a bit I found a duplicate on Quora. Still nothing on SO.


Turns out that searching on SO is a special snowflake which requires lots of site experience. What I should have done was: click on the tag I'm interested (in this case ). Then list posts after "More" -> "Frequent". And there a dupe to the question is listed. But not even this obscurely hidden "frequent" feature is useful, because it uses two metrics:

  • How often a post is linked by users, and
  • How often a post is used as a duplicate target.

But we are really just interested in the 2nd of those, so - tough luck, we probably can't use this list either. And unfortunately, it can't be applied to search results. Instead we are left to the mercy of what the site calls "relevance matching".

Now what you would do to actually find a lot of FAQ questions is to find out the topic-specific FAQ, if such a beast exists. This is sneakily hidden too, in different places depending on what topic you are interested in, though usually you might find it if you go and read the "tag wiki" of the topic you are interested in. Click on a tag -> click on "more info". In some cases there is a FAQ on that site, with links to relevant SO posts.

Obviously, we can't expect new users to know any of this or find their way there by themselves.


And now to address your specific questions:

How, exactly, do I 'rephrase' a question in order to shine light onto my research, for example yielding a documentation, or popping an SO question?

You can't. With some luck the site will suggest you relevant candidates for duplicate when you type in a title, but that's by no means guaranteed.

If I am ultimately unable to search for the answer, how should I present my research effort? Specifically, how much is sufficient?

It would be sufficient just to mention that you have tried searching on SO and the web, really. Or the "canonical" source for whatever technology you are searching for, the official documentation etc.

But more importantly, demonstrate what you have done so far by actually showing it! Since this is a programming site, you'll often have source code, scripts, search queries or similar that you've tried. Those are the most important of all to include.

Is the format used in this question, that is, the background-problem-research-miscellaneous information-question format, viable for use in the main site?

Yes, it is structured and easy to read. It's a good question, certainly. The missing piece is the code, which is often needed when you ask about trouble-shooting or debugging. If you can illustrate what you have tried by posting your code - even if it's completely broken, then that usually say more than anything you can describe with words.

See How to create a Minimal, Reproducible Example .

Is there a comprehensive or definitive list of what errors have been made by users currently present in the Stack Overflow community?

As I demonstrated at the start of this post. Yes... probably, but not easy to find. Looking at your main user, you seem mainly interested in HTML. One would then suspect that checking the HTML tag wiki would yield something of value, but nope, it's a pretty bleak one. So you'll have to find some veteran user of that specific tag and ask them. Cumbersome and hard to do. You could ask on meta or you could perhaps jump into one of the web-related chats: https://chat.stackoverflow.com/?tab=site&host=stackoverflow.com. I'd expect that the folks in the PHP or JavaScript chats can point you in the right direction for example, if those chats are active.

Am I losing much on searching on DuckDuckGo instead of Google?

It's certainly better than the on-site search on SO. But other than that, I can't tell. For the single example I used above, Google gave decent results, SO search and DuckDuckGo didn't.

1
  • 1
    Yes, DuckDuckGo is definitely of lower quality (Bing behind the scenes?), but in many (most?) cases it is good enough. Commented Apr 6, 2021 at 21:47
6

First, duplicates aren't necessarily bad. And original questions aren't necessarily good, often because they're so trivial and/or hyper-specific that no one else has had the gall to post such a thing before ("how do I subtract 1009 from 120?" "why do I get an error when I try to run the compiler's version information banner as code?"). If your question has a duplicate but you did your research and couldn't find it, perhaps someone else will one day do similar research until they search for the wording you used on your question, which will lead them to the question you asked, which will then connect them to the duplicate they couldn't find.

But how much research? What kind of research? What are the duplicates like? I don't know the question you asked that got closed and prompted this (I'm not gonna do the research), but the tag I frequent is Python. Most questions are asked by people taking an introductory programming course or, at best, using Python to complete a task in some non-programming field. As you might expect, most of those questions could've been answered by reading the slides the instructor handed out, or reading some documentation, or continuing through the relevant portion of a tutorial, or a Google search, or a variety of similar activities that people are expected to undertake before asking a question.

