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This has probably been asked before, but

What's wrong with minor edits?

Jeff Atwood had something against them and as a result we have stupid limits on having to add 6 characters to an edit before it will be accepted (which as often led me to add ...... on the edit of a question I have edited for formatting by adding paragraphs and white space which improves readability greatly).

Surely the nice big Stack Overflow servers aren't in danger of filling up with too many edits!

Writing this question in Meta was prompted by this review

https://stackoverflow.com/review/suggested-edits/4662625

Now sure the question isn't great, and yes there could have been a little more done in the edit, but its not a BAD edit. It improves the question and it improves Stack Overflow. It might just be enough to make the question readable enough for someone to look at it.

I was going to approve this edit and it was rejected by 3 others as 'Too Minor'!!! I could understand if one of those users then went and changed it but of course they didn't. The other side effect of this is that the user who made a valid suggested edit to make a question more readable is now wondering why he should bother making suggested edits in the future if they are going to be rejected.

I make many, many edits all the time that would probably be considered too minor if I had to suffer the indignity of someone else approving them

https://stackoverflow.com/posts/961193/revisions

Now I understand we don't want people going in adding a '.' and expecting to get a couple of rep points, but surely we can try to draw the distinction between an edit that is too minor and brings no benefit to the question and a minor edit which greatly improves the question (generally through clearer formatting).

Can we change the guidelines for rejecting edits to reject minor edits that do not improve the question or answer and edits that are minor but are still useful?

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  • 2
    FYI, there are tons of discussions on this issue available on Meta Stack Exchange. Have a look through those if you're interested in some of the arguments that have been brought up over time.
    – Bart
    Commented Apr 26, 2014 at 10:19
  • 1
    That isn't too minor, that's vandalism.
    – bjb568
    Commented Jun 10, 2014 at 19:38
  • 1
    Typo "as" for "has", please edit!
    – Nemo
    Commented Apr 6, 2015 at 20:43
  • 8
    I guess I'm still struggling to see what the big deal about 2 rep points is. If these points are so precious to the StackExchange administration, then don't give them away all! Just hoard all those points for yourself. It's not like they're worth money or something.
    – ouflak
    Commented May 15, 2015 at 20:39

7 Answers 7

140

I rarely contribute to Stack Overflow but I have to agree to this as well. Just a scenario where even one character can be important.

I was searching for an answer to a daily-life JavaScript problem, where a user posted a good solution. The code had a for loop, which he forgot to end. I wasted some time to figure out what the problem was through my console and fixed it. When I tried to add the closing curly brace to the original answer, the site wouldn't let me.

I think this is a good enough reason to allow normal users to make minor edits too.

