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I recently answered this question of type

"I have a large number of [complicated objects] and need to calculate [complicated algorithm] which should run as fast as possible."

After a first answer with general hints and suggestions I got OP's comment:

"What is O(log n)?"

I figured that OP needs a complete working solution and anything less like general tips are worthless.

In this case I prepared a complete working O(log n) algorithm and learned quite a lot during the journey.

On the other hand I felt a more appropriate answer would be

"Go back to university, learn about algorithms and data structures before you try to tackle a problem like this"

What should I do in these cases?

Not answer at all?

Delete a first yet incomplete answer?

Answer with a prepared text "Go learn!"?

Any advices?

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    Just answer their comment by pointing them to places giving a broad overview and starting-point to answer that additional question, with a friendly hint that this new question is a tad broad to tack it on. And even if the OP needs lots of remedial schooling, that does not mean your answer was not good before. Just that "lacks minimal understanding" or nowadays simply "too broad" might have been (or still be) an appropriate close-reason. Commented Jan 31, 2015 at 14:57
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    The question this was duped to is very different. The other one was about questions that show a lack of basic understanding. This is about what to do if a poster does not understand an answer. Commented Feb 1, 2015 at 1:27
  • Sounds like the question was almost certainly Too Broad, and should have been closed as such.
    – Servy
    Commented Feb 2, 2015 at 15:07
  • Minor comment: A question about a "fastest" algorithm does not necessarily relate to algorithmic complexity. People who ask this probably think in practical terms: Given these data or these parameters, which algorithm will need the least amount of time? In such a concrete situation, the algorithm with the higher complexity may still turn out to be the faster one.
    – A. Donda
    Commented Feb 2, 2015 at 15:12
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    If they answer with another question like 'What is -term you just mentioned-, it's an extra sign to abandon the question. OP is clearly someone who asks before searching, and those discussions can go on forever. People who are willing to put some effort can easily search for any part of your answer they don't understand.
    – GolezTrol
    Commented Feb 3, 2015 at 14:28

7 Answers 7

93

Keep in mind that your answer is not just for the OP. The goal of this site is to build a repository of questions and answers that can benefit a lot of people.

Therefore, I would keep answering the questions on the level you find appropriate. Provide the highest quality answer you can, making it as useful as possible to everybody who might come across it later. If this involves concepts that the OP does not understand, that's... unfortunate. But I don't think it's a reason to change anything.

To put it differently, the level of the answer should match the level of the question. If somebody asks a very basic question, the target audience for the answer are people with relatively little background knowledge on the topic. So you should make an effort to write an answer that is easy to understand. If on the other hand somebody asks an expert level question, it is perfectly appropriate to expect readers of your answer to be familiar with related concepts.

In your example, if somebody asks for an efficient algorithm, I think it's perfectly appropriate to expect readers of your answer to understand the basic notation for specifying the complexity of an algorithm.

If comments by the OP make you realize that they are missing the background knowledge needed to fully understand your answer, that's most definitely not a reason to delete it. Or even change it a whole lot. Of course if you can easily make it more understandable without compromising the quality, you should. Otherwise, in a case like this, I would respond to the comment with something like:

This notation is used to describe the complexity of the algorithm. Explaining it in detail is beyond the scope of this answer. You should be able to find information about it by searching for terms like "algorithm", "complexity" and "big O notation".

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    Totally agree with this. Even if the answer to a difficult question is over the original asker's head, it could still be very useful to others. Commented Feb 1, 2015 at 3:18
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    This is actually the point I was making. Inspire the OP to learn more, don't give dumb comments like "Go back to University". Commented Feb 3, 2015 at 10:16
  • And feel free to improve the quality of the question (and help your glorious answer along its way to the notoriety it deserves).
    – John Mee
    Commented Feb 3, 2015 at 11:39
  • Top notch answer!
    – user692942
    Commented Feb 3, 2015 at 14:31
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Don't tell them to go back to school...

Tell them that the answers to their follow up questions are most likely just a quick search away, and if they can't find what they're looking for, they can always ask a new question.

Answer the question asked, and only answer follow up questions that you feel are within the scope of the original question and your answer.

Bottom line - don't feel obligated to hold someone's hand through their entire project.

17

Answer in the way you see most fit. I'd personally discourage a fully working solution simply because the person doesn't understand the concept; that only offers them an opportunity to copy and paste what you've done into whatever they're doing.

Adding a wee bit of clarification to an answer that has to do with some fundamentals (Big-O, algorithms, design patterns, etc) is fine; provide a link or resource in the answer itself. If they are asking more inane follow-up questions, don't feel obligated to reply to them.

