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I came here to share my experience and elaborate on how the programming community I came into at the age of 12 almost ruined programming for me. Sorry to make it anecdotal but I feel the ethos will really contribute to my argument, so that's what I'm doing.

I remember creating my first Stack Overflow account at 12. I’d been “programming”, if you could really call it that, in BASIC and VB for a few years. Just simple stuff, trying to write my own minimal text editor, learning a lot from Stack Overflow answers. I’d never had to ask a question before, for a time all my problems were so general that it was simply never necessary. Until one fateful day a little over six years ago.

Had Stack Overflow only shown me the answer I needed I never would have posted. I didn’t read the rules, I didn’t include a minimal, reproducible example, and it wasn’t very well put either. Mind I was TWELVE YEARS OLD.

The post is marked as a duplicate by six users and downvoted 5 times. No one offers me help, and no one asks for a better example because Stack Overflow has trained them to be harsh to their fellow programmer and this community is hard-pressed to consider any end-user but themselves.

Without help, I never figure it out, and I don’t come back to Stack Overflow for help for another three months. I’ve been 13 for four days when I post again. I’m failing to understand what’s causing a syntax error in VBScript, so I ask. I’m met with not only downvotes but what, for lack of a less provocative word, is cyberbullying in the comments. Four people respond; three of them provide nothing constructive, three of them aren’t solving any problems. All of them have reputations ranging from 1000 to over 150,000. They earning more for acting this way.

I stay away for an entire year next time, proceedingly asking six questions over a three month period. One receives an answer. I’m getting nowhere so I log out and I uninstall Visual Studio, Eclipse, and Brackets. External circumstances aside, the programming community on Stack Overflow is the reason I stop programming for an entire year. For most of this time, I’m dead set that I will never program again because it simply didn’t feel worth it.

Out of embarrassment for my history on the original account, I make this one. Arguably, having learned more and matured over the past year, I’m better received on the platform. I was more terrified every time I posted. Looking back on it now I’m still embarrassed for the questions I asked. I look at my account and I see it how everyone else did in the first place: I was a kid, self-taught, who had no understanding of efficiency or the data structures I was using. In some sense I still am, and I still don’t.

For the past three years, I’ve decided it was just better never to ask a question. To spend four days figuring out whatever little problem I had, making thousands of Google searches. It was, as it remains, emotionally easier for me to not be part of the Stack Overflow programming community. Sometimes I come back, and I find new questions with the same naivete of my own, and I just answer them. I’ve only answered 8 because I don’t like spending time being in this community at all.

So why did I bring all this to Meta today? Because I logged in again. I am always logged in, I find answers here still. But today I clicked into my profile and I was reminded of the failures of my past self. That I’ll never be as good a programmer as I want to be. That this imposter syndrome I feel is so much the result of starting young on Stack Overflow. Of other programming telling me very directly that I don’t know what I’m doing.

I spent easily 10 minutes determined to find the “delete account” button on my own. I clicked it, I said I was sure, and for a few minutes, that was that. My posts stay up anonymously, my account still exists on the rest of the network. I undo it, because why waste the opportunity to finally write down how I’ve felt using Stack Overflow over the last six years of my life. More so I looked back at the question I’d asked, and those I’d answered like them.

I’ve talked with friends, I’ve been on this network for some time, and I hate to know that so much as one person has suffered even close to the experience I did on Stack Overflow. I’ve had friends quit programming forever, I’ve seen accounts never post again, and I was almost there.

The argument that Stack Overflow and the larger programming community weren’t prepared for the influx of young and inexperienced programmers is an invalid opposition as well as a gross understatement. It feels great today to be in college, to be enjoying CSE with teachers and students who get the limited scope of understanding, and it feels great to be able to help these people now who need what I needed before.

This community needs to feel accountable. More than that, this community needs to realize that so much of their new audience will become the future of this field. Stack Overflow and the programming community are letting us all down. They let me down. There are already at least a decades worth of new and young programmers who never got what they needed here. I’m one of them, and for as close as I came to giving it up I’m one of the more fortunate here. All of us have fallen a great deal short of the mission and mindset that pretend to support the core values of this network. Along with this, there seems to be a massive disconnect between the network and its community.