If your question is homework-related, did you look at those slides? Did you talk to the teacher? Did you look at the textbook? Programming classes aren't teaching wild new things; they provide static instructional material like slides or a book, they pose basic tasks that rely on that material, and they expect you to use what you learned from such to solve the tasks. So, before you post a new question on homework, ask yourself, "is this in the book?" And the answer should always be "yes." (In fact, the last programming class I took provided so much of what's known in education as "scaffolding" that each week's homework consisted of opening the example modules, writing our name, adding a sample run, and turning it in. I'm not even kidding. Ask me how much I learned from my homework about FTP, threading, and SQL. NOTHING.) Homework questions are ostensibly acceptable here, but I know of no way to post a useful, original homework question that couldn't be answered by using the textbook or other resources at a student's disposal, most especially the teacher. If you're taking a course with an inadequate textbook/slides/etc. and there's no teacher to talk to, it's time to look for alternatives. Stack Overflow is not intended to fill that kind of gap.

If you're past the homework stage, that's great. Have you read the manual? Official (or de facto official) documentation is super easy to find these days, and a lot of it is actually quite good (particularly the Python docs - the official Python tutorial is the best programming tutorial I've seen - for any language). If you're having trouble with a certain feature of a language, framework, or API, the docs are your best bet.

If you've read the manual and something doesn't seem to be working the way it should be, it's time to search the web, the results of which are likely to include Stack Overflow questions. Search with the name of the language/etc. you're using and a few keywords, the more specific the better. If you're experiencing "Error 0x9500DE," definitely include that. If you're having trouble with the if or and keywords... not as useful, but try anyway. Be more specific if possible, with e.g. "if statement." Use quotes to search for an exact phrase in most search engines. I recently took nearly eight minutes to find the right duplicate for a question like that, and I only found it by searching for phrases that would be in the answer. There's no shame in having something like that marked as a duplicate.

If I'm looking for a duplicate question to close a new question, I'll use a search query like site:stackoverflow.com <language/etc.> keyword1 [keyword2, keyword3... ] and often come up with something relevant.

And if all else fails, before you actually post your new question, copy the title you intend to use and paste it into a search engine. You'd be surprised how often people post a question and wait a few minutes for an answer when they could've gotten an instant answer with even less effort. I've marked more than a few duplicates that way, and it's not a good look for the asker.

TL;DR:

  • Do your own homework
  • Read the manual
  • Use a search engine
  • Try [site:stackoverflow.com] <language/etc.> keyword1 [keyword2, keyword3...]
  • Put the title into a search engine
3

I looked at your previous questions and I agree with you that you are missing some jargon. (We all are, so don't feel bad about it.)

I find it helpful to assume that there is always at least one term for whatever I'm doing, and probably more than one, because with English there usually is. With that in mind you can search for what terms/jargon you should use as part of writing your question. Sometimes even just that search puts me on the correct path to solving my original problem, or at least helps me sound like I know what I'm talking about.

For example, I might search for "parts of a URL" and find "parameters" and "query string" or search for "part of url after question mark" and find this question with answers suggesting "query string", which would have helped you find the duplicates of your original questions.

2

I think the most efficient choice is searching by tag and keyword with Stack Overflow's internal search function. See How do I search?.

Say you are searching for a functionality described by a set of keywords that uses a dictionary in the Python language, and you only want to look at questions

[python] [dictionary] sort order is:q

or

[python] [dictionary] code:"popitem" is:q

You can also take a look at what tags are available at

https://stackoverflow.com/tags

By using this approach you get an immediate estimate of what SO has on a subject and you can further refine it. Google is good when searching for direct hits but for a broad overview I think SO's internal search is better.

3
  • 7
    Ideally, this would be true: since Stack Overflow knows more about their content than Google does, the search engine should be much better. In particular, Google is a search engine for natural language, but a significant portion of Stack Overflow content is not natural language, it is code. Alas, that is not the case: both developers and representatives of the company management have repeatedly admitted that search sucks and they have no intention to fix it, and have literally told people to use Google instead. Commented Apr 6, 2021 at 3:50
  • 3
    For example, searching for [ruby] &: returns over 11000 results, and the first relevant one is number 565. I filed this as a bug already during the private beta in 2008, and I was told then, and several times after that, that it isn't considered a bug because "Google ignores symbols, and so we don't need to care about them either". As long as people in a decision-making position don't even understand that Google and Stack Overflow are two different things, I have no hope for search. Commented Apr 6, 2021 at 4:06
  • 1
    Hi @JörgWMittag I'm aware there are some inconsistencies with SE's search but thus far I haven't been overly affected by them. Yes I tend to rely on the search functionalities that I know work, the other search features that aren't completely consistent I use with care (like diacritics, searching in code, etc) and normally incurring in more work when searching. I have written a couple of posts on such bugs but never published them...Perhaps it's time to ask the company to revisit these issues.
    – bad_coder
    Commented Apr 6, 2021 at 12:08
2

Am I losing much on searching on DuckDuckGo instead of Google?