2

You are allowed to give an answer that will obviously sail clear over OP's head. If the question is independently interesting, I'd suggest doing this.

You are also allowed to mark a question "too broad" for any reason or no reason. The reason here would be that giving an answer to the question that assumes no more background knowledge than the poster has will result in an answer that fits SO's format poorly. I would advise using "too broad" rather than a custom close reason such as "this question is boring and its poster lacks the background to understand its answer" even if the latter is what you actually meant.

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  • Just for the logs: I found the question interesting. The solution just needs more knowledge than immediately obvious.
    – DrKoch
    Commented Feb 3, 2015 at 16:19
  • @DrKoch: Then I think you did the right thing. You aren't obligated to guide OP into full understanding.
    – tmyklebu
    Commented Feb 3, 2015 at 19:02
1

Key-point here is how to behave further (after you realize OP knowledge needs much more work from you to help him):

  1. Leave answer. Deleting answer only make sense if it's wrong, duplicate, clearly stated by OP to be unhelpful (perhaps when question is not clear and OP has not that problem you are helping him with), etc.

The answer is still useful to someone who is trying to solve same problem and who is knowing more than OP.

  1. Become a silence. If OP can't get clarification from you directly, then he is going to solve it in other ways: he will google for not-clear parts of your answer or he will ask another question, or maybe someone else will help it (at the end very detailed answer may appears, yours is still ok for those who don't need that much details).

  2. Guide. Short comment what he should learn to be able to understand your answer is really quick and very helpful, as it gives directions immediately and makes your answer more complete.

DO NOT

Try to not point out at his low knowledge in rude way. Never. If you do - delete comment and ask for an excuse. Offending others is not helpful. Rewind time backward when you were studying and try to be as tolerant as possible.

I still think what mentioning how easy it was to find solution by using google is acceptable, because (surprise!) not everybody yet knows or can use it. But if you already start giving an answer this probably is not a case.

0

"Go learn!" or especially "Go back to university, learn about algorithms and data structures before you try to tackle a problem like this" is not a helpful response (the latter sounds very elitist, as not everyone has the opportunity to attend university...).

If you're going to the effort of replying anyway, you could simply have said something like:

It's "big O" notation - used to describe the limiting behaviour of a function.

And maybe include a link to the topic in case the want to read / learn more:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_O_notation#Orders_of_common_functions

or

SO: What does O(log n) mean exactly?

I think the original SO OP comment is fair, you've included a notation they weren't familiar with (and hadn't used in the asking of their question):

What is O(log n)?

Sure, they could Google it, but there's no guarantee they see a good, short (single-line) summary of what something is. Don't write them a complete tutorial, but pointing someone in the right direction will help the OP and others.

Not everyone knows Big O (or regex or set notation etc. etc.) enough to know which search engine results are relevant. Remember, people come to programming from a variety of routes, not just an academic (mathematical or computer science) background, so not everyone will have the same underpinning knowledge.

If this is the only time the OP has encountered or needed to understand a specific notation, maybe 3 years at university isn't a good use of their time... If they continue in this area, they may well work out that more education may be the way to go - but that's their decision.

I'd treat these (side) questions the same for any topic. Say someone that didn't know Regular Expressions, for example - but an answer contained one. It's easy to assume everyone knows what they are, but not everyone does. Let them know what you've used, then point them in a constructive direction to start learning about it. - don't insult their intelligence or education level. As @Reto Koradi touches upon, more people than just the OP will view the question and there will be a number of them that are also unfamiliar with Big O.

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    Even if you type a complex expression like O log(n) in Google, it will return you a big list of great explanations. OP could have seached as well. Not every answer has to be a complete tutorial.
    – GolezTrol
    Commented Feb 3, 2015 at 14:27
  • 1
    I tried to make my answer generic, not just for this question / Big O. If you paste something like ^[!.@](update )(.*)$ into Google (the first regex I just found on SO from a quick search), nothing useful comes up. A single sentence is hardly a "complete tutorial".
    – Michael
    Commented Feb 3, 2015 at 15:26
  • Sure, there are ungoogleble search terms, but they are exceptions.
    – GolezTrol
    Commented Feb 3, 2015 at 18:02
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    @Mikaveli I believe you are right on this matter. There is nothing wrong to steer users into a way that they didn't know it existed. This is not a walkthrough, this is just illuminating a dark passage for everyone with lack of same information. If they are not willing to go through that path, that's beyond our concerns. Commented Feb 4, 2015 at 6:58
  • @GolezTrol That's true - and the Big O notation is one of the easier topics to search for. I'm just saying, in general, a pointer to a good on / off site resource isn't too much to ask and is a much better use of an answerers time than posting a dismissive or disparaging comment as proposed by the OP here.
    – Michael
    Commented Feb 4, 2015 at 9:24
-20

Don't tell them to go back to school...