I don't have a solution. But I hope someone at Stack Exchange will at least take the time to consider that more needs to be done.

EDIT (per Jeanne Dark's suggestion to elaborate on possible improvements):

I guess I’d expected Stack Overflow would be more helpful. Like (I’m paraphrasing) Magisch said the community is resistant to beginners at best, and downright unsuitable for anyone who doesn’t already have the skill, at its worst. That, back to the naivete of a young programmer, I could ask any questions I had about programming and someone would hand me the solution.

Obviously I understand at this point that things are not so. But things could be so much better than they are for the next generation of even younger programmers who will inevitably come to Stack Overflow looking for answers. The Code of Conduct, in some sense, addresses this problem. New posters are even marked to make other users aware that they should go easy. But this is far from enough.

Frankly, I understand why everything is setup how it is for sheer volume of input on the network, but I also think it would be much better if the rules held the reigns a little looser, even on veteran users. There are too many people turning away from this field because it’s so hard to get into programming, and the way Stack Overflow has chosen to handle them only makes the slope steeper.

Recent corporate changes from Stack Exchange as a whole as well as moderator cuts are resignations are, to my understanding, just making these sort of problems worse. I’m aware, too, that work has been done, as I explained above in this edit, to help new users out.

With only one post ever marked as a duplicate, no awareness of the flagging system and having completely ignored to read the Terms of Service at, need I remind you, 12 years old I was not aware of better options than to just quit while I was behind.

To be clear I’m not trying to target the network or its programming. While more work can certainly be done to ease people into using Stack Overflow correctly, a greater portion of the issue remains in the users who continually get away with this kind of thing. I’d love to see some intelligent AI scrubbing posts but I hardly expect that. What I think would be easy to implement and beneficial to the wider contributing community would be well-advertised and public, possibly across the network, reeducation on decency and understanding that the community these people are part of has changed. That you shouldn’t go in guns blazing to flag, downvote and mark up every post that doesn’t fit into the perfect criteria. Because the tiny “new poster” under my name isn’t cutting it, and it ceases to apply even if I never improve the quality of my questions. Once again I understand that there are standards in place and, to an extent, they are justified, but the community and the developers may need to reconsider both the rules and the repercussions to new askers and abusive community members alike.

EDIT 2 (final remarks, if you will have them):

I don't find that, due mostly to offered solutions, this post is a duplicate to the one it's been linked to.

Clearly this is going nowhere. So in a note of finality for myself I'll explain further: The big issue wasn't that I was poorly received, my age hardly matters in all this unless your picking it out specifically to criticize. The issue is that the community members that did respond, for the most part, had no intention to seek clarity, or to try and help. Duplicates didn't help (there was only one), flagging is ineffective and at the time I wasn't aware, and a lot of the community seems less eager to help their fellow programmer and more so to chase points at the end of the day.

I wasn't helped and, yeah it was in a big part "my fault". But that doesn't excuse how Stack Overflow and the community, in witness to negative behavior, have allowed it to pass. No one tried to clarify my questions. I know there are some great people on this platform, who I'm sure could have helped better, but they are far outnumbered by those who will dismiss any question that won't earn them the points they want in a timely manner. That I suppose, finally, is Stack Overflow's biggest problem I can pinpoint. Too many users are over-interested in helping themselves, even if it makes the experience worse for others.

