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This is a direct result of this post made by Tim Post of Stack Overflow:

https://meta.stackoverflow.com/a/314169

As Stack Overflow is getting older, programming changes. Practices that were once considered good or proper become unaccepted, even harmful in some cases (due to updates, better knowledge, etc). From the earlier times, still many highly upvoted answers on questions remain that are actively harmful, or simply no longer up to date.

Therefore, I am suggesting the implementation of a formal process of deprecation, where a no longer accurate or now harmful answer can be marked to lose its accepted answer status, and to lose its position in the question itself. (It would be the last before any potential negatively scored answers)

This process needs heavy requirements, like:

  • Only 10k (15k?) or above reputation users can vote for it.
  • 5 of those votes are needed in order to mark an answer as "deprecated"
  • Only Answers older then one year with a current score of above 10 are eligible. (This can be changed by other SE Sites to accommodate activity)
  • Only Answers which have received at least 5 downvotes in the past 30 days are eligible
  • Only Answers to questions that are not [on hold] [closed] or [deleted] are eligible
  • Only non-community wiki answers are eligible
  • After the vote has passed, the original author is notified of the pending depreciation, and can try and edit the answer accordingly, if he does, all people voting for depreciation are notified and have a chance to recast or retract their vote
  • Once deprecated, the author can still edit his answer. Barring community wiki answers (which are uneligible), this feature can only be used for answers which are considered so wrong that they cannot be fixed without changing the intent of the author at least partly, so only the original author is allowed to edit at this point.
  • If he does, a notification is sent to all who voted for depreciation, giving them opportunity to recast their vote.
  • Other users can cast un-depreciate and deprecate votes as necessary (when raised on meta for instance)

Now as to what exactly this would do:

  • Automatically mark the answer with a prominent yellow box at the top that reads.

The community considers this answer deprecated. The information of this answer is either no longer accurate or actively harmful. Proceed with caution.

  • The answer automatically falls below all other positively or neutrally scored answers in the post [Yes, even when it is accepted]
  • The answer can no longer be edited by anyone but the OP or voted on

Now onto what this system will NOT do:

  • Lose the answerer any reputation
  • Invalidate any votes on the answer
  • Actually delete the answer

Let me know what you think, this proposal is considered community wiki, feel free to edit as you please.

Lets get this problem sorted out.

