42

I'm having an issue posting self-answered questions here on Stack Overflow.

To begin with, I'm an NX Open developer. I develop automation programs for Siemens NX using its API called "NX Open". I have a lot of knowledge about how to do common/uncommon things with NX, as well as various problems that can occur when writing NX applications. Note: I'm not affiliated with Siemens in any way. I'm just an individual working on my own projects.

I've discovered that here on Stack Overflow, there are few questions relating to genuine programming problems that occur with NX Open, and I'm disappointed about that because there are a lot of NX Open developers out there who could benefit from Stack Overflow as well.

NX Open is available in C++, C#, Java, and Python as well as a legacy API for C, which are all about equally used among the broad community of NX users. Therefore, I tend to provide code snippets in all of the NX Open languages. At first I was adding these snippets all as separate answers to a single question tagged with the etc. (and ), but the community generally didn't approve the use of all those tags at once (which I understand completely; however, they were really valid here), so I decided to restrict the question to only a single language. After doing this, my question (in C++) got several upvotes and all seemed well, until I created another question (about the exact same topic, only in C#). Then and there, the second question (and soon the first question, a little) got downvotes and close-votes.

I believe that it's important to show the different languages because—

  • The languages vary in their usage of language syntax, libraries, and features, as well as the structure of the NX Open API itself (e.g. a class in one language is named differently, placed differently, and accessed in a different manner from that in another language)
  • No one language is used significantly more than another

I've read questions such as What can be done to improve moderation of self answered questions?, How to correctly post a qa style question, i.e. self answer without it failing?, "Answer your own question -- share your knowledge" gets downvotes.

Those discussions collectively seem to indicate that the question has to be high-quality as well as the answer, which I agree with, but I disagree with the fact that questions such as this, which I opened a little bit ago, are low-quality. I find it silly to fake some steps so it appears as though I made an attempt to solve the problem. Moreover, we have lots and lots of such questions here on Stack Overflow, e.g. this, this, this, this, this, this, and a whole enormous host of others. In addition, while the general community may not understand these questions, anyone who is actually trying to develop using the NX Open API will understand them.

Those discussions also state that asking questions for self-answering "can easily come across as self-promotion or soapboxing, or as fishing for rep by posting useless trivia." However, this is not the case, as I only post self-answered Q&A like this if I've been asked the question multiple times (and with both NX Open topics I've posted about, I have.), not just any thing I've figured out how do to, so they can't possibly be "useless trivia".


This answer to a question about dupe questions in different languages says:

A .NET question, where C# is used to illustrate the question, can also be answered using VB.NET or F# code, as long as the type and method names are recognizable.

However, the differences between the NX Open languages are more than syntactical: the NX Open APIs differ and in many places not slightly; therefore it can be pretty difficult to translate correctly between, for example, Java and C++.

Does the community have any advice how to handle this situation? I really want to help NX Open users via Stack Overflow, because many, many times I've had a problem myself and it's hard when the site you go to for just about every other programming problem has almost nothing in the area you're working in.

This and this are the questions in question :)

