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I spend some free time in the Triage queue and sometimes find some questions that already have two or more answers. At times, I find questions to be of low quality, as one would expect in the triage queue. Sometimes they don't include the attempts of the author, sometimes important details that I would expect are left out, etc. etc.

Maybe my standards for questions are too high, since a number of people seem to understand the author's needs and provide seemingly valid solutions that often have received upvotes or have even been accepted by the question's author.

If the question appeared in some other queue I would just flag them as needing debugging details or whatever other reason I would see fit. However, in those cases I'm not sure of that, since other people did understand the problem, and they didn't require debugging details. Also, the description "This question cannot be answered" below the "Flag" option in the triage queue view makes me feel uneasy - clearly they can be answered, they just were.

What is the appropriate course of action here?

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    Are those usually questions where you have enough domain knowledge to state which debugging details exactly you are missing? Or are they rather about areas where you expect that some data is missing, but can't say for sure?
    – BDL
    Commented Nov 27, 2023 at 14:53
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    Both. My core field of expertise is Java and Web-Development, and questions missing any sort of stacktrace but ask about "What is wrong here?" are 99% needing debugging details. Considering questions that ask about a potential misfunction of an api, I would expect a MRE, which in these cases clearly is not there. When the question is outside of my field of expertise I am much more careful and often skip those kinds of questions.
    – monamona
    Commented Nov 27, 2023 at 14:55
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    From my experience there are questions that do lack the necessary details, etc. but are often answered because the goal / issue of the asker can be figured out with an "educated guess". Commented Nov 27, 2023 at 15:03
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    IMHO this doesn't improve the quality of the question though... I guess I'm implicitly asking, if answered questions should be treated differently than non-answered questions.
    – monamona
    Commented Nov 27, 2023 at 15:05
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    @monamona In my opinion no, if the asker and answerer really feel the question is useful they'd add the necessary details in. Most of the questions I see of this kind are either really specific to the askers code or are basically duplicates once you know what the asker is really asking. Commented Nov 27, 2023 at 15:09
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    Just to note: if someone posts a question about how to bake a ginger cake which actually has nutritional value and won't spike your blood sugar as much, I have a really good answer. But the question should be nuked anyway :) The fact that something is answerable is only a foot in the door, it isn't even a good start yet.
    – Gimby
    Commented Nov 28, 2023 at 8:58
  • "How do I write a good answer? Answer well-asked questions." if the questtion is in triage because of "low quality", even if somebody else was able to really understand the question and answer it, shouldn't be considered "good" just because of that
    – GrafiCode
    Commented Nov 28, 2023 at 11:49
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    From my experience, if a single question rapidly gets multiple answers, odds that it cannot reliably be answered and lacks details are higher. If a question lacks details, I often see multiple "best guess" answers that do not solve the same issue
    – Erik A
    Commented Nov 28, 2023 at 19:39
  • @monamona Your "Both." comment is what I was going to say (i.e. one should tread lightly--when in doubt: skip). I've seen questions closed [from the queue] by folks who are not subject matter experts. That is, (e.g.) it's a C question being closed by a [e.g.] python programmer. The question is perfectly answerable as is, has an answer (sometimes mine and sometimes upvoted/accepted) and the question gets closed days later. Commented Nov 29, 2023 at 3:27
  • Personally, I wish SO allowed us to critique the question, do our best to help the user by answering it, and then flag it as being not worth retaining in the permanent record. In practice we often try to do that through comments, but I really think we should be gentler with newbie users who are still learning, not just about the technology, but about how to put their thoughts into shape. Commented Nov 29, 2023 at 22:56

3 Answers 3

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No.

Triage is about judging the quality of the question in isolation. Just because it has answers, or those answers are upvoted, doesn't somehow magically make the question suitable for SO; most of the time it just means the site would be better off without the people farming rep by posting those "answers" (deliberately quoted because said answers are often worse drivel than the question).

If rubbish it is, close it you must.

Just did a Triage run, and it reminded me exactly why I no longer actively curate via the queues - because it quite literally depresses me. Of the 40 questions I was asked to review, 37 or 92.5% were pure unadulterated trash that I close-flagged. Quora has better-quality questions nowadays.

