24

The "how to ask a good question here" link goes to the Stack Overflow page for this.

Virtually every time I ask a question here, I get lots of downvotes and negative feedback. I don't even know why I come back. I guess I'm a glutton for punishment. (Yeah, yeah... I know... the downvotes don't mean anything here. Bologna. If that were the case, then get rid of them, right?).

So how do I ask a good question here?

10
  • 26
    "downvotes don't mean anything here. If that were the case, then get rid of them, right?" – but they do mean something here, too, they just don't always have the same meaning as on the main site.
    – cafce25
    Commented Nov 2, 2023 at 6:29
  • 1
    It depends a bit on how you define "good question"? A useful question doesn't have to have a positive score because of the way voting is practiced (originally voting was only supposed to be different on feature requests, not on discussions, but people never followed that). A useful (good) question is probably taking up a new aspect and portray it thoroughly yet succinctly from all sides, then asks for advice. A bit like this question, although I would have liked a bit more research. Are you sure, you are the first one to ask that? Commented Nov 2, 2023 at 7:28
  • 5
    "Yeah, yeah... I know... the downvotes don't mean anything here. Bologna. If that were the case, then get rid of them, right?" - I'd be all for changing the voting system on meta actually. Not going to happen since meta runs on the same software as the main Q&A sites. There are several things which would greatly benefit meta specifically since it is more aimed at discussion. Nested comments for example. But ain't gonna happen. We kind of have to live with the inefficiency.
    – Gimby
    Commented Nov 2, 2023 at 9:58
  • 3
  • 12
    The root of the problems with meta is that the Q&A format is pretty horrible for discussions, opinions, arguments, establishing consensus. At an utter minimum, threaded comments are needed. And some sensible moderators who understand that comments on meta ought to have an entirely different value and status than they have on the main Q&A. It isn't helpful to have some moderator stomp in and migrate everything to chat: "No discussion under the discussion tag! None, you hear! If you have anything to say, go have a monologue in an answer."
    – Lundin
    Commented Nov 3, 2023 at 7:33
  • 1
    My personal way to judge meta posts is in how people interact with it. If there is a lot of interest and especially if there are good answers, it's a good meta post. Even outlandish meta posts which propose things that just won't ever work can be useful, there is value in knowing what not to do and especially why.
    – Gimby
    Commented Nov 3, 2023 at 9:14
  • 4
    "Virtually every time I ask a question here, I get lots of downvotes and negative feedback." Do you have some examples of these downvoted questions which I presume must be deleted? Your profile only shows 9 questions asked, and 7 of those 9 are positively scored. So I am not sure at this point what you mean by 'virtually every time'.
    – TylerH
    Commented Nov 3, 2023 at 14:03
  • Perhaps the contents of this page can be used on the meta S.O. site: stackoverflow.com/help/whats-meta Commented Nov 3, 2023 at 16:20
  • @cafce25 Your comment "but they do mean something here..." got quite a lot of upvotes. I would love to address this so I will create another question on this site to do so and link it in the next comment I make.
    – BVernon
    Commented Nov 5, 2023 at 5:23
  • 1
    @cafce25 meta.stackoverflow.com/questions/427074/…
    – BVernon
    Commented Nov 5, 2023 at 5:56

2 Answers 2

24

Participating on Meta works fundamentally the same way across every Stack Exchange site's Meta. The reference is therefore on meta.stackexchange.com:

How do I participate in Meta and not die trying?

Although it is not quite the same topic IMO, you may also find Can we talk about the voting culture here on Meta? helpful.

3
  • On all SE sites in which I've participated, when an answer responds to something different than what the OP asked others will quickly point it out. Here, my question wasn't about "not dying trying". Neither was I addressing the culture. Now, if you had made a comment to the effect that written guidelines might adversely affect the desired culture on this site, then that would have absolutely been on topic. So I just have to ask what question are you trying answering here? Because it just seems like you're stereotyping, no?
    – BVernon
    Commented Nov 5, 2023 at 6:10
  • I don't understand the objection. In the question here, you complain that "Virtually every time I ask a question here, I get lots of downvotes and negative feedback.". That is exactly what the "not die trying" phrasing is about. As for the voting culture question, there is useful information there for you because it is about why certain things get downvoted on Meta. The question I am trying to answer is your question, and I am not stereotyping in the slightest - I am responding to what you said, according to my understanding of what is written at the linked questions. Commented Nov 7, 2023 at 18:15
  • I apologize and understand your frustration. I've experimented with different ways to formulate a post and, well, basically no matter how I do it there is no silver bullet that always gets the idea across to everyone. In this case, the question is in the title and the body is context. If I don't provide context, then people complain. If I do provide context, then people formulate questions based on that which aren't quite what I asked. There is a guide for other sites; there isn't one for this site. I get that you're saying that largely subjective post is the closest thing to a guide though.
    – BVernon
    Commented Nov 9, 2023 at 3:24
11

Perhaps the most useful guide for you is the What do votes mean on Meta? Why was my well-written post downvoted? answer on the How does Meta Stack Overflow work? FAQ post:

[...]

Unlike the normal Stack Overflow site, Meta Stack Overflow invites the community to discuss, debate and propose changes to the way the community itself behaves, as well as how the software itself works.

On posts tagged , voting indicates agreement or disagreement with the proposed change in addition to usual reasons based on the quality or usefulness of the post itself. Also, on posts, votes may be used to indicate agreement/disagreement with the author's standpoint.

To promote free discussion, votes have no effect on your reputation. Instead, your reputation is copied from the main site, once every hour. You can still earn badges here, separate from the main site, however.

If your post on Meta is being downvoted, it is just as likely that people voting down simply disagree with your premise/argument/concern.

Follow that up with the Should I do anything before posting on Meta? answer on the same FAQ collection:

Search first

Before you post, please use the search function. It's extremely likely that what you are going to ask has been asked/discussed many times before. It's probably a good idea to search Meta Stack Exchange as well -- it contains lots of relevant material.

Don't complain if you're treated a bit rough for posting a duplicate question

You were told to search first, weren't you?

Bring your sense of humor

Meta Stack Overflow can seem to be harsh at first, but it's actually far from it. Just be polite and don't act in a trollish manner. Everyone here is here to help you.

12
  • Interestingly, your "How does Meta..." link highlights a user experience that directly contradicts the idea @Karl Knechtel proposed that this site works fundamentally the same as all other SE sites.
    – BVernon
    Commented Nov 5, 2023 at 6:16
  • Search first... what about when you did search first but your question was actually very different; yet closed anyway simply because it "sounded" similar to another question?
    