20
  • 21
    Your examples of "lots and lots of such questions" are all more than 13 years old, when SO was in its infancy. They are generally not a good indicator of what is acceptable nowadays. Commented Nov 2, 2021 at 14:23
  • 9
    This is not related to a question being self-answered or not. You are focusing on the wrong angle.
    – yivi
    Commented Nov 2, 2021 at 14:25
  • 2
    @Jeanne True; but they are the type of question that I'm imitating. We need more NX Open knowledge on SO, and no has done it yet, so I'm trying to. I don't see much of a different doing it 13 years ago vs. doing it now. Those simple questions were very helpful back then as they are now, so why can't more questions have similar use?
    – user17242583
    Commented Nov 2, 2021 at 14:25
  • 4
    "I find it silly to fake some steps so it appears as though I made an attempt to solve the problem." Then don't... but accept the consequences of not doing so. Commented Nov 2, 2021 at 14:26
  • 22
    There's nothing wrong with your question other than that some people believe this place should be a help desk; that every question should involve debugging a problem you already have, not be a solution waiting to be found.
    – Kevin B
    Commented Nov 2, 2021 at 14:38
  • 11
    I think you did fine, but self answers are generally an up-hill battle because you don't have someone there to be "helped" by your answer, and therefore don't have the immediate upvote + accept that those draw.
    – Kevin B
    Commented Nov 2, 2021 at 14:40
  • 8
    Have you considered posting only a single answer instead of splitting each language in a separate answer? This would look a lot less like rep-farming and voting would also make more sense as you're using the same approach in every language. Commented Nov 2, 2021 at 14:56
  • 3
    That's actually what I did at first, but then I split them up. You make good points. I'll do that!
    – user17242583
    Commented Nov 2, 2021 at 14:58
  • 3
    Then what should I do about that tags? Maybe only add an nxopen tag an no programming language tags?
    – user17242583
    Commented Nov 2, 2021 at 14:59
  • 1
    This is somewhat similar to Selenium questions. On the order of five different programming languages are supported, including Java, Python, and C# (the Wikipedia count may be on the high side in terms of practicality - documentation coverage, etc). Commented Nov 2, 2021 at 21:25
  • 4
    You could contribute to the tag wiki for MX Open. For instance, a less terse answer to the question "What is it?". It is also missing an excerpt. Commented Nov 2, 2021 at 21:40
  • 1
    That's a great idea @Peter! I tried to earlier, but I wasn't able to. It looks like there's an edit pending for it...maybe some folks here could review it?
    – user17242583
    Commented Nov 3, 2021 at 0:47
  • 9
    @KevinB "some people believe this place should be a help desk" - There is the problem, Stack Overflow isn't a helpdesk or a forum, it's a library of canonical questions and answers to common programming problems. The fact it gets treated like a helpdesk and/or forum by some is irrelevant.
    – user692942
    Commented Nov 3, 2021 at 11:04
  • 2
    The question you linked looks like it should be a chapter in NX Open's documentation... In that form, it's just not a good fir for StackOverflow.
    – Cerbrus
    Commented Nov 3, 2021 at 13:04
  • 5
    Even if it's true that the Q&A should be a chapter in the documentation, that is no proof it is inappropriate for Stack Overflow. That particular question seems reasonably scoped enough, based on its answer, to be suitable for SO. Only objection that I have is that not enough time was spent writing the question. It still has to be a reasonable quality question, even if you are self-answering.
    – Cody Gray Mod
    Commented Nov 3, 2021 at 21:47

4 Answers 4

8

Stack Overflow is for developers trying to solve specific problems

You should consider Stack Overflow's target audience.

The target is someone who was merrily programming, etc, along when -smack- they hit a wall. Maybe it's a bug. Or they need to do a thing and can't figure it out.

So they paste their error message into Google, or else type out a few keywords, and go hunting.

Stack Overflow is often right near the top of those search results and, if all has gone well, contains precisely the answer that person needs to solve their problem and go on about their day. (There's an interesting blog post about how most users never even visit Stack Overflow's home page.)

The problem with broad questions is that they crowd in on those top results, but due to the broadness of the subject, they fail to answer the specific question that the programmer is struggling with. This is part of the reason that broad questions are generally not permitted... they simply aren't useful to most users of the site, and can actually be harmful.

Stack Overflow is for a community of question-answerers

Also... there are many users on Stack Overflow who thoroughly enjoy the question-answering game. Maybe (hopefully) they get a deep sense of satisfaction from helping another human being in the world just for the sake of being helpful. Or maybe they enjoy watching their internet points counter show bigger and bigger numbers, and all the little rewards and badges that come with it. Or, more likely, it's a bit-of-both.

Now, if you start posting questions that only you can answer because you are on a one-person quest to provide the missing docs, all those other users are going to feel pretty shut-out. You might have a fantastic answer in mind, but if you ask a poor question, then it's a one-person show and no one else is invited. It's clearly not intentional, but it does go against the spirit of the Stack Overflow... everybody helping everybody.

You are doing a good thing, but in the wrong place...

I think your motives are pure, but as others have said, this platform isn't built for what you are trying to do. Stack Overflow has dabbled in documentation before, but it didn't go well.

When you are writing a self-answered question, ask yourself, "If one of the creators of the technology I'm about to post about were to show up, would they be able to answer the question?" If the answer is "no", then you are probably about to write a blog post, not a self-answered question.

...But not all is lost!

With some modifications, you can still accomplish your goal! Start by trimming down the scope of your questions a bit and add more details. Think of a realistic scenario, preferably based on something you or someone else has actually encountered, and paint the scene. Give us some juicy details that would enable anyone with sufficient knowledge to provide a decent answer with a paragraph or two of explanation.