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  • 38
    What you are describing is not a minor edit. Fixing an error that allows the code to compile is a significant improvement to the post.
    – Servy
    Commented May 5, 2014 at 18:46
  • 28
    yes, but how am i supposed to do it? Sorry I am not a regular contributor, which I have already mentioned.
    – Gogol
    Commented May 5, 2014 at 18:47
  • 2
    The edit is going to need to be at least a 6 character edit no matter what; that is required to be able to submit the edit at all, and is different from what is described in the question here. Even after making a 6 character edit, the suggestion can be rejected if the reviewers feel it is not significant enough.
    – Servy
    Commented May 5, 2014 at 18:48
  • 11
    In this scenario I'd add a comment and let the OP fix it. Commented May 5, 2014 at 19:14
  • 1
    @DavidMoles that is what I ultimately ended up doing.
    – Gogol
    Commented May 6, 2014 at 7:07
  • 76
    It's a good example of why the "no minor edits" rule is awful and should go away. Commented May 6, 2014 at 23:45
  • 67
    Maybe minor edits should be permitted, but gain no reputation. Someone seeing a minor grammatical error in a post can correct it, without changing anything else, out of a public spirited wish to improve the post. On the other hand, there would be no point in e.g. writing an add-a-tag script. Commented Jun 10, 2014 at 23:03
  • 3
    How about formatting? I got halfway through a code example and someone forgot to type a space betweenbold tags. The bold was for a ~keyword, so the syntax could be confusing for beginners!
    – user1499731
    Commented Sep 4, 2014 at 16:26
  • 4
    Sometimes formatting code will make it more readable. Even i came across scenario question looks almost spam. I corrected formatting and it was good to go,however i was not able to post. As there is no 6 characters change. We should allow such edit, if needed don't credit points for same.
    – Panther
    Commented Apr 16, 2015 at 10:48
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    Single character edits IN CODE BLOCK should be allowed, particularly to correct compile errors! Surprising that SO won't use 'community power' to improve the accuracy of content. Edits to textual content should remain at 6 char to allow reviewers to keep up with volume by minimising trivial changes. Commented Jan 30, 2016 at 23:01
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    @StephanLuis that's a brilliant idea :)
    – Gogol
    Commented Feb 1, 2016 at 6:08
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    @DavidMoles I've come up with the idea of allowing single character edits in code block to correct compile errors. noc2spam ツ thinks it's a good idea, who could we involve in the discussion that could help shape a reasonable 'feature-request' question? ... so that it's not immediately shot down. Commented Feb 1, 2016 at 21:42
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    @noc2spamツ Thanks... I've made a feature request for this on meta.stackoverflow.com/q/315974/2455159 feel free to up vote! and rally support. Commented Feb 1, 2016 at 21:43
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    @StephanLuis I have found a minor but not unsignificant typo in a code snippet posted in an accepted answer (stackoverflow.com/a/8630293/3817004) but was not allowed to remove the spurious character. I didn't want to blame the OP by placing a comment but to correct the typo silently for the benefit of other readers. Therefore, I will support your suggestion.
    – Uwe
    Commented Apr 16, 2016 at 10:27
44

I was one of the reviewers who rejected this edit.

Changes in the edit

There were 3 things changed by this review:

  • the very first "i" changed to "I"
  • the word "Account" placed in bold formatting
  • A new line placed after each of the first two sentences

The first change was correct, though I would consider that as "too minor" on its own.

The second change was (a) not needed, and (b) incorrect use of formatting. Bold formatting is intended for emphasis where it is needed. In this instance, it is perfectly clear what is being said without adding bold to "Account".

The third change, the paragraph spacing, does improve readability slightly. However, the post is already readable as it is.

Improvements not made

There were some improvements that were not made by the reviewer:

  • "TRIGGER" (in the title) does not need to be in capitals.
  • "Is-a" should be in capitals; it looks a bit like ls -a.
  • Instead of using capital letters for emphasis (in "ONLY"), bold or italic formatting would be more appropriate.
  • Possibly the use of code spans for acctType or replacement with "account type".
  • Some minor grammatical issues and/or wording that could have been changed.

I did not approve this edit because the suggested edit did not improve the post too much, and out of the few things that were changed, one of the changes made the post worse than before.

As to why I did not just improve the edit, there are two reasons for that:

