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Editing a question/answer is good, as far as it makes some sense and really improves the post. Reviewing a suggested edit is a responsibility and not just a matter of formality.

A single-character edit such as this suggested edit, which actually is just adding a question-mark is annoying and adds nothing. Moreover, it gets blindly approved without improving the edit.

For reference, this is the original question: https://stackoverflow.com/revisions/30023028/1 which had the scope of improvement like:

  • Formatting the code
  • Grammar in the body
  • Spelling mistakes

Enter image description here

If you see, it first got approved by two reviewers, and then approved by Community. And what exactly was the suggested edit? A question mark was added to the topic title, and that's it!

There are following options:

  • Improve Edit
  • Reject and Edit
  • Reject
  • Skip

If you see a scope to improve, please do improve the edit and do not just click on approve.

If you do not see any scope to improve the edit, and that the suggested edit is trivial, then reject it.

Please do not blindly approve trivial suggested edits. Do something about it, if you find something could be done about it.


Update: Regarding a specific case when there is no scope of improving a suggested edit:

I understand when there is a single-character edit like adding a question-mark only is not going to harm the post and thus folks would just approve it.

But, wouldn't this encourage the editor to do such trivial edits in the future and then we would see a pile of posts in the Review stack for Suggested Edits. I wish the editor is made aware of it. As we don't know if this might be an attempt to gain the +2 reputation for getting a suggested edit approved.

So, the specific case in the update might be worth another discussion. However, regarding the original question, my opinion is that the review should have been to Improve Edit and not just Approved.


Edit: Regarding the question marked as duplicate

The duplicate marked question, "Too minor" edits - better to leave poor quality on the site? has a highest voted answer with a conclusion:

We should allow people to correct grammar and spelling mistakes. We don't have to be obsessive about it, but if someone is willing to spend the time for that kind of edit, let them.

Ok, correction of grammar and spelling mistakes is still improving something. However, as I posted an example about adding a question mark only to the topic title doesn't improve anything and simply approving the suggested edit is a poor judgement. If the suggested edit would have been correction of a spelling mistake, I would not have posted my question at all. So, I don't agree this is a duplicate question as we are addressing two different kinds of edits; I am concerned about addition a single-character, and the other question marked as duplicate addresses the modification.

Another question, When an edit only fixes a typo, what should I do as a reviewer? also talks about fixing a typo. As I said, my concern is not about fixing typos, or correcting spelling mistakes or grammar, but a single-character addition in the topic title and then being approved by the reviewers without improving the edit.


Update 2: Regarding the debate about the grammar

For those who think the edit to add a question-mark to original question (How to do multiple record updation in oracle) in the posted example is correct, then please understand that it actually makes it grammatically incorrect. Please read Why do my “How to” questions often get renamed to “How do I”?


NOTE: Reading the comments thoroughly, it seems that there might be a confusion between actually suggesting an edit versus approving the edit. Please see this original question, and then compare it with the edited question as it looks now. Please take some time to look at the edit history before making any opinion.

I completely agree with the downvotes, that it is a disagreement. However, it shouldn't be at the cost of misunderstanding. So, please look at the edits and updates to the question. I have tried my best to address each and every concern.

