24

In the end of July I saw this question: https://stackoverflow.com/questions/38547525/transmission-webinterface-on-nginx.

I raised a flag, but it was disputed. Then I raised a flag for moderator attention on July 24th and the flag is still pending. I guess it will soon be aged away. That was odd for me but I decided that questions about web server configuration would be ok for SO.

Yesterday I handled the following review: https://stackoverflow.com/review/triage/13336577.

I wanted to flag again as off-topic, but remembering the question mentioned before, I just reviewed as requires editing. And got banned from review. For a week.

What is the difference between these two questions? Why is the first one well suited for SO, and second one not? Where is the line between web server configuration questions that must be placed on SO or on Server Fault?

P.S. It would be interesting to hear the point of view of moderators.

Edit

Just found question Are questions about webserver config files and rewrite rules on-topic? that has a very interesting conclusion. So I just have one more question: why could reviewing questions with such unobvious belonging be a reason for banning?

10
  • You, ah, surely did not get banned from review for marking that question in the triage queue as "requires editing". Several others did the same thing, and the question was indeed closed. That was a perfectly reasonable review decision.
    – Cody Gray Mod
    Commented Aug 16, 2016 at 9:34
  • @CodyGray That is what I see when I try to go to review page: You reviewed http://stackoverflow.com/review/triage/13336577 incorrectly. Please pay more attention to each review in future. Questions like this should be closed/ flagged as off-topic. Come back in 7 days to continue reviewing.
    – lorond
    Commented Aug 16, 2016 at 9:36
  • 7
    @CodyGray IIRC mods have started to review-ban people for reviewing "unsalvageable" questions (e.g above) as "requires editing" or "looks ok" when they come across it.
    – Magisch
    Commented Aug 16, 2016 at 9:37
  • Possibly this was a manual ban from a moderator. The other reviewers who voted "requires editing" may have met the same fate. Commented Aug 16, 2016 at 9:37
  • I agree last question is off-topic. I just interesting, why previous one is not. And moderators not paying attention to the flag for a couple of weeks. That is the reason I decided not to mark last question as off-topic.
    – lorond
    Commented Aug 16, 2016 at 9:41
  • That first question looks like it does indeed belong on Server Fault or Super User. Questions about nginx are on-topic if they involve programming, but that one is only about configuration. Commented Aug 16, 2016 at 10:03
  • 1
    @Magisch From the description in the UI: "Requires Editing for questions where edits by the author or others would result in a question that is clear and answerable" (emphasis added). All this stuff in your answer about "an outside editor" might as well be something that you made up. The official text in the review queue is advising something different.
    – Cody Gray Mod
    Commented Aug 16, 2016 at 10:46
  • 3
    @CodyGray Questions marked as "requires editing" go into the H&I review queue. The author doesn't frequent that. From all I know (and my experience here) that statement in the mouseover is just false then. A mod or CM can correct me on that, but outside of this text (which is not a very authorative source since there are several such inaccuracies sprayed across the tooling) I can't find a source for that atm.
    – Magisch
    Commented Aug 16, 2016 at 10:55
  • also, @CodyGray That would make little to no sense then, since almost any closable and closed question could be decent if the author edited it heavily...
    – Magisch
    Commented Aug 16, 2016 at 11:00
  • 2
    Thanks to you I realized that I have been using "Requires editing" wrongly for a while. I should count myself lucky that I was not banned so far!
    – IanS
    Commented Aug 16, 2016 at 14:59

2 Answers 2

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I was the moderator that imposed your ban.

I raised a flag, but it was disputed.

Flags can be handled (i.e. marked as helpful, disputed, or declined) by a multitude of scenarios. If your flag was disputed, it was not seen by a moderator. If it was marked as helpful or declined it may have been seen by a moderator.

In your case, your flag was marked as disputed because the consensus (rightly or wrongly) of the triage review was that it looked OK; it was not handled by a moderator.

Then I raised a flag for moderator attention on July 24th and the flag is still pending. I guess it will soon be aged away.

"for moderator attention" flags take a while to process. They have to be handled by one of the moderators. Due to a number of moderators being on summer holidays, these flags have taken even longer to resolve. I apologise for that. FWIW, "for moderator attention" flags do not age away. They will be handled... eventually.

What is the difference between these two questions? Why is the first one well suited for SO, and second one not? Where is the line between web server configuration questions that must be placed on SO or on Server Fault?