Almost certainly. I've personally found DDG close to useless for searching for programming-related content, whereas Google gets it right most of the time. When I have to do any programming-related searches, I generally open an incognito window to Google, do my search there, and copy the links into my standard privacy-hardened browser (yes I'm aware that Google transforms its search result links to track you; there are browser extensions that undo this).

1
  • I have been using Duck Duck Go as my preferred search engine for about a year, but I still occasionally fall back to Google when the results don't look like I expect. For me, this is rare enough that I haven't switched back (maybe on the order or 1/500 searches? And then of course sometimes Google draws a blank, too). My searches tend to include site:stackoverflow.com if I am specifically searching for a duplicate on SO.
    – tripleee
    Commented Apr 7, 2021 at 16:25
2

Don't feel bad about posting a question that gets marked as a duplicate.

In XSLT-land, many people make the mistake of not realising that they need to take the default namespace of the source document into account. The consequences of this mistake are highly varied (generally, wrong output or no output). Unless you know that you've fallen into this trap, there's no way anyone will formulate the question in such a way that you'll find the existing answers.

So we get lots of different questions with the same answer, and because it's the same problem every time, we mark them as duplicates, even though the questions are expressed in completely different ways. It's not intended as a criticism of the person who posted the question.

1

Premise challenge: Duplicates are Good

Every time someone can't figure out the right combination of words to find the answer and post a new question and get closed as duplicated, they make it easier for others to find the canonical answers.

Contrived example:

You want to concatenate two strings. You don't know the correct terms for it and thus are unable to find the "How do I concatenate multiple strings?" question, because you are searching for "How do I join two pieces of text?"

You go on Stack Overflow and post the question. It gets closed as a duplicate.

Now every time someone searches for "How do I join two pieces of text?", your question will show up with a link to the canonical question. Duplicates are almost as valuable as originals to searchers, as long as some homework has been done before posting.