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  • 17
    You know what, I've always wondered if us mods should post more PSAs like this...
    – BoltClock Mod
    Commented May 4, 2015 at 6:46
  • 17
    Let's assume that there's no room for more edits in that question except for the question mark. Would you still approve it? If it was me, I would differently have added the question mark, the question is.. Why should I disapprove it if I would had added it myself? (again, if it was the only edit that should be done).
    – Maroun
    Commented May 4, 2015 at 6:52
  • 3
    @MarounMaroun I don't see a reason to approve a "question mark only" addition as an edit. By the way, this question had a scope of improvement and a reviewer did try and improve the edit. Commented May 4, 2015 at 6:54
  • 27
    I think I agree with what Maroun Maroun is getting at—I thought the only reason we were rejecting ‘trivial’ edits is if it wasn’t going far enough to improve the post. If, however, it’s nearly perfect and a ‘trivial’ edit makes it perfect, I see no reason to reject it.
    – icktoofay
    Commented May 4, 2015 at 6:59
  • 11
    Huh? I thought that edits( <2K rep ) has to be at least 6 or 7 characters long.
    – Spikatrix
    Commented May 4, 2015 at 7:00
  • 2
    @CoolGuy Well, the last editor might have changed it (which is why it was approved by Community), he still marked the edit as helpful?
    – martin
    Commented May 4, 2015 at 7:01
  • 2
    I would've chosen "Reject and Edit", or "Reject" if there was nothing else to edit. The question mark in the title is almost completely redundant. Commented May 4, 2015 at 17:14
  • 7
    It should have been Reject and Edit, 'updation' is not a word. Commented May 4, 2015 at 17:16
  • 8
    @NisseEngström Not just redundant, it actually breaks the grammar, because that title isn't phrased as a question.
    – Brian
    Commented May 4, 2015 at 18:16
  • 3
    @CoolGuy Edits to the post body have to be at least 6 characters. Editing tags or titles don't have the same restriction.
    – Brian
    Commented May 4, 2015 at 18:17
  • 4
    I'm not a native engish speaker, but adding a question mark to a "How to ..." title is not a grammatical improvement. It's wrong, because "How to ..." is a statement and not a question.
    – Artjom B.
    Commented May 6, 2015 at 6:03
  • 5
    Surely this post is a rant. The real issue is that the grammar of the title is incorrect and that should have been the subject of the edit. From How to do multiple record updation in oracle to something akin to What's the best approach to multiple record updates in Oracle? or How should I go about updation multiple records in Oracle?
    – Ian Lewis
    Commented May 6, 2015 at 9:44
  • 2
    @LalitKumarB I would say that this post is a rant because the initial point of it is purely to complain without suggesting a proper grammatically correct solution. Additionally later on in the post there is use of exclamation marks which is another indication of ranting. The OP is correct that a single character edit (in this case) was incorrect but totally fails to note that the grammatical construction of the question title is wrong.
    – Ian Lewis
    Commented May 6, 2015 at 11:13
  • 3
    An improvement is an improvement, no matter how big or small it may be.
    – j08691
    Commented May 6, 2015 at 18:20
  • 4
    Does this answer your question? "Too minor" edits - better to leave poor quality on the site? Commented Mar 7, 2021 at 16:58

4 Answers 4

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In my opinion, a single trailing question mark in the title is never worth an edit. Following the guidelines given in the MSE FAQ on good question titles (How do I write a good title?) the title should have received a complete rewording instead of an additional, redundant question mark. (Readers should be assumed to "understand your titles are questions.") So, yes, this edit adds no improvement whatsoever (and I would likely have rejected and edited it myself).

As for the too minor edits debate in general, I think especially new editors should be pointed more effectively (or more often, depending on the number of trivial edits they suggest) to the edit privilege description page:

When should I edit posts?

Any time you feel you can make the post better, and are inclined to do so. Editing is encouraged!

Some common reasons to edit are:

  • to fix grammatical or spelling mistakes
  • to clarify the meaning of a post without changing it
  • to correct minor mistakes or add addendums / updates as the post ages
  • to add related resources or hyperlinks

Try to make the post substantively better when you edit, not just change a single character. Tiny, trivial edits are discouraged.

As a suggestion to raise both reviewer's and editor's awareness of the issue I have posted a suggestion that addresses the issue. It is intended to make reviewers think about their action by requiring them to tick a reason why the edit should be approved:

Feel free to criticize.

7
  • I am unable to conclude, however I find your opinion to quite close to what I think. So marking it as an answer. I see 39 upvotes and 14 downvotes. Certainly 14 users defer from my thoughts, and they think it doesn't matter for them to have a pile of questions with a single character edit in the suggested edits stack. I think they are the ones who also approve them blindly. Commented May 5, 2015 at 12:42
  • 4
    @LalitKumarB: Generally, I would not expect blind approvers (of anything) to be on Meta. Commented May 5, 2015 at 17:14
  • @NathanTuggy Generally, I wouldn't expect them on any site. Because if they fail, then it is a poor review and poor judgement. Commented May 6, 2015 at 10:40
  • @LalitKumarB: Not quite sure what you mean; there are presumably a fair number of near-blind reviewers on SO proper, but very few of them would be found on Meta because that's too much effort. Commented May 6, 2015 at 16:19
  • @NathanTuggy Nothing fancy. What I mean is, I wish we not only have good review here at Meta, but also on the rest other sites as well. Commented May 6, 2015 at 17:27
  • @LalitKumarB: Since there are no suggested edits on Meta to speak of, I was referring to SO reviewers coming to read Meta, not review it. Commented May 6, 2015 at 17:37
  • @NathanTuggy :-) Commented May 6, 2015 at 18:07
28

If you see a scope to improve, please do improve the edit and do not just click on approve.

