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Recently, I've been spending some time on SO answering a lot of questions, and one thing that frustrates me is this, I see many people post fairly decent questions (sure, the question may be worded improperly or doesn't show too much research, but clearly they did some research) but some pushy commentator will hop on saying how dreadfully horrible the question is and everyone decides to hop on to the lemming train upvoting his comment, and before I can even respond, the question is self-deleted by the OP, prolly out of shame. I have several problems with this.

  1. If the OP has a username of user282347997234... or something of the like, is it really worth beating them over the head like that? Clearly, the name and reputation amount should signify that this guy has no idea what he is doing. Hell, anything under a 100 basically has no idea what they're doing either.
  2. Now I'm trying to get into the mind of the person commenting here. What could the OP possibly get out of you dumping all over (what really seems to be in the mind of the OP) a carefully constructed question? Sure, carefulConstruction != correctConstruction, but jeez, some kind wording might actually make the point hit home? I'd like to point out a user who I think does a really good job of kindly and calmly addressing the flaws in questions, Hovercraftfullofeels (I would post examples had they all not been deleted), he/she/this guy always has a calm and kind correction to give and I'd like to see more of that.

So that was a rant... Anyways, my question is, why not implement a sandbox feature for questions? People with a low enough reputation or new to the site will automatically have their questions sent to the sandbox where people waiting for new questions to pop up can help them better state their questions. And maybe sandboxing is the wrong word, perhaps drafting would be better, since their original question is like a rough draft

Now, the obvious question is, how is this any different? What would stop people from dumping here as opposed to dumping on the original question? One thing I've recalled when looking at some of these comments is people who tend to berate the OP are people with (ironically) or less than 500 rep. Well, the people who are allowed to help the OP draft their questions must be above a certain reputation (say 1000). This would prevent people who are just here to rant on all the newcomers from being able to do that.

And once the OP has answered a few questions of their own, asked enough questions, etc., the sandbox feature will no longer become necessary. Sure, it would still be optional (I know I would use the feature from time to time), but at least now, they have shown an understanding and repeated experience with the site and it's standards and can accustom accordingly.

I feel this way, we can drift away from this almost backhanded teaching method SO has really become famous for, and instead, promote experimentation and testing, and letting the user learn by failing, but in an environment that doesn't make the OP feel like shit afterwards. Furthermore, I've seen some really great minds give up after a few times on this site. One of my buddies at work is IMO the most gifted programmer I know, but he sucks at posing his question. He dropped a few questions on this site and all were but removed in not even 5 minutes by my buddy himself cuz he was just too embarrassed after people were railing on his question. Sure, this is the internet, you need some tough skin here, but the lack of this feature is hurting SO in the end, pushing away people who could otherwise be really helpful here and I think this feature should be implemented.

Edit - Yeah, I guess the idea wasn't too practical to start with... Sorry to bother you all with an old question! I guess the tried and true method is really the best way to go here.

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    Who do you think would want to read this "sandbox"?
    – nobody
    Commented Oct 20, 2014 at 15:29
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    @AndrewMedico People who genuinely want to help their peers become better at what they do, isn't this site about helping each other learn? Commented Oct 20, 2014 at 15:30
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    I think you overestimate the number of people who actually want to wade through "My code doesn't work <200 lines of code> help plz".
    – nobody
    Commented Oct 20, 2014 at 15:33
  • @AndrewMedico Think so? Well, I figured it's something we could only benefit from. At the very least, it would filter out some of the bad questions, I don't see how implementing this feature would hurt the site Commented Oct 20, 2014 at 15:34
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    The idea of building a "sandbox" (or ... a cess pit ;) has been brought up a number of times over the years. It's not a bad idea per se but the consensus is that it would only create a gigantic ghetto of really, really bad questions that no one would want to spend time on in the long run. It really sucks that your programmer colleague had such a bad experience on SO - it's a real problem. But a "sandbox" would not be likely to help him; the vast majority of question askers who run into problems aren't asking questions worth answering.
    – Pekka
    Commented Oct 20, 2014 at 15:40
  • @Pekka웃 Lol, it wouldn't be much different from what it is now. I spend my time in the Java section, over 50% of the questions I run into could have easily been solved with simple google search. In fact, open SO right now and look at the java tag, can you look at that and say it would be much different? I don't see many 'good' questions at all, most 0 votes, other negative, very few positive valued questions Commented Oct 20, 2014 at 15:44
  • If anything, I feel this would help the people who want nothing to do with poor questions to see less and less of them. There exist people who are willing to help out the "cess pit" questions, I'm not worried about that, and they would be the ones willing to go through that gunk. Meanwhile, people who came to answer clearly worded and concise questions can do so with more clarity and sanity than before Commented Oct 20, 2014 at 15:52
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    If you see so much crap, I hope you downvote, flag, and - where there is some hope - comment. That's neccessary to prevent SO becoming yahoo answers or worse. (Though you seem to decry that as "dumping on the hapless innocent".) Maybe you mis-understood how SO is designed to help programmers: By building a collection of well-answered high-quality questions, not by mentoring individuals. Commented Oct 20, 2014 at 16:02
  • @Deduplicator Oh don't get me wrong, a bad question is a bad question, I don't have a problem with that, my problem is when people talk about how stupid they think said question is and how stupid the OP is as a result Commented Oct 20, 2014 at 16:03
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    There is already a sandbox, it's called the First posts queue. The first few posts of every user go into a queue, where other users fix and upvote these posts. stackoverflow.com/help/privileges/access-review-queues Commented Oct 20, 2014 at 16:04
  • Ah, if it is really just an offensive comment, flag it. (Though some people think any criticism is offensive, especially if it is not clothed in excessive amounts of excruciatingly polite verbiage, aka clutter.) Commented Oct 20, 2014 at 16:07
  • @Deduplicator right, but the damage is already done by that point, I like what InfiniteRecursion said, but I feel like they should edit that First Post concept and prevent new users from being exposed to the rather abusive commentators Commented Oct 20, 2014 at 16:09
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    "isn't this site about helping each other learn" nope. it's for "...[building] a library of detailed answers to every question about programming". If the comment attacks the poster, flag it. If the question isn't up to the standards set in the FAQ and tour, downvote, and close vote if appropriate. The amount of rep the user has is irrelevant. Votes should be based on the content, not the user who authored the content.
    – Kevin B
    Commented Oct 20, 2014 at 16:09
  • @KevinB Thank you for the correction. Either way, I see now this idea just isn't practical. Commented Oct 20, 2014 at 16:15
  • Just faced with this issue. Clearly, topic starter asked well-formed and clear question like "What need to know about GUI programming before put a hands on that". Seeing that kind of question, (and considering the fact that question was well written from first attempt) i decided to answer.) Not all low-reputation users are able to ask loud and clear what need to know and etc. Just because of my answer i was heavy downvoted. The reason was really shocking - "You broke a policy" and "Stackoverflow ain't forum(!!!) for such questions. For that purpose got to reddit."
    – Malakai
    Commented Mar 9, 2017 at 6:37