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    Whenever I do Triage runs I have to watch out to not be complained at for posting too many cv-pls requests at once.
    – CPlus
    Commented Nov 27, 2023 at 22:52
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    To be fair, I feel the same when I look at my frontpage listing, or a specific tag. The review queues are not uniquely depressing :)
    – Gimby
    Commented Nov 28, 2023 at 8:25
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    It's easy to forget that almost everyone starts with rubbish questions, and answers. This is nothing new. Commented Nov 28, 2023 at 16:58
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    What's also depressing is that sometimes I close-flag questions in the queue, but then later learn that people Looks OK voted them even if they are objectively off-topic.
    – CPlus
    Commented Nov 29, 2023 at 0:43
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    Please don't insult those of us who are trying to help newbie users who have trouble formulating clear questions by suggesting that we are doing it to earn reputation. Some of us don't care a damn about reputation, nor greatly about SO policies, we just want to help people who come here with a problem. And do take into account that (in my case) I've seen so many newbie XSLT questions that I can often guess what they are asking even if they have trouble articulating it. My aim is to help them up the learning curve, not to send them away frustrated. Commented Nov 29, 2023 at 22:46
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    @MichaelKay Thank you for bringing down the overall quality of the site by rewarding bad questions with answers, ensuring that the users who ask those questions have zero incentive to write good questions, thus setting them up for future failure. It's almost like the people who came up with the quality guidelines thought about this more than you evidently have.
    – Ian Kemp
    Commented Nov 30, 2023 at 9:15
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    @MichaelKay the site is full of people who are clearly attempting to read OP's mind and answer based on a guess, as well as people who repeatedly answer questions that are obviously common dupes. This answer doesn't seem targeted at people who post in the answer section to seek to improve the question rather than posting an answer. However, doing so is still against policy, and interferes with the core workings of the site. Please stick to comments for feedback on posting the question, and use the answer section only for actual answers. Commented Nov 30, 2023 at 11:26
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    @IanKemp with respect, I think a more moderate tone would be more effective here. (And I don't exactly have a reputation for moderate tone on Meta, AFAICT...) Commented Nov 30, 2023 at 11:27
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    @MichaelKay "The whole point of the site is to help people who need help" - with respect, no; that fundamentally misunderstands the purpose of the site, as described by a very strong consensus on Meta that has been established through years of discussion. The purpose is to build a searchable reference library, not to operate a help desk or a discussion forum. If you want those things, you can find them almost anywhere else on the Internet. Commented Nov 30, 2023 at 11:57
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    The creators of Stack Overflow explicitly said that part of the motivation for the new idea was to avoid the frustration of using a search engine and stumbling upon some ancient forum discussion that either led nowhere, was full of people trying to get the OP to explain things, might not have been about a relevant topic, might have ended with OP saying "never mind I fixed it", etc. and having it take a long time to read through the thread only to find that it isn't useful. The goal on Stack Overflow is that you get answers, without chit-chat. Please also see the tour. Commented Nov 30, 2023 at 11:59
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    @MichaelKay No, that's not the whole point of the site. It states this in the Code of Conduct: Our mission is to build libraries of high-quality questions and answers. Indulging people who aren't asking high-quality questions is directly contradictory to that mission statement. The site exists to answer questions, not to teach people how to ask them.
    – Ian Kemp
    Commented Nov 30, 2023 at 12:03
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    @MichaelKay No. Building a library of high quality questions and answers is the end goal of this site, because it is intended to help people in future who have the same question. Your belief or desire does not change that. You are part of the problem, and until or unless you accept that we cannot have constructive dialogue.
    – Ian Kemp
    Commented Nov 30, 2023 at 12:23
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    @MichaelKay the library is meant to be the thing that helps people. A library which is easily searchable helps many more people than answering one unclear / bad question would. Questions that are unclear / not reproducible actively reduce the quality of the library. Closing a question is not the end for the asker either they can still improve their question and get it reopened Commented Nov 30, 2023 at 12:24
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    @MichaelKay Response to your first comment: the solution for you is to write a canonical, by using the patterns you have seen, and then close all incoming questions (that qualify), as duplicates of this canonical. Commented Nov 30, 2023 at 13:16
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    I fell into the same trap about XPath 10 years ago (deleted Q). It was closed as a duplicate question that I would have had no way to get to with the search keywords I was using. Maybe the signposts have improved a bit since then, but anyway, it would not necessarily make things better to cater to my question and leave it open, as the linked question effectively answered my own. Regardless of whether we can stop people from asking questions (surely we can't), that is not an excuse not to close question as suitable duplicates.
    – E_net4
    Commented Nov 30, 2023 at 14:54
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Sometimes they don't include the attempts of the author, sometimes important details that I would expect are left out, etc. etc.

Explicitly showing attempts is usually not necessary and often inappropriate. What we want to see is a question that has been informed by those attempts:

  • Someone who was trying to solve a problem that straightforwardly involves following multiple steps, should generally have already figured out what those steps are by trying, and then figured out a specific part to ask about; or else might ask if there is some more "direct", built-in way to do something (with a precise specification), only after doing the straightforward analysis

  • Someone whose code does not work should have already figured out where the issue appears to be by following standard debugging steps and attempting to produce a minimal reproducible example.