That's what happened here. Florin Ghita did improve the edit. This shows up as two consecutive but separate edits, one by the author of the edit suggestion, and one by the person making an improvement, so that credit is given where credit is due. It wouldn't be right for Florin Ghita's improvement to show up as part of Deepak Keynes's edit suggestion.

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  • 4
    So you don't think it should have been "Reject and Edit"? What about the first two, who selected "Approve" without any additional edits?
    – Brian
    Commented May 4, 2015 at 18:50
  • 13
    @Brian I wish "Too minor" would be re-introduced as an edit suggestion rejection reason, but for now, approving and improving is exactly what we're supposed to do. As for approving without improving, I really don't know. I'm not saying I think it's right, nor that I think it's wrong, I just really don't know.
    – user743382
    Commented May 4, 2015 at 21:41
  • 1
    @hvd I know Florin Ghita did improve the edit, but the question is why did the first two reviewers just approved and didn't improve. And that's why community robo-user approved it too. That's why I didn't like the way the suggested edit was blindly approved when there was more scope/room for improvement. Commented May 5, 2015 at 3:21
  • @hvd Please see my edit in the question. Commented May 5, 2015 at 4:55
  • 3
    @LalitKumarB No, that isn't why the community robo-user approved it. The community robo-user approved it because the third reviewer chose to accept and improve. That instantly accepts the pending suggested edit, no matter how the earlier reviewers voted. About the fact that the two earlier reviewers approved it: see my reply to Brian's comment: I don't know about that. Even if those two reviewers had rejected it, the third reviewer accepting and improving would have led to the edit suggestion being accepted anyway.
    – user743382
    Commented May 5, 2015 at 8:49
  • @hvd You mean the reviewers' history is not sorted? The reviewer who improved the edit did it at last, however, it shows robo-user approved before that. Anyway, don't know why people voted to close it as duplicate though, I don't see it as duplicate at all. Commented May 5, 2015 at 9:00
  • 5
    @LalitKumarB The user who chooses to accept and improve is typically not a diamond moderator, so cannot instantly accept the pending suggestion. That's why the system uses the Community user for that. If you hover over the timestamps ("yesterday"), you'll see "Florin Ghita reviewed this yesterday [2015-05-04 05:22:42Z]: Edit", and "Community♦ reviewed this yesterday [2015-05-04 05:22:42Z]: Approve" It's the exact same second, and that's no coincidence.
    – user743382
    Commented May 5, 2015 at 9:04
  • @hvd Difficult to say. Perhaps, it is something like 3 out of 5 voted to approve, first two approved, the third reviewer improved edit, thus 3 out of 5 finally approved, thus community instantly approved it with no more delay. I am just guessing. And the fact still remains open that the first two reviewers should have improved the edit rather than instantly approving it. Commented May 5, 2015 at 9:13
  • 7
    @LalitKumarB No. I'm not making random guesses here, I'm telling you that that's how the system works.
    – user743382
    Commented May 5, 2015 at 9:13
  • I understand. That tells the reason why community robo-user showed up as a reviewer who approved. I think we could conclude that in my example, the first two reviews should have been an improve edit rather than just approving. Commented May 5, 2015 at 9:17
15

I partially agree with you.

In that specific question, I agree that the reviewer should have improved the edit because there are other things that should be improved.

If I came across similar question, that adding the question mark was the only improvement that should be done, I would have edited it. Hence, if I were reviewing a post that suggested the only available edit (which is, for example only adding a question mark), I will definitely approved it.