  • By the time I fix the edit properly, it is approved most of the time by other users before I am able to improve the post properly.
  • I did not consider the post to be in poor enough a state to require my own attention and time to fix up the post.
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  • I would have also reject it. The paragraph spacing was indeed a good change, but I had done this edit, I would also have highlight more things as you point out.
    – Larme
    Commented Apr 26, 2014 at 10:32
  • 1
    Had I seen this, I would have chosen 'Improve' to redo some of the edits. I would have undone the bold, changed 'Anyways' to 'Anyway', and unchecked the 'edit was useful' box. I might or might not have fixed some of the other items you raise. I find the 'Improve' option useful; I sometimes do and sometimes don't uncheck the 'edit was useful' box. Commented Apr 26, 2014 at 16:31
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    I understand that more could have been done, but is knocking back an edit that does offer some improvement really better than accepting the lesser upgrade and hoping somebody else will notice the other bits now that they actually feel like reading it?
    – Jasper
    Commented May 6, 2014 at 0:44
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    @TheQZ: Yes. Because this so-called lesser upgrade was too minor (too much obviously left unfixed, and few things fixed) conflated with invalid edit (bad emphasis introduced). Commented Jun 10, 2014 at 23:52
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    But the site is improved by 'too minor' edits as well as 'major' edits. That's the whole point of suggested edits. Not to reject good edits, even if they are minor, but to reject BAD edits. I don't even have the rep to participate in Suggested Edits and I can understand that simple concept.
    – ouflak
    Commented May 15, 2015 at 20:45
  • 2
    @ouflak If an edit contains a minor improvement which turns out to be outweighed by a number of issues that effectively harm the post's quality, it sums up to no improvement whatsoever.
    – moooeeeep
    Commented Jun 9, 2015 at 15:57
  • I agree with you, except on the fact the post was readable without the spaces. I think it depends on the person. Reading a post like that for me is hard.
    – Dzyann
    Commented Jul 8, 2015 at 4:52
8

I agree there is not much wrong with minor edits, and I do see that most reviewers accept even not-so-crucial edits. However I do think a lot of reviewers are not on the same page about this. I just suggested this edit, which was rejected:

Suggested edit

But then, thankfully, sashang put the edit in anyway.

Edit

I do feel I am sometimes a bit too anal about mistakes, but in this case I believe it was justified, and clearly sashang did too, so despite the fact that it was rejected, it still got implemented.

Just something to think about, because there is a great disparity between the reviewers...

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    "How to find location of svn repository" is perfectly fine as a title; titles aren't meant to be full english sentences but just a sufficient fragment to grok the context. Further, your edit is grammatically wrong ("a svn" vs "an svn").
    – Veedrac
    Commented May 21, 2014 at 6:24
  • 1
    @Veedrac You are correct that the s in svn is technically functioning as a vowel. The simplest explanation being that SVN is an acronym and as such is pronounced with the spellings of each letter (i.e. ess-vee-en). Contrary to how most of us were taught, vowels and consonants are phonetic in nature and cannot always be distinguished by a, e, i, o, u (, y) (e.g. hour starts with a vowel sound but starts with the letter h). Commented Jun 23, 2014 at 19:28
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    @user3334690 I agree with Veedrac's first sentence, but I still believe I am correct about "an svn" - and I see you agree with me. The way 'svn' is pronounced, it starts with a vowel, so 'an' is correct.
    – Illidanek
    Commented Jun 24, 2014 at 10:47
5

I just ran into the same annoying problem: There had to be a 2 in place of a 1 in order to be correct. However, I am not allowed to edit a single character, and I could not find anything else to improve.

So, I applied the following strategy (which may work only for just-given answers), using the "write comment" and "delete comment" capabilities as a chat:

  • Add a comment to the just-given answer, hoping that the OP reads it fast enough to edit the post - afterwards delete your comment. Well, this worked out :)

There are even more alternatives:

  • Write a script on an external server that repeatedly adds and removes such a comment with the edit request every five minutes, until the OP applies the edit.
  • Try to contact random people on Stack Overflow that have enough reputation in order to apply the edit.
  • Make a very long edit where you describe the 6-character-edit-problem in details to the OP/reviewer in order to use this as a communication channel to the OP/reviewer. The OP/reviewer should then see this, reject your edit request, and edit the topic himself.

Finally, my favorite alternative:

  • Remove the 6-character-limit (but keep the reviewing functionality) from Stack Overflow, since major edits sometimes require only a single character.
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  • Write a script on an external server that repeatedly adds and removes such a comment with the edit request every five minutes, until the OP applies the edit. That's crazyy!!
    – Gogol
    Commented Jul 25, 2016 at 15:01
-5

There seem to be two objections to removing the character minimum on reviews:

  1. it would put unnecessary reviews in the queue, and
  2. it would give free rep

So why not remove the character minimum while negating these issues?