18
  • 6
    Duplicates are Good - I disagree. We absolutely don't want a blanket statement to encourage redundant content. If the dupe target is not grabbing researchers by the eyeballs, improve the old content/question/title/answers to give search engines something more to chew on. Let's not have so many identical eggs in so many baskets. As a careful researcher, I want all of the good stuff on a single page, so that I can make a quick comparison of all of the working techniques. We need: 1. Askers to research more before posting 2. Answerers to hunt more for duplicates before answering. Commented Apr 6, 2021 at 3:35
  • 7
    @mickmackusa: That is exactly what duplicates do: they are different ways to phrase the same question, all pointing to all the good stuff on a single page. Commented Apr 6, 2021 at 3:39
  • 3
    @JörgWMittag Yes, they make a large pool/mess of redundant insights and I need to visit 10 different pages to be sure that I am seeing all of the unique techniques to solve a specific task. This damages my researcher experience. SO badly needs to condense its sprawling redundant content into fewer, well-constructed pages. If a "master" page doesn't have all of the different vernacular/keywords to help SEO, then add those few key words to the post(s) on the "master" page. This is a much less "expensive" endeavor versus retaining whole redundant pages. Commented Apr 6, 2021 at 3:41
  • 8
    @mickmackusa As a careful researcher --> let me stop you there. Not everyone on the planet is a careful researcher. Up until a few months ago, I had no idea what the word "concatenate" meant. So I searched up "How do I join two pieces of text", with no Stack results.
    – 10 Rep
    Commented Apr 6, 2021 at 3:43
  • 6
    Anyone who has spent more than a year on SO will know that duplicates are not hammered fast enough and there is an insane amount of redundant answers here. Commented Apr 6, 2021 at 3:43
  • 1
    @10Rep By having a "master" page that uses all of the vernacular, less-than-careful researchers will find what they are looking for AND learn all of the relevant vernacular. We don't need 10 redundant pages to serve this purpose. It is trivial to edit the question or an answer with the text "How do I join two pieces of text" (whatever in more appropriate on a case-by-case basis) so that specific phrases can be found. I have answered questions (recently) where I re-phrased the OP's question in my answer just to add more keywords (and I edited the OP's title and body). Commented Apr 6, 2021 at 3:44
  • 4
    "Premise challenge" - The premise you use is flawed: duplicates are neither good nor bad by themselves, the only intrinsic property they have is that they already have answers elsewhere. Unique, well-written questions that happen to be answered in another Q&A are the only "good" duplicates there are. Keeping garbage that is just worded differently because it is better for SEO is optimizing for the wrong audience.
    – 0Valt
    Commented Apr 6, 2021 at 3:47
  • @10Rep - "how do I join two pieces of text" is not the level that I consider we should sink to. I already argued that some basic knowledge about the topic is expected of any programmer/researcher. Like knowing how basic data types are called properly as well as basic operations like concatenation. Don't get me wrong, we all need to start somewhere, but I honestly do not think SO should be the go-to resource for learning from scratch. This is better left to tutorials, blog posts, official and unofficial docs, books (ordered by increasing usefulness).
    – 0Valt
    Commented Apr 6, 2021 at 4:05
  • 2
    @10Rep I'll grant you, there are industry-specific terms that I don't expect a novice to know. I've lost count of how many times I inform a user that they are trying to "transpose" array data. This is why I am happy to add the tag and and make sure that the word "transpose" is found in either the question or an answer. I disagree with Oleg in that we shouldn't bother explaining things in most basic/novice terms. I feel this is one of the great opportunities to bridge the vernacular gap. With every new page that a researcher visits, I expect they will gain ideas on how to improve their search. Commented Apr 6, 2021 at 5:05
  • 1
    There will be thousands of researchers that don't know what a "lookup"/"dictionary" is, what a "pivot" is, and what "concatenation", "truncation", "obfuscation", etc are. We must not "talk above" novices, for best stack sharing we need to communicate to newbies and veterans alike. We can never assume "common sense" -- the world has become so diverse that there is no common sense anymore. Commented Apr 6, 2021 at 5:08
  • @mickmackusa - I didn't mean it the way we should never explain the terminology or not be searchable with plain English terms, but I wanted to stress that some familiarity with programming concepts is expected of everyone (see the search modified "join two strings": i.sstatic.net/9O7hH.png, concatenation is everywhere). For example, "list comprehension" is not a universal term, but "string", "integer", "float" are.
    – 0Valt
    Commented Apr 6, 2021 at 14:48
  • 3
    Concat and join were a purposefully contrived example. Any real example would be specific to some domain knowledge which would make my point confusing. Commented Apr 6, 2021 at 15:33
  • @SlavaKnyazev - I understand the example is contrived (you said so yourself), but lacking a better example, I have to give rebuttals using what's in the post. I hope on Meta, we are decent enough not to be confused by domain knowledge when they see one. What I am also worried about is that despite your intention to maintain a level of standard what, should the policy be adopted, it will cater to a lowest common denominator instead. P.s. I have a hunch those at a level where they understand what is domain knowledge or not have no issues with coming up with the correct terminology/jargon.
    – 0Valt
    Commented Apr 6, 2021 at 15:39
  • 1
    @OlegValter Another example: The portion of a url after the # is called a "fragment". In my day-to-day dev life, this doesn't seem especially well-known. Most people I know refer to it as the "hash", "hashtag" or "bookmark". As a result of the obscurity, we have 2 questions (one of which should've been closed as duplicate imo): stackoverflow.com/q/298503/4088472, stackoverflow.com/q/11662693/4088472 If the canonical question would've been "How do I access the the URI fragment?", searching for "How do I access the hash in the url" would never bring it up. Commented Apr 6, 2021 at 19:37
  • @SlavaKnyazev - ironically, the "fragment identifier" was added by a user 5 years later, and they preserved the "hash" version (which is common, I don't know anyone who'd refer to it other than that in a context that doesn't require rigorous definition). The questions exist not because of the obscurity of "hash" against "fragment" Duplicates are defined by the applicability of their answers. You can't use any without a rewrite. One group is talking about "testing for #", the other - "extracting the value". These are very different tasks that only intersect because of the common theme.
    – 0Valt
    Commented Apr 6, 2021 at 19:47

You must log in to answer this question.

Not the answer you're looking for? Browse other questions tagged .