Maybe my standards for questions are too high

Unlikely, honestly. As a rule of thumb, you should feel comfortable with the idea that some day in the future, some other question gets closed as a duplicate of this one. (At least as long as it receives whatever editing it might need that can be done by others.)

since a number of people seem to understand the authors needs and provide seemingly valid solutions that often have received upvotes or ave even been accepted by the question's author.

So what? It would be perfectly possible to say all of those things about a blatantly off-topic question, for example. Stack Overflow is full of people who don't properly understand the site's goals, and will upvote content that is completely misaligned with the site's purpose. And of course, simply asking something understandable is nowhere near sufficient. Oh, and I have seen OPs accept ridiculous, completely irrelevant, likely AI-generated garbage, just because they're happy to have received an answer.

However in those cases I'm not sure of that, since other people did understand the problem, and they didn't require debugging details.

Just because someone was able to figure something out on the information given, doesn't mean the question shouldn't have specified. It could have been a wild guess. Alternately, it could be a sign that the question relates to a problem so common that it can be identified from a few telltale signs without going through proper debugging - this is a sign the question may be a common duplicate. People improperly answer questions they know are duplicates, all the time (the reputation system rewards them for it).

Also, the description "This question cannot be answered" below the "Flag" option in the triage queue view makes me feel uneasy

"Cannot" in the sense of "it would be counter to site policy to do so". The point is supposed to be "other users can't fix the problem by editing; the question needs to be closed now".

That's why it takes you to the normal flagging interface, which offers you all the normal closure reasons. Clearly it's possible to answer a question that is a duplicate. You should still flag such questions, and in the Triage queue you should still use the interface to get at this option.

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    So in total: still flag them as "Needs debugging details" or for any other reason I would see fit, ignoring the answers already given?
    – monamona
    Commented Nov 27, 2023 at 16:08
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    Yes, exactly. In fact, if you are just looking at questions normally, do the same. Commented Nov 27, 2023 at 17:36
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    As a rule of thumb, you should feel comfortable with the idea that some day in the future, some other question gets closed as a duplicate of this one. -- Highlight of the answer. Commented Nov 29, 2023 at 5:48
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So let's consider an example: the user who says (say) "I want to append to the end of a file. I tried everything and it didn't work."

My approach (after loooking for a duplicate that is sufficiently close it will actually help them) would be (a) to make sure they know what API they should be using, (b) to remind them of some possible pitfalls, like failing to close the file after doing the append, and (c) to give them some advice about asking questions: like suggesting they should tell us in precise terms one thing that they tried and exactly how it failed.

I'd be very happy if there was an option I could tick that said "this answer is unlikely to be a useful part of the long-term record". But I'm not happy sending the user away empty-handed.

Remember that one reason users ask poor questions is fear of rejection, and you don't want to reinforce that. I'm pretty sure that the main reason people don't include their coding attempts is that they fear experts will tear it to shreds. Closing questions prematurely encourages that fear.

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    Oof... I am torn. On the one hand, we all started out some day, so I feel compassion. On the other hand - if all the user wrote was "I want to append to the end of a file. I tried everything and it didn't work." my COMMENT would be "Please post the code you tried so we can help you diagnose the problem", and flag the question as "needs debugging details". Because EVERYTHING might be "open notepad, type append "hello world" to file" (end of EVERYTHING) and then write a question on StackOverflow because nodepad didn't work... I want to help people - and not reward stupid and lazy
    – CharonX
    Commented Nov 30, 2023 at 13:15
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    I'm not torn. "I tried everything and it didn't work" shouldn't even make it to a review queue. That's the sort of stuff that an AI can filter out today. We don't tear people to shreds for bad code, we do for unnecessarily wasting our time. Putting this sort of zero-effort questions in a review queue is also wasting our time, and that's on StackOverflow.
    – MSalters
    Commented Nov 30, 2023 at 14:34
  • "I want to append to the end of a file" that should be your cue to simply close it as a duplicate (Surely this questions been asked before). If they give a specific thing they tried which didn't work then maybe their question can be answered. Commented Nov 30, 2023 at 16:16
  • @AbdulAzizBarkat not necessarily - they might try to do it in INTERCAL... or possibly Malbolge. But yeah, unless the "append to file" is something highly exotic either in language or interface, it likely was asked and answered before and the question can be closed as a duplicated of something.
    – CharonX
    Commented Dec 1, 2023 at 8:52

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