Get rid of the character limit, but reward no rep for edits smaller than 6 characters, and only allow small edits to be approved by the OP. This would discourage minor edits on old posts while making it relatively easy to fix something quickly during the time when the post is new and the author is definitely still active.

Minor edits would not appear in the edit queue, nor would they block the edit queue. If a regular edit is approved, any pending minor edit would be deleted. This is acceptable because it means the minor editor could have made a regular edit.

The potential problem here is grammar enthusiasts spamming inboxes with useless edits, so I would say there should be a limit of 1 minor edit a day for users under 2k rep. This would dissuade most people from actively searching for commas to add, especially since no rep would be involved.

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    Lots and lots of users have abandoned their accounts and are no longer maintaining their posts at all; what are we supposed to do with those suggestions, especially since those lock the post to further edits until resolved? Commented Jul 5, 2016 at 19:06
  • So what happens then if an edit is in the "special queue" and someone else makes an edit that get pushed to the "normal queue"? Commented Jul 6, 2016 at 10:48
  • @Carpetsmoker I clarified that with an edit
    – aebabis
    Commented Jul 6, 2016 at 16:26
-7

An edit is supposed to save time and effort for readers of the site. If it's costing more of my time as a reviewer than it's going to save those readers, it's too minor.

Regarding the question you posted, I might have approved it if it had only fixed the capitalization, because as a reader of the site I find that capitalization and spelling errors irritate me and slow me down. The spacing fix was maybe worth doing, too.

I agree with OneKitten that the boldface didn't add anything. (Highlighting all the table / column names might have been helpful. Some one else seems to have come along later and added backticks -- but only around some of them. Whatever reviewer approved that was asleep at the switch.)

Frankly, though, this was a pretty bad question and you shouldn't have wasted your time editing it, let alone anyone else's. A downvote would have been more helpful.

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    The points you make all make sense but I'm having a hard time buying that "my time as reviewer" should be weighing against "readers time". (1) The whole SE is predicated on people spending they time for benefit of future readers. (2) You can decide it's not worth for you, but here we're talking about stopping others who decide it is worth their time. Commented May 9, 2014 at 17:22
  • 1
    Until they hit 2000 rep, it's not just their time they're spending. Once they hit 2000 rep they can make as many minor edits as they like. Commented May 9, 2014 at 17:27
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    "If it's costing more of my time as a reviewer than it's going to save those readers, it's too minor." Do you realize that your review time is O(1) and the reading time O(n)?
    – the
    Commented Aug 3, 2014 at 7:54
  • 2
    Yes, but sometimes n is very small. Commented Aug 4, 2014 at 16:58
-9

They lead to the "editor" getting undue credit for the answer. I just made a substantial edit to a badly-written and misleading answer (I'll just go ahead and say, it was this one), and a few hours later the original author edited it to add... a pair of quote marks, erasing my name from the answer completely. (He also added some further misinformation in the comments about exec spawning a subshell.)

Personally, I believe authorship of a comment should operate via Community Wiki rules all the time, to prevent this kind of byline gamesmanship. (Also, Community Wiki posts do permit minor edits, for exactly this reason.)

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    Edits to other's posts are not for substantially rewriting them. Your gripe with any further edit "erasing your name" seems to stem from a fundamental misunderstanding of how edits should be used.
    – l4mpi
    Commented Apr 14, 2015 at 9:03
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    Editing has nothing to do with having your name attached!
    – Toby Allen
    Commented Apr 14, 2015 at 12:40
  • 2
    Why didn't you post another answer instead of substantially editing that answer? Wouldn't have this been more practical?
    – Gogol
    Commented Apr 17, 2015 at 6:42
  • @noc2spamツ Because my answer wouldn't have been materially different from the accepted answer - just reworded. Commented Apr 17, 2015 at 19:54

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