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  • 3
    Wouldn't this encourage the editor to do such trivial edits and then we would see a pile of posts in the Review stack for Suggested Edits. I wish the editor is made aware of it. Commented May 4, 2015 at 7:08
  • 4
    Also, it might be an attempt to gain the +2 reputation for getting a suggested edit approved. Commented May 4, 2015 at 7:25
  • 4
    @LalitKumarB As I said, I will not approve trivial edits that attempts to edit just for the +2. However, if it's the only available edit, and it's not redundant, I will approve it.
    – Maroun
    Commented May 4, 2015 at 7:45
  • Well, thanks for the answer. +1 for your partial agreement. Perhaps, your specific scenario is worth another discussion, but in this case it should have been an Improve Edit. Commented May 4, 2015 at 7:50
  • @LalitKumarB It's always good to discuss and hear other's opinions, thanks for bringing this interesting topic.
    – Maroun
    Commented May 4, 2015 at 7:51
  • 4
    That question mark doesn't seem to belong there at all. The title wasn't phrased as a question.
    – canon
    Commented May 4, 2015 at 17:33
  • 2
    @canon The particular grammar mistake is pretty common among non-native-English speakers when their native language doesn't conjugate verbs in the same way - using "to do" instead of the right form. So it does read as a question to me, just that the edit should've fixed that as well
    – Izkata
    Commented May 4, 2015 at 18:07
  • 1
    But then you would be losing a review vote in something trivial (that probably would be approved anyway), that you could have used in something more important later. As discussed on this question: meta.stackoverflow.com/questions/292007/… Commented May 4, 2015 at 19:02
  • @AlvaroMontoro It's important, any edit that improves the question is important for me.
    – Maroun
    Commented May 5, 2015 at 6:28
  • 3
    @MarounMaroun: As the author of the linked question, I'm not sure your disagreement really addresses the case for which I wrote it. All good edits are important, but not all important edits need your attention to succeed, and the attention of good reviewers in Suggested Edits is sorely needed on many other edits. Commented May 5, 2015 at 17:22
3

The purported justification for not allowing single-character and other trivial edits is that it makes unnecessary work for the review queue. It seems that the message hasn't got through to the review queue.

In fact there are many, many people ready and waiting to review trivial edits, and it then becomes necessary to forbid them from doing so, in case their willingness encourages the posting of such edits.

8
  • Seriously, the paradox is mind-boggling. The system is created to award Internet Points to people who fix problems. Then when people attempt to fix problems, they are rejected and punished and shamed--for doing what the system was created to encourage. It seems that what's going on is, a certain mindset takes hold among those who reach the upper echelon, one in which they, in effect, defend their territory and status from those who would approach their level by doing what they did--that is, by doing what the system was created to reward. Internet Points are a Bad Thing.
    – user712624
    Commented Oct 2, 2015 at 3:34
  • 2
    @blujay: No, they aren't punished for doing what the system was created to encourage. They just should not be rewarded for failing while trying (No "A" for effort), and if they fail consistently (and the reviewers don't), they are for a short time barred from keeping failing, which time they hopefully use to learn how and why they failed (Not only the mechanical part, but the intent.). If you see rep as what it is, a very rough and imperfect measure of the community's trust in your judgement, not increasing it for failing (or even decreasing it, but we won't go there) is the right thing. Commented Nov 10, 2015 at 17:32
  • 1
    @Deduplicator What in the world are you talking about? Said people are not "failing while trying"--they are fixing problems! They are making improvements! They are leaving things in a state better than they found them in! "Failing"? Really?!
    – user712624
    Commented Nov 14, 2015 at 7:18
  • 1
    @blujay: If their suggested edit isn't worth it, how else would you characterize it than "failure"? Commented Nov 15, 2015 at 0:02
  • 1
    @Deduplicator You are completely missing the point. Their suggested edit is worth it, because it is an improvement. Making something better is a good thing. The failure is on the part of elitists who reject others' work as "not worth it" in order to protect their elite status (which they attained by doing the same work they now reject from others). Additional failure is on the part of said elitists who fail to recognize the irony in their hypocrisy.
    – user712624
    Commented Nov 19, 2015 at 2:54
  • 2
    @blujay: This one is an improvement? No, even hell no! The work created for the review-queue, and bumping the post for adding a single questionmark to the title, is in no way justified for that pedantery on punctuation in titles. Especially considering that the question needed lots of substantial editing (see the full revision-history), which also meant completely rewriting the title, thus discarding that change anyway! Commented Nov 19, 2015 at 3:03
  • 1
    Like jwg (who posted the answer I responded to), I am talking about this problem in general, not that specific edit that merely added a question mark (that didn't even belong). This problem of rejecting worthwhile changes because they "aren't worthwhile enough" is a widespread problem on SO.
    – user712624
    Commented Nov 19, 2015 at 3:38
  • 1
    @blujay Actually, edits correcting a handful typos in a paragraph that has to be completely rewritten anyway are a widespread problem. Or otherwise doing a cosmetic change and ignoring the big fat dump right next to (or more often containing) it. Commented Nov 19, 2015 at 3:46

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