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  • 4
    It'd be better to get some answers to refine this, first - if we make it CW now all kinds of edits happen here in the initial proposal and we lose sight of how this evolves. Once there's a consensus, we can edit / cw this to make it reflect that.
    – user50049
    Commented Jan 7, 2016 at 14:07
  • 2
    Irrespective of the merits or flaws in the rest of your proposal, removing the acceptance mark is a no-go. Acceptance only means that the answer helped the OP at some point in the past, and has no other meaning. The fact that a solution is deprecated does not have for consequence that the accepted answer has not helped the OP in the past.
    – Louis
    Commented Jan 7, 2016 at 14:07
  • @TimPost Alright, but I want to state for the record that this was not my original idea, I just concreticised and formulated on the idea.
    – Magisch
    Commented Jan 7, 2016 at 14:07
  • @Louis As long as the acceptance mark necessitates the answer beeing pinned to first, it needs to go. If there is a way for it to keep its mark, but still sink below all upvoted answers, that would work too. The OP's intent or what helped him is of no consequence to the usefulness of the answer for future visitors.
    – Magisch
    Commented Jan 7, 2016 at 14:08
  • 1
    @Magisch If you have a problem with the accepted answer being pinned first, then file a feature request about that (i.e. not pinning it). (Actually, I think it's been filed already.)
    – Louis
    Commented Jan 7, 2016 at 14:09
  • 1
    @Louis If you hadn't read it yet, Tim's linked answer actually brings up the accepted mark issue. I guarantee that's the only reason Magisch put removing the acceptance mark in here- Most of this looks pretty straight based off what Tim suggested a feature request for deprecation would need.
    – Kendra
    Commented Jan 7, 2016 at 14:23
  • 1
    @Kendra It says in the first paragraph that this is a direct result of Tim's proposal.
    – Magisch
    Commented Jan 7, 2016 at 14:23
  • @Magisch Yes, and I was pointing out to Louis that the accepted mark being removed was specifically mentioned there, since that's what he brought up against this proposal. Saying this is a direct result just means this came about because that was posted- It doesn't mean you took that idea pretty much for word and ran with it.
    – Kendra
    Commented Jan 7, 2016 at 14:24
  • So, if Removing deleted answers from view gets implemented, we have three groups: 1. normal answers 2. deprecated answers 3. deleted answers (the accepted answer is first in its group, unless by OP). Commented Jan 7, 2016 at 14:24
  • Doesn't currently look like the community is taking kindly to it :/
    – Magisch
    Commented Jan 7, 2016 at 14:25
  • 1
    I would be in favor of this FR if the remove accepted answer is dropped. Why can't an answer be most helpful for the OP and oth be deprecated by the community. You try to solve two problems in one go. I read the setup from Tim as a way to get the answer deprecation going first. Let us deal with the accepted answers later. I upvoted Tim's answer but I can't support this FR.
    – rene
    Commented Jan 7, 2016 at 14:26
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    @Kendra It does not matter to me whether Tim, Shog, or the pope suggests that the acceptance mark should be removed when an answer is deprecated. It is inherently incompatible with the meaning that SO gives to the mark ("[The mark] simply means that the author received an answer that worked for him or her personally", see here.) Only the OP knows what worked for him or her personally. Having a third party removing it is on par with moderators invalidating votes because they don't agree with the votes.
    – Louis
    Commented Jan 7, 2016 at 14:33
  • 1
    @Louis In Tim's answer below, it describes the check mark not being there. The mark is removed, the fact it was accepted and that was not changed by the OP is not. All that's removed is the symbol, potentially (and probably best) replaced with a comment in the notice that the answer was accepted (and technically still is) before the deprecation.
    – Kendra
    Commented Jan 7, 2016 at 14:48
  • 2
    Can we do this at the same time: De-emphasise the accept mark if there's an answer the community strongly prefers?
    – Paulie_D
    Commented Jan 7, 2016 at 14:49
  • 1
    Related meta.stackexchange.com/questions/98589/…
    – user1228
    Commented Jan 7, 2016 at 15:26

3 Answers 3

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As a start, why don't we keep it simple and we don't take it any further FOR NOW as Tim's initial proposal

As a community we want to be able to signal prominently (with a post notice) to future visitors that an highly upvoted answer is nowadays actually harmful/very bad practice.

We give users with 15K of reputation the privilege to vote for deprecation. The following rules apply (verbatim copy from Tim's answer):

  • Must be an answer (though, we want to know if many answers to a question are deprecated, because the question probably has some issues too)
  • Must be at least 1 year old
  • Must have received at least 5 down votes in the last 30 days and still have a positive score of at least +5(? probably needs to be configurable so all sites can have it) - otherwise just delete the darn thing
  • Must not be community wiki - otherwise just fix the darn thing

If 5 deprecation votes are in a post notice is added. The notice is removed if 5 user vote for undeprecation.

And that is it. There will be no change in the accepted answer, nor in the sort order of answers. There only is a community driven, very strong and prominent, signal that the answer shouldn't be considered as a viable solution and probably shouldn't receive up votes for that reason but there is no need to enforce that.

When implemented as this first small step we, as a community, can learn how well it works and have better evidence if the sort order needs to be adjusted as well, or if the accepted answer really needs to go. Trying to fix all these things at once is not going to get the support needed. Let's do evolution instead of revolution.