The point of this site is so anyone searching can find and understand answers to any question right? If they can't understand it that means other people can't understand it which is bad...

Simplify! Simplify! Simplify! Simplify! Simplify!

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    There's a limit to how much one can dumb things down before it's more a hindrance to understanding and learning. And the notation is an important shorthand to know, spelling it out (and especially having to read it hundreds of times that way) is tiresome and not helpful. Commented Feb 2, 2015 at 15:44
  • well..I'll be trying to simplify as much as I can for people..because that is helping...if you do not how are you helping the person with the question? The answer is...you aren't Commented Feb 2, 2015 at 15:59
  • Let me...simplify my answer :D do you want people who are only smart to look at this site or everyone? Commented Feb 2, 2015 at 16:02
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    Always keep in mind "make it as simple as possible, but no simper". Also, this site is most certainly not for everyone, as not everyone is a programmer. For every question, there's a minimal background which has to be there (or should be learned ASAP), in order to understand a correct and not too loquacious answer. Unpacking all the notations and concepts used to the level an intelligent and interested layman will understand is certainly beyond the scope ofmost questions. Commented Feb 2, 2015 at 16:11
  • i just got -'s on my last question due to simply not being able to breakdown the question into two words "Concentric Circles" didn't even know what that was until now. Giving people - over stuff like that is horrible and demeaning. The biggest problem with this site in my opinion up to this point is people just don't understand one another and giving them - for that is just wrong. You gotta be able to come to common terms! How would you speak with anyone in life without arguing with every single person you come across that way. Commented Feb 2, 2015 at 16:22
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    One has to use common terms, that's right. Learning and using the jargon of your craft is a neccessity for expressing yourself with sufficient accuracy in an acceptable amount of time. There's simply no way around it. Commented Feb 2, 2015 at 16:28
  • but there is a way around it? i learned because of the person who told me! That person should get major rep in my opinion they actually taught..no one is going to get smarter without being taught...people learn different ways to that also needs to taken into consideration...i mean seriously this seems to be the "you are beneath me if you don't know what i know don't talk to me or even ask!" attitude. The whole answer is the way around it...simplify? It's odd that it's so hard for people to do... Commented Feb 2, 2015 at 16:32
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    Where do you get the idea I'm arguing an answer should not teach? I'm just saying you should not go back to utter basics, because then you either won't be able to cover the question itself in sufficient depth, you'll write a monograph noone will plough through where a single paragraph should suffice, or you'll skimp on all fronts. And neither of those options is any good to anyone. Commented Feb 2, 2015 at 16:38
  • I kind of understand where you are coming from but the question would have to be extremely dumb for me to go that far haha... Commented Feb 2, 2015 at 16:44
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    @user2455808 You'd be surprised at the crap we see... Commented Feb 3, 2015 at 6:46
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    "Teach me, teach me, teach me NOW! Searching Google, picking up a book or doing something else to better myself is too hard!"
    – user692942
    Commented Feb 3, 2015 at 14:27
  • Passing knowledge is the fastest way to learn that's just pure common sense. The books i read and the things i google will different results then you. Don't expect people to know everything you do it's just stupid seriously. but it looks like at the end of the day this site is bad because if you already know everything there is no point in asking a question..just google it on another site this site is pointless and has no purpose. Commented Feb 3, 2015 at 15:10
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    "What's all that stuff about learning for? I just want my fish!"
    – Jongware
    Commented Feb 3, 2015 at 18:30
  • @user2455808 Yes, but when the amount of information that you would need to teach to the user in order for them to understand an answer to their question is going to be a lot more than just a few paragraphs, the question is Too Broad. If you're going to answer then yes, you should be providing a complete answer that provides all of the necessary information for the OP to understand the solution. In cases like what the OP has described, it means that you cannot provide such an answer.
    – Servy
    Commented Feb 3, 2015 at 18:44
  • you are right servy in this case the guy is flat out just asking someone to make his script for him there isn't any learning to be done in that case. to express how broken this system is..i have -15 from saying you should help teach people and the guy doing that has -4...seems legit. Commented Feb 3, 2015 at 21:57

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