There is little difference. They are both off-topic. You carried out the right action in your first review (https://stackoverflow.com/review/triage/13102965) by recommending closure, but the wrong action in the second (https://stackoverflow.com/review/triage/13336577) by choosing "requires editing".

Whilst I can see the delay to your first flag being handled potentially causing you confusion as to how to handle the second review, skip would have been better than guessing.

So I just have one more question: why could reviewing questions with such unobvious belonging be a reason for banning?

I do not agree that it is unobvious as to whether these questions are off-topic on Stack Overflow. At no point in the 7 years I have been on Stack Overflow would they have been on-topic.

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  • 1
    Can you comment about the issue raised by Cody Gray here in the comments when it comes to recommending "requires editing"? I'd like to know if I have been viewing the review queue moderately wrong so far.
    – Magisch
    Commented Aug 16, 2016 at 11:04
  • 24
    If this means that a single honest review mistake can get you banned from reviewing, perhaps that should be elaborated on a bit. Seems pretty harsh.
    – tripleee
    Commented Aug 16, 2016 at 11:04
  • 4
    @tripleee: I can't explain the rationale any better than Flexo does over here.
    – Matt Mod
    Commented Aug 16, 2016 at 11:06
  • 1
    @Magisch: the definition I use is meta.stackoverflow.com/a/319129/444991
    – Matt Mod
    Commented Aug 16, 2016 at 11:09
  • @Matt In that case the official review guidance for triage could use some fixing. Cody made a FR about that here. But yes, it pretty much affirms what I thought so far, that questions who can't be answered unless OP gets some more info in are to be marked "unsalvageable".
    – Magisch
    Commented Aug 16, 2016 at 11:22
  • 1
    @Magisch: I've already upvoted it ;)
    – Matt Mod
    Commented Aug 16, 2016 at 11:23
5

The review cited in the ban was not an audit, so the ban was issued by a moderator, manually. That means a moderator saw your review and decided you needed a time out and pointer that you reviewed this incorrectly.

"requires editing" is actually not appropriate for this case. That question isn't salvageable by a normal editor, its grossly off topic and fails to specify a desired output, as well as a reproducible examples.

These are not issues that an outside editor in a review queue (that's what "requires editing" will do to a post) can fix.

You should have reviewed this as "Unsalvageable" and then pick your poison of close reasons. Many of the off-topic reasons fit here.

I can't speak to the technical veracity of the other question you mentioned, but it looks much better then the first one. First of all, it actually features code. Second of all, the problem is described in great detail and the asker has outlined steps they took to try and resolve the problem. Third of all it features all the relevant information (I think, anyways) to reproduce the problem.

While I can't judge the merits if the second one should be closed (I'm not an expert in the subject area), its not obviously off topic. That would require more careful examination.

As to why your moderator flag is still pending, moderator flags should first of all not be used as a substitute for close flags, moderators don't usually assess question content.

Second of all, moderators get thousands of flags daily, and thus it makes sense that some of those take longer to process.

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  • Please, read my question carefully. I'm not asking why I was banned. I understand and agree that question if off-topic. My question is why second question I mentioned is not off-topic. What the difference? And why moderators does no pay attention to the flag for a weeks?
    – lorond
    Commented Aug 16, 2016 at 9:44
  • @lorond Alright, I'll add a paragraph about that. Gimme a couple of minutes.
    – Magisch
    Commented Aug 16, 2016 at 9:45
  • @lorond I added a paragraph about your second question.
    – Magisch
    Commented Aug 16, 2016 at 9:51
  • Just add an edit.
    – lorond
    Commented Aug 16, 2016 at 9:54
  • 2
    but it looks much better then the first one that is why I reviewed as requires editing. After edit it could looks fine too.
    – lorond
    Commented Aug 16, 2016 at 9:55
  • @lorond The things that are better about it than in the first one are not thinsg that a random user could edit in (additional details).
    – Magisch
    Commented Aug 16, 2016 at 9:56
  • Inquiring user can be asked for additional details. Not everyone can phrase their questions well. Some people need help in it.
    – lorond
    Commented Aug 16, 2016 at 9:59
  • " I'm not asking why I was banned." .. then please change your title. You put the focus on the ban right from the start.
    – Bart
    Commented Aug 16, 2016 at 10:03

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