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    Thanks for the contribution. I will surely answer. Just a quick remark now: asking for downvotes in the first sentence is not a good idea. The crowd here is usually only too happy to oblige. On the other hand be aware that votes on meta is often not a judgement on quality, but just agreement or disagreement in the discussion. Commented Oct 1, 2019 at 7:06
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    I started programming on stack overflow too. When I first made this account, I had no idea of anything, and I was just starting an apprenticeship as software developer. Throughout my time here, while SO has been an invaluable resource, I became increasingly convinced of what it was not: A site for beginners. It feels like this site is fundamentally unsuitable for anyone who doesn't have significant prior experience and knowledge about programming. And the community itself severely resists attempts to change that.
    – Magisch
    Commented Oct 1, 2019 at 7:10
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    "so mark it as a duplicate and downvote my "question" if you want." Starting a question like that is not very constructive, but I'm happy to oblige.
    – Cerbrus
    Commented Oct 1, 2019 at 7:14
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    Also related, you need to be 13 years of age before you're allowed to participate in the SE network (source)
    – Cerbrus
    Commented Oct 1, 2019 at 7:16
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    "The post is marked as a duplicate by six users and downvoted 5 times. No one offers me help" - Did the duplicates not help? If not, did you edit your question to explain why the duplicates didn't help? StackOverflow isn't really there to guide you on your first steps. It sounds a bit like you tried to learn to swim by jumping in the deep end and asking the experienced swimmers to teach you. There are better routes to learn than trying via StackOverflow
    – Draken
    Commented Oct 1, 2019 at 7:19
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    "To spend four days figuring out whatever little problem I had, making thousands of Google searches" ... good for you, that is a giant leap towards professionalism. Keep doing it and those four days will turn into four minutes eventually. And I mean that sincerely. Meanwhile, Stack Overflow will never fail those who are willing to search and do their due diligence.
    – Gimby
    Commented Oct 1, 2019 at 7:42
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    It's a common misconception that SO doesn't enjoy noob questions. New users just happen to confuse lack of experience and lack of effort. You can ask the dumbest question in the universe, but still garner upvotes and answers - if, and only if, you make up for it with detail and attention to presentation.
    – mario
    Commented Oct 1, 2019 at 8:16
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    That's all great and everything, I bet 80% of network's first questions was badly received ... you just delete them, earn badge and move on, next question you ask will be better, then next even better ... and that's end of the whole story. Getting a bit tired of all this crap going around, omg my question got down voted, everyone hates me, SO ain't welcoming ... as on your profile says, you got 5 questions (three of them got positive vote, two got no upvotes nor downvotes) ... which is great, you thought yourself how to ask a question, welcome to community ...
    – Veljko89
    Commented Oct 1, 2019 at 8:20
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    Maybe you could explain why, without a teacher's salary or prof tenure, skilled and experienced developers should wast...discar...flus......donate their free time to explaining, over, and over, and over, and over again, that array indexing out-of-bounds is undefined behaviour and that you cannot call a method on a null object reference? Commented Oct 1, 2019 at 8:20
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    I'm sorry, but a large set of new users are interested only in getting immediate answers without effort, in an attempt to leech/vampire their way into a course pass or complete paid work:( Commented Oct 1, 2019 at 8:27
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    Nobody's mentioned this bit yet, so - "All of them have reputations ranging from 1000 to over 150,000. They earning more for acting this way." No they don't. Rep is earned by posting and answering questions. You don't gain rep for refusing to answer a question, though I accept you may lose rep if you answer that question and people downvote you for answering a low-quality question. It happens.
    – F1Krazy
    Commented Oct 1, 2019 at 8:38
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    'No one offers me help, and no one asks for a better example [...]' - Folk here shouldn't have to ask for that stuff, it's common courtesy to provide all the information if you want an answer to something. Again, I'm utterly baffled at the sheer arrogance shown here in several of your statements: 'Had Stack Overflow only shown me the answer I needed I never would have posted.' or 'I didn’t read the rules, I didn’t include a minimal, reproducible example, and it wasn’t very well put either.' - We are not obliged to give you answers. Period.
    – Script47
    Commented Oct 1, 2019 at 8:51
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    "I didn’t read the rules, I didn’t include a minimal, reproducible example, and it wasn’t very well put either. Mind I was TWELVE YEARS OLD."; What does your age really have to do with any of the things you didn't do? You being 12 at the time does not magically give every contributor here the ability to read your mind or answer questions which do not have enough information to answer, and it doesn't exempt you from the rules just because you didn't read them. Commented Oct 1, 2019 at 13:04
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    My experience was very similar to yours. I didn't read the rules, I didn't put my question together very well. It was poorly received, and maybe I lashed out for a bit out of frustration but, looking back now; I realize the problem was with myself and people here were actually trying to help me. I didn't do my part, and they definitely let me know that, and I grew as a contributor and a programmer. It's easy to shift blame, not so easy to look back on what you did wrong. Consider contributors answering the same questions over and over again, it's just not sustainable. Quality is important. Commented Oct 1, 2019 at 13:15
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    Your edit kind of misses the point of what Stack Overflow is trying to do. No one is obligated to help; we're all volunteers here, and the expectation that you are entitled to support is wrong. Mischaracterizing that lack of help as just people who are chasing points is trying to argue a point that nobody is making.
    – fbueckert
    Commented Oct 1, 2019 at 16:39

