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Ok no socialist phrases here, but a serious question.

Answering questions is motivated by reputation points, the value of which -- in and outside of SO -- is discussed elsewhere. Now, senior members with a lot of answered questions can watch their points grow every day.

I suppose a common reason for this are answers to standard questions like "what is a pointer" given long ago which were upvoted, say, 850 times in total and still twice a day. On the other hand, a similar new standard question will quickly be marked as a duplicate, leaving newbies no chance to enter.

Thus it seems that all the realm is divided among the senior members, whereas new users are facing harder and harder conditions to make their "first million". (Sorry for speaking again in society/economy terms, but there is a clear parallel. Even with those daily growth limits I read about).

Is this desired? Is it "fair"? (...I know this word sucks)

Some possible problems:

  • First, people think linearly, but points grow quadratically.
  • Seeing little chances could distract new users to invest more effort.
  • Self-fulfilling prophecies: I trust the guy with 200k and not the one with 100. So I'll upvote. So the next will, and so on. Same with downvotes, duplicates, etc.
  • maybe some more, but I have to leave now.

Disclaimer: I have no reasonable personal interest in reputation points. I don't need them for my job, and not either for jerking in front of a mirror ;-)


EDIT: Ok, I see my question seems to have offended some of you (the proprietary classes ... ;-) ok, I'll stop). This was not my intention -- I'm glad that this site exists, as I already profited a lot of it. Rather, I wanted to start a constructive discussion on the two possible effects I mentioned (and others which may have arised during discussion). And then maybe on how to improve possible issues (maybe by a temporal cap? ... stone him to death!).

But maybe I should have taken more time for a less-offensive and more diplomatic formulation, and leave aside the bad jokes ;-)

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    Those answers help people every day. Of course it is fair. And that's from someone who's a relative new-comer (I've only been really active for the past 2 years). Commented May 8, 2014 at 16:50
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    " I trust the guy with 200k and not the one with 100. So I'll upvote" you shouldn't upvote because you "trust" them because of their rep. You should upvote because it was helpful, regardless of rep, hair color, avatar, how many unicorns they own, etc...
    – codeMagic
    Commented May 8, 2014 at 16:51
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    @MartijnPieters: On Stack Overflow, you're only a newcomer for the first three days or so. At that point, you either get question-banned, or you survive the initiation and become a productive contributor.
    – Robert Harvey Mod
    Commented May 8, 2014 at 16:51
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    @RobertHarvey: I skirted that problem by not asking questions until my account was 4 1/2 years old.. Commented May 8, 2014 at 16:52
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    I wanted to seriously discuss the list of possible problems. I know that life's not fair, and me myself I profitted a lot from SO.
    – davidhigh
    Commented May 8, 2014 at 16:55
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    "Points grow quadratically" - evidence? Bear in mind that the rep cap limits this very significantly.
    – Jon Skeet
    Commented May 8, 2014 at 17:03
  • @MartijnPieters There are some with 1 year olds too with account 2 1/2 years old.
    – devnull
    Commented May 8, 2014 at 17:07
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    @JonSkeet - is that a trace of bitterness I note there?! :-P
    – user1345223
    Commented May 8, 2014 at 17:08
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    @JonSkeet Try posting an obviously incorrect answer, just once.
    – devnull
    Commented May 8, 2014 at 17:09
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    @devnull - simply not possible. They would rewrite the language to fix the bug that Jon pointed out.
    – user1345223
    Commented May 8, 2014 at 17:10
  • How much rep was accrued before the 200/d cap was implemented?
    – Gayot Fow
    Commented May 8, 2014 at 17:16
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    Socialist thinking doesn't really apply to rep because there is no interest, and no way to make people work for you... but yeah, I agree it's more difficult to become a mega-rep user tday than it was four years ago
    – Pekka
    Commented May 8, 2014 at 17:23
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    Thus it seems that all the realm is divided... What is this, Game of Thrones? Commented May 8, 2014 at 17:33
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    Rep doesn't make you better than someone else. It gets you merit-based privileges, and that's about it. People trust high-rep users because they've earned it, but it doesn't mean they're the only ones to trust.
    – Jasper
    Commented May 9, 2014 at 0:07

4 Answers 4

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Even on the best of days the monk Wangohan's mood would rival old vinegar, but the long bleak winter had soured it still more. Many were the target of his scorn, but none moreso than the monk Landhwa:

“His lazyiness is no secret,” Wangohan complained to one poor novice at mealtime (who all-too-late understood why the seats near Wangohan were always empty), “yet from his masters he receives no correction. He presents the illusion of being industrious but in truth he is coding his own pet projects. I asked him to implement a dozen simple DAOs; he chafed at the tediousness of the task, then wasted a week developing a DAO-code-generator to spit them out!”

When the gong called the brothers back to their cubicles, a senior monk pulled the novice aside.

“What impression have you of our brother Wangohan?” grinned the senior monk. “Surely you have something to say on this matter, unless he has truly talked your head off.”

The novice thought a moment.

“Wangohan has the spirit of the mule: dedicated and hard-laboring,” said the novice. “I would trust him to carry ten thousand stones from the valley to the temple.”

“High praise,” said the senior monk.