1 Answer 1

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Dealing with Rude Comments

This is being addressed in a different manner via the new Be Nice policy.

So, what does this mean for you? If you come across an obnoxiously rude or unhelpful comment, flag it. If you think you can leave a helpful comment for the newcomer, then do so. Other than that, you can't really protect people from downvotes and constructive criticism. The way I see it, newcomers have two options:

  1. Read the rules and try their best to abide by them. Doing so will be better received by the community and often times can result in positive voting and criticism.
  2. Ignore the rules and be taught by a less than friendly community. While this is less than ideal, it is how a lot of situations currently play out.

There is a review queue for First Posts. So, there is already a sandbox-ish area for these posts.

The Sandbox Idea

This idea has been talked about a lot on meta. I have seen it most popular in two forms:

  • The "Beginner's Place" for newcomers to start and learn the rules in. They can graduate out when they hit {n} reputation.
  • The "CrapOverflow" site where all sub par content gets migrated. It basically acts as a wastebin for Stack Overflow.

The problem with both of these ideas is that.. simply put, they just don't work.

The Beginner's Place

This idea will never work because it requires people (and active moderators) who want to maintain this free-for-all place and although you might be fond of it now, I can almost guarantee that you will get tired of seeing the same bad content after you're around long enough.

Keep in mind, this is how Stack Overflow was formed. It started out much less strict and was molded into the community it is now. A massive amount of the moderation tools and structure has come after the launch. If there is not enough people willing to filter through the wastebin then there is a real possibility that new users who might not belong get trapped in this wasteland.

Crap Overflow

This idea doesn't work for the same basic principles. It will require a massive amount of users and moderators who are willing to wade through junk. It also will require a huge amount of change in the way Stack Overflow moderation tools currently work.

Stack Overflow's moderation tools work. Now, I will agree all day long that they are definitely lacking in a lot of places but, for the most part, bad questions get closed, duplicate questions get marked as duplicate. And, depending on the time of day, you might even spot a few decent questions and ever so often, a great question.

So in conclusion, here's a few tips for you:

  • Don't get hung up on rude people. Flag them and leave a more friendly comment to OP.
  • Don't feed newcomer vampires who are only ever looking out for themselves. They will eventually get handled by an automatic ban. Like before, when you arrive at a question like this, downvote, leave a comment if you feel inclined and move on.
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    "Don't read the rules and be taught by a less than friendly community." I would put it more like "Don't read/ignore the rules and get a bad reception by people not paid to put up with egregious disrespect." Commented Oct 20, 2014 at 16:11
  • ignore is a better word :) Added Commented Oct 20, 2014 at 16:12
  • Ah, I would not say the community is not friendly, though it might be less than amused. Commented Oct 20, 2014 at 16:13
  • Hmmm, you raise some very good points here, thank you for your response. I guess the last thing I'd like to push forward is, I certainly want to post a friendly comment or at least get the chance to flag the user, but all too many times, I see the question is gone and I can't do anything about it. The commentator gets away, the OP is disgusted with the site, and nobody really wins. What if we put in a feature where a deleted question was still available for comments a few minutes after the OP decides to delete it? Commented Oct 20, 2014 at 16:13
  • @DreadHeadedDeveloper: You can certainly propose a grace-period for comments, though I don't think that will be implemented. I might be wrong though, so don't let me stop you. Commented Oct 20, 2014 at 16:15
  • @Deduplicator Hah, I say that with ease. I see incredibly rude people on Stack Overflow on a fairly regular basis, from chat to Q & A.. It is a part of Stack Overflow and this field. I would assume that's why the be nice policy is getting so much attention. Commented Oct 20, 2014 at 16:16
  • @Deduplicator Much appreciated! Sorry to bother you all with an old question Commented Oct 20, 2014 at 16:18

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