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  • Why not change the sort order? Why leave the answer, now community marked as deprecated, at the top of the list? Why in one fell swoop put the answer on the top of the list (or very nearly at the top) and yet tell future users it's outdated and they probably aren't looking for that answer? If our goal is to have answers to programming problems that are easy to find, I would think you wouldn't want something that is in most, if not all, future cases not going to work stuck at the top.
    – Kendra
    Commented Jan 7, 2016 at 14:55
  • @Kendra because we want something to change. I'm very much in favor of doing all that at once but I doubt we will ever get enough support for that. Instead of trying to fix everything I try a salami approach. Do this first. See how it works, that gives us time to gather evidence that the sort order can change as well and that maybe opens up the minds for getting rid of the accepted answer mark if that is still needed.
    – rene
    Commented Jan 7, 2016 at 15:00
  • That makes sense as you've worded it in your comment. Your answer didn't read to me like a "Let's start with this, then we can make improvements from there if we see room for it." or a "Let's try this first, see how well it actually works, then maybe see about adding a few more things as we go." In light of that being your goal with this suggestion, I can certainly agree with that approach.
    – Kendra
    Commented Jan 7, 2016 at 15:03
  • 1
    Tnx @Kendra I updated the answer to reflect that better.
    – rene
    Commented Jan 7, 2016 at 15:12
  • I disagree. I consider marking it deprecated already a compromise. I'd actually be in favor of giving the community the ability to delete a highly upvoted answer, maybe with 10 or 20 delete votes.
    – Magisch
    Commented Jan 7, 2016 at 15:27
  • @Magisch And what if we find something deprecated (and by the deletion idea you propose, delete it) just to find that a number of developers work in a way-behind company and need that answer to fix the issue they've encountered? It could still happen. Marking it as deprecated leaves the answer there for users who might actually still need the old way, while telling users with the newer stuff "Hey! This probably won't work for you..." I think rene has a point with taking the changes slow to begin with.
    – Kendra
    Commented Jan 7, 2016 at 15:32
  • 1
    @Magisch oh, those delete votes would be easy to abuse. I'm not against getting rid of stuff that is not the quality we want but giving that much power to me requires a strong believe from the community in my judgement.
    – rene
    Commented Jan 7, 2016 at 15:34
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    @Kendra has a really good point here, which is why I want to make these more of museum artifacts whenever possible. They might still be useful to someone practically, and stand an even bigger chance of being useful to someone historically, as in 'this is how they used to do it'. We don't want to lose signal here, but we very much don't want what was once great signal to be mostly noise (or just very bad information) in the faces of most folks that find it.
    – user50049
    Commented Jan 7, 2016 at 17:14
  • 15k? As a 100 rep user learning Swift, you immediately find hundreds of answers in swift that are deprecated, beyond any doubt.
    – Raphael
    Commented Sep 1, 2017 at 9:21
  • 1
    Why should we wait for a number of downvotes to deprecate a clearly out of date answer? Downvotes should only be for answers with low quality. Commented May 23, 2020 at 17:24
  • I found an answer for google chrome where version 56 was the latest version where the answer was applicable. It was of high quality back then. Now when the chrome version is 83, it is uselesss. There is no reason why users below 15K reputation should not be able to flag that as deprecated. Commented May 23, 2020 at 17:27
5

We can't preserve the check mark as it would normally be displayed when an answer is deprecated if the hope is to get the answer at the bottom of the sort order, it's simply just too much additional confusion for non-power users from a product standpoint. We have .. let's just say .. had some kinda heated internal discussions about this.

What we can do once a PostHistory record is created for deprecation is:

  • Show a post notice that the answer was once great, but has fallen out of relevancy, and remains for historical purposes
  • Indicate that the answer was accepted (if it was accepted, a non-trivial amount that would meet this criteria aren't) as the answer that the OP indicated helped them the most within that notice

Think about it for a second, you really don't want that green check mark next to something that gives advice that would end up in syndicates p0wning your app.

In essence we're creating artifacts of things instead of just deleting them, so you really can think of these answers as being relics in a museum - and speak to what they were in the notice we put under them.

Just tossing that out.