“Is it?” asked the novice. “His rival Landhwa would first build a wheelbarrow.”

http://thecodelesscode.com/case/129

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    Time to earn the reverse badge!
    – devnull
    Commented May 8, 2014 at 17:00
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    What does this have to do with the question? Commented Feb 5, 2016 at 10:49
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Okay. I may be late on answering this question. But the point is, all those people whom you are referring as rich were not what they are now, as soon as they entered SO.

If you see any high rep user, you'll be able to see that he has answered at least 5000 questions.

Yes. I accept that sometimes reps a user has on SO will make us feel that his answer is the best, but that is not the case. The community is fair enough to downvote.

I can be sure even now that, if Jon (Do you need Skeet?) answers something badly, (which he will never do), the community will downvote him and I'm sure on it.

Yeah, I certainly accept that the amount of up votes makes one feel jealous.(I certainly was).

If you want to be a high rep user, then contribute constantly and help the community and the day when your answer getting upvoted 1000 times is not so far I suppose. But, don't criticize people who have been doing it for 4-5 years.

See, SO favors those who are active. Let's do a comparison with you and me and Jon.

Who  |  Member For  |  Number Of Answers |  Reps   |
-----|--------------|--------------------|---------|
Me   |  5 months    |        882         |  12332  |
     |              |                    |         |
You  |  11 months   |         9          |    195  |
     |              |                    |         |
Jon  |  5yrs,7mnth  |       29065        | 672,891 |

The statistics reveal much.

Don't think this as a insult or my boasting or something like that. I'm stating facts. I'm more active and contributing more, which is why I'm highly repped than you. Jon has been more active and he has more reps than me.

See, you aren't contributing much, which is giving high rep users a chance to go even higher.

This answer should answer your question I suppose.

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  • Thank you for the first serious contribution to the topic. Nevertheless, you git the key point wrong. I didn't ask the question due to jealousy, and I know the reason why people have high rep (I have answered my x-thousand questions on another physics&math site and surely know that it is often hard and unpaid work). The key point was (or should have been) the question on the negative consequences, and on how to probabily cure them. But thanks anyway!
    – davidhigh
    Commented May 11, 2014 at 12:34
  • Btw. here are average results: You 13.98, Me 21.67, Jon 23.15. I would say, look out Jon! :-D
    – davidhigh
    Commented May 11, 2014 at 12:37
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    Oh wait, my score just changed to 305 (with 10 answers)... time to retire!
    – davidhigh
    Commented May 11, 2014 at 14:11
  • @davidhigh, what average are you talking about?
    – Amit Joki
    Commented May 11, 2014 at 16:12
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    Reps/Number_of_answers ... nevermind, it was meant to be a joke. Anyways, I'll have a drink tonight on my Michael-Jordan-like 30 point average ;-)
    – davidhigh
    Commented May 11, 2014 at 19:15
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My conclusions are that the current voting system favors pop-culture more than advanced research. By the Parkinson's law of triviality, few people will dare to opine on the details about a nuclear reactor, but everyone will have a strong opinion about the bike shed next to that reactor.

Topics that are already popular garner much more attention (and votes) rather than specific one-off research into some obscure feature of some fringe library. If you are after reputation, your presentation skills and sense of vogue are much more important than the technical erudition. Probably even more important are the SO-meta skills, using API to select the best questions to answer and a good sense of what to ask so that everyone can relate to it.

It is not bad, it is a working model and immensely useful to lots of people. The pressure to earn reputation is indeed high, and it indeed squeezes the juice out of newcomers. I suspect that all users above 200K reputation have outstanding qualifications from any angle, but all users 100-100K could be very similar in their ability to help you with answers. Growing from hundreds to thousands of rep requires immense work and commitment to do it the hard way (by answering all questions you are competent of answering). The one-question userNNNN-s are the greatest beneficiaries. I have overwhelming confidence that I can get a personal answer on any properly formulated question in a timely manner (both due to that pressure on career newcomers who need their first few hundred rep and thanks to established pro answerers who have indeed earned their reputation).

However, different voting schemes would also be interesting, and there is a lot of space for creating other sites with different community building principles. SO has done great job, now it's your turn to come forward and build a better site/community.

To answer your question, yes, it is OK by me.

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  • Thanks and upvote for the good discussion. I'm not looking for a new voting system, the one here is quite advanced (which doesn't mean, however, that it can't be improved). I also won't build a new site, since SO is, from a meta-perspective, such well-respected 200k+ user ;-) (...ok, I also don't have the skills :-D)
    – davidhigh
    Commented May 11, 2014 at 12:48
  • I forgot to mention that a total stranger's vote counts exactly the same as a seasoned user's vote. This requires some research who is casting more votes, and if reputation-hunters should cater more to the casual passers-by or to the scrutinizing experienced members.
    – MKaama
    Commented May 11, 2014 at 19:32
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I agree. I have tried many times to post questions, and they have gotten down-votes, even though similar questions that were simple got highly voted.

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    Were those other questions perhaps posted a long time ago, when we had a far wider scope (as smaller communities can afford)? And was it not a duplictate at that time, probably contrary to yours? (And yes, from a "gain rep fast and easy"-POV, it's a shame most of the basic questions are already asked and answered at least a dozen times, and most of them at least once well.) Commented Dec 21, 2015 at 17:54

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