Then provide your answer, but remember that you don't have to stick strictly to the question that was asked. Users often appreciate additional details to cover more edge-cases. For example, in a question about how to concatenate strings in SQL, you could include a suggestion to protect against null values even if the OP (who might be you) wasn't asking specifically about that. Or in a question about matching numbers in regex, you could cover additional details about common problems and cover a wider than asked for variety of scenarios. Just make sure you actually answer the question. 😉

For your case, it might help to pick the language you are most comfortable or familiar with when posting a question, but that doesn't mean you can't provide additional details for other languages. Something like "Here's how you do that in C++, and also while I'm at it the C# looks like this..."

1
  • 1
    ask yourself, "If one of the creators of the technology I'm about to post about were to show up, would they be able to answer the question"? — Interesting way of thinking about it. As a matter of fact, for the topics I've posted about so far, the answer will be "yes" - in fact, for a skilled NX Open developer (like me), these are easy questions.
    – user17242583
    Commented Nov 3, 2021 at 20:39
6

The problems with your questions is that they are very broad and do not contain any hints of research or examples what you tried. They are essentially: "How do I do this whole thing - I didn't attempt anything - just gimme the code". Such questions will certainly get shot down with tons of down- and close votes.

Yes, I realize that you are doing self-answered Q&A, which is perfectly fine and even encouraged. But not all readers might realize, so the question part in such Q&A has to uphold the same standards as any other question on the site, no matter how good the answer is. Writing the question is actually one of the hardest parts of self-answered Q&A!

General tips & tricks:

  • Include part of the answer in the question itself, as to demonstrate that you have "done some research effort" (even though you might actually be a domain expert of this NX Open for all I know). For example: "When doing x, we know that we first have to do y and I have done so, but still I can't get this working."

  • Similarly, you could quote relevant parts of the API manual or other canonical sources in the question itself. This adds value to the question.

  • Include code examples, even if they are deliberately not correct or bad practice. Your answer can then refer to the same code examples and rewrite them correctly. Create a problem in the question which the answer solves.

  • Keep it to one single programming language at a time, just as you seem to have been doing. Questions tagged with multiple language tags at once are certain to get a poor reception. If your intention is to provide language-independent advise, then you can still use an example language.

    Also, by using a single language, you will get relevant feedback and proof-reading from experts of the chosen language, who might spot problems in your code not related to the NX Open part.

4
  • 14
    It doesn't make any sense to me to "show what you've tried" in a self-answered question. Obviously when the same user posts both the question and the solution they have not only researched or tried to solve the problem, they in fact have solved the problem. Commented Nov 3, 2021 at 16:28
  • 7
    @DavidConrad: If these are real questions that the poster has received in some other venue, then they could include some of the misconceptions or false starts they've heard about in the question. This will make the question more searchable by Google, etc: if someone else tries the same thing and it doesn't work, "Why doesn't [blah blah blah] work?" might find the question, but won't if [blah blah blah] is left out. Commented Nov 3, 2021 at 16:55
  • 3
    @DavidConrad Here is an example: stackoverflow.com/questions/42094465/…. Basically the whole code in the question is one big but common misconception.
    – Lundin
    Commented Nov 3, 2021 at 21:02
  • 2
    OP: If your answer is "here is how to do this whole thing", then it is good that you want to share your knowledge, but the question that you're answering is one that is not appropriate for Stack Overflow. If you want to publish tutorials on OpenNX, then you should do so on your own site. Then you can even, say, use fancy Web 2.0 stuff to tab between examples in different programming languages in-place. Commented Nov 4, 2021 at 12:41
3

At first I was adding these snippets all as separate answers to a single question tagged with the c++ c# java etc. (and nxopen), but the community generally didn't approve the use of all those tags at once (which I understand completely; however, they were really valid here), so I decided to restrict the question to only a single language. After doing this, my question (in C++) got several upvotes and all seemed well, until I created another question (about the exact same topic, only in C#). Then and there, the second question (and soon the first question, a little) got downvotes and close-votes.

Well, that's the sad reality of the current state of the things, which I've complained about several times in the past. But some solutions are at hand, despite what other recommendations say: if your question is about a framework which has facilities for several languages, unless your question is about problems in the language-framework combination, do not use the language tag at all. The answers should specify which language the solution is targeted at if the question doesn't specify it, and some language is needed to illustrate the solution. This is the same thing samcarter suggested in comments. That is consistent with guidance provided by the help center:

Any answer that gets the asker going in the right direction is helpful, but do try to mention any limitations, assumptions or simplifications in your answer. Brevity is acceptable, but fuller explanations are better.

You don't need to limit your answer to a single language if you can target all of them, the same way you don't have to limit yourself to a single version if you can target all of them.