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  • Given my "acceptance mark removal" objection, I should comment. This is not "removal", as people looking at the answer will still be able to know the answer was accepted. (It is also not "removal" in the sense of "unaccepting", which practically is what "removing the acceptance mark" amounts to for normal users: we cannot remove it without unaccepting.) I'm still of the opinion that the problem with the acceptance mark is that people take it to mean something else than what it means, and that misconception is what should be addressed.
    – Louis
    Commented Jan 7, 2016 at 15:18
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    @Louis Lets be realistic here, we can't meaningfully change behaviour of google drive-by users. A green checkmark signifies the "best" response in so many people's eyes. It simply has to go.
    – Magisch
    Commented Jan 7, 2016 at 15:19
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    @Magisch SO could do a better job at not leading readers astray. a) It could not pin the accepted answer to the top, ever. b) The tooltip on the check mark could avoid saying "best answer". Right now it says "the question owner accepted this as the best answer". It could reflect what the help says regarding the mark and say instead "the question owner found that this answer worked for him or her personally". c) The mark could be something else than a checkmark. It could be a badge saying "Asker's choice" for instance.
    – Louis
    Commented Jan 7, 2016 at 15:33
2

I have issues with specific bullets in the proposal. However, I am in favor of finding a way to make deprecation work.

  • Once deprecated, the author can still edit his answer. Barring community wiki answers (which are uneligible), this feature can only be used for answers which are considered so wrong that they cannot be fixed without changing the intent of the author at least partly, so only the original author is allowed to edit at this point.

and

  • The answer can no longer be edited by anyone but the OP or voted on

If the OP has chosen to abandon a post, I don't think locking it from being edited by others is the right thing to do. There are other users that may know a way to fix a problem. This is especially true for depricated answers that are related to small API changes versus old libraries. If changing something from old_insecure_method(parameter) to new_secure_method(parameter) is all it takes to make a post not-depreciated, then I think others should be able to make that change. Obviously, it'd be better if it was mentioned why that change was made to the code, but the point is that by allowing anyone to make the change we can fix the "easy" answers that get deprecated. We don't depend on an OP that may or may not return or a group of 5 users that wandered through a review queue and may or may not know anything about the question they voted on.


  • The answer automatically falls below all other positively or neutrally scored answers in the post [Yes, even when it is accepted]

If we are attaching a warning to the top of a post that says it's deprecated, I don't think that forcing it to be at the bottom of the list is needed. Let it be sorted naturally. The warning should be enough to catch someone's attention. I realize that this answer gets a lot of flags still. Notice that the warning is at the bottom. I'm making the argument that posting the warning first (like the message box for duplicate questions) would help curtail this.


  • After the vote has passed, the original author is notified of the pending depreciation, and can try and edit the answer accordingly, if he does, all people voting for depreciation are notified and have a chance to recast or retract their vote

This sounds noisy. Many of us can point out a number of deprecated answers. Let's assume that most of those end up in this review queue and the rest of us go vote to deprecate the answers. For every one question that is deprecated there are a minimum of 6 notices that get sent out (1 to the OP and 1 to each of the 5 voters). If a reviewer handles several of these in the queue daily, they will be getting many more notices than normal. I can see it quickly becoming noise.

I have one alternative proposal, but I'm not convinced it's the right way to go. Instead of notifying the original voters, we can make this more like the Close and Reopen Queues. We have a queue for pending deprecations (this proposal) then we need the opposite as well. If edits are made to improve a post that has been deprecated, throw it into an "Undeprecated" queue. It'd work the same way the Reopen queue does. I think this falls in line with the bullet you mentioned here:

Other users can cast un-depreciate and deprecate votes as necessary (when raised on meta for instance)


I also have a policy related concern: When do we start the deprecation process? Do we do it when a language updates a point release? Do we do it when there is a new major version? Two new major versions? Only when there is a security vulnerability in old code? When a library is merged into or pull out of the core language? All of these? Each of these can potentially cause deprecation, yet some of much less important they are dealt with immediately.

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  • I don't think there is much difference between voting for deprecation as for closing. Stuff gets (close) votes if users stumbles across them. I don't see it as a must to deprecate all the things at once.
    – rene
    Commented Jan 7, 2016 at 15:04

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