3 Answers 3

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"Had Stack Overflow only shown me the answer I needed I never would have posted. I didn’t read the rules, I didn’t include a minimal, reproducible example, and it wasn’t very well put either. Mind I was TWELVE YEARS OLD."

This is the crux of the problem.

You must be 13 to participate on the Stack Exchange network.

This is outlined in the Terms of Service, under the section titled "Access to the Service," which says:

Subscriber certifies to Stack Exchange that Subscriber is an individual (i.e., not a corporate entity) at least 13 years of age. No one under the age of 13 may provide any personal information to or on Stack Exchange (including, for example, a name, address, telephone number or email address).

(source)

Bluntly put, it's not our problem that you didn't read the rules and had a bad experience as a result.

You make a couple of claims that you weren't helped. Did none of the duplicate targets answer your problem? (Even in hindsight?) I find that very unlikely.

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    As much as you're correct, I think there's "worse" than the OP's age here, when it comes to "issues" with the assumptions made in this question.
    – Patrice
    Commented Oct 1, 2019 at 15:46
  • @cerbus, late response, I know, don't even bother to respond if you don't want to, I just want to emphasize the point that being older than 12 hasn't made it much easier, the age is not the issue, the amount of experience is. I'd bet there are plenty of 20 year olds that are having similar trouble. Commented Jun 10, 2021 at 16:04
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Again thanks for that contribution. I think it is very interesting because it describes the perspective of someone for whom SO didn't work in a concise and clear manner.

The core of the problem seems to be that SO doesn't work well for learning how to program. It's good for improving skills though and since you are in College now, you may find yourself even coming back to SO in the future. Who knows.

But the amount of teaching that would be necessary to set anyone up from the very beginning especially if he is so young is just not possible to be done by the volunteers here. At least not for free. The experts we have are 100% busy answering the questions they actually understand and improving the existing content. Some may have spare capacities but surely not enough for 1 to 1 teaching of everyone.

The expectation is unfortunately different and it should be much more clearly communicated (especially by the company that runs the platform). Otherwise we really fail our users.

I learnt programming from books because the Internet wasn't that much developed when I was a teenager and that seemed like the only possibility. Thankfully books don't downvote. So I had a programming learning experience free from any social interaction. I guess it was a good thing after all.

Later I came to SO and with a bit of stubbornness, i.e. never really excluding that it could be the others that are wrong, it worked for me.

The votes are just thought as a quality measure and in principle nobody should really fear asking a question as long as it meets some relatively low standards, basically it just must be answerable here. And one should not forget that votes can also be wrong, with humans involved that is bound to happen sometimes.

Coming back to the core problem. SO is not for absolute beginners and beginners should actively stay away or seek other resources, that are better suited their needs. Maybe learning a topic from the start by some sort of Q&A could work somehow, but not in the current form here and maybe not for free. It's also the responsibility of the community to make that point because we see it failing every day.

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We focus on content, not the user, when we moderate here. That being said, the age of the poster doesn't really matter (and we usually don't know it anyway).

If someone left a specific comment that you think was condescending or rude, feel free to flag it as "Unfriendly or Unkind." Otherwise, you really can't complain about people downvoting and closing a post that, by your own admission, didn't meet site quality standards.

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