Now, in general, maybe what you are attempting is to create some documentation for the framework. Sadly, that is something we are unable to cater to. The documentation basically describes the tools and how to use them; our model is geared towards solving practical problems you face and which have some context on why the problem exist. Try to focus your questions less on the abstract and more on the specific implementation challenges that someone may face, like exposing the information from the API to some other tool, monitoring the values and responding to them, etc.

5
  • 4
    "our model is geared towards solving practical problems you face and have some context on why the problem exist." — Precisely. Practical problems I'm asked about with some frequency.
    – user17242583
    Commented Nov 3, 2021 at 14:18
  • 2
    "and more on the specific implementation challenges" — this the very reason why I strive to include multiple languages.
    – user17242583
    Commented Nov 3, 2021 at 14:21
  • @user17242583, maybe GitHub will be a better place. Example: github.com/RolandPheasant/DynamicData.Snippets
    – ASh
    Commented Nov 3, 2021 at 14:27
  • 1
    You know, that's interesting...while I might not take that up, it looks interesting and is not a bad idea. But I do value how SO appears at the top place almost everytime for any random programming query on Google. :)
    – user17242583
    Commented Nov 3, 2021 at 14:29
  • 4
    @user17242583 SO appears at the top of most programming-related searches because it usually has relevant matches to the terms being searched for. If you start your own Github repo like linked above, or start nxopen.readthedocs.org, or whatever, and people find it useful, then search engines will point to it. SO is not, and doesn't have to be, the be-all and end-all of every programming-related topic. Maybe you should offer to consult to Siemens and improve their documentation...
    – MattDMo
    Commented Nov 3, 2021 at 15:43
3

The way I see it, immediate self answer questions are a different beast than normal Q&A.

Normally, questions need to describe a problem to potential answerers. They should include as much context as needed to solve the problem, which often requires posting things you've tried or a minimum reproducible example.

Self answered questions on the other hand need to describe the problem to those who may have the same issue. This might include several generalized common situations or potentially an example of problem code. However, they do not need to create an elaborate story to pretend to be someone struggling with code. Self-answered questions only need to be clear and discoverable by those looking for answers.

In my experience using Stack Overflow for research, I usually skim over the question to determine if it applies to my problem and then scroll immediately to the answers. Therefore, the answers are much more important than the question, but the question should still be clear.

You should also put all the answer code for all languages into a single answer. It doesn't make sense to have multiple answers since you can only accept one of them.

Finally, be careful with how granular your questions are. There is a fine line between answering common questions (which you seem to be doing) and just becoming a replacement for the official documentation. Stack Overflow should be a supplement to documentation, not a replacement.

Overall, I think you have the right ideas. I don't think people should be stuck up over having what you researched in the question when you are answering them right away. You should rather strive for concise SEO than clog up your question with every single thing someone could have tried to reach a certain problem.

7
  • 1
    "However, they do not need to create an elaborate story to pretend to be someone struggling with code. Self-answered questions only need to be clear and discoverable by those looking for answers." They should also be discoverable by people who are looking for dupe targets. Commented Nov 4, 2021 at 12:44
  • All good, but bear in mind that there are (at least) two categories of self answered questions: [1] Those where the OP already knows the answer, as in this case. [2] Those where the OP is genuinely seeking a solution to a real world problem, but eventually resolves the issue themself, and posts an answer. Those two categories are very different in nature, and I would guess that the second is much more common than the first.
    – skomisa
    Commented Nov 4, 2021 at 19:42
  • @skomisa This answer is geared toward the former ([1]), as is this question.
    – spicy.dll
    Commented Nov 4, 2021 at 21:47
  • 1
    Well of course, but I am disagreeing with your claim that "self answered questions are a different beast than normal Q&A". The majority of self answered questions are just like most others: the poster has a problem that they can't solve so they ask a question. But then they happen to resolve the problem later, and post an answer. It's only a minority of self answered questions where the poster already knows the answer. Unfortunately there is no term to identify that ask-when-I-already-know-the-answer category, so the ambiguous "self answer" gets used.
    – skomisa
    Commented Nov 4, 2021 at 23:36
  • @skomisa That's true. I've edited my post so It's clear(er) that I'm targeting the minority
    – spicy.dll
    Commented Nov 5, 2021 at 13:17
  • @spicy.dll You've found the perfect phrase to encapsulate what we were discussing: "immediate self answer". Kudos - I'm stealing that.
    – skomisa
    Commented Nov 5, 2021 at 20:43
  • @skomisa well I stole it from the meta tag instant-self-answer
    – spicy.dll
    Commented Nov 5, 2021 at 20:45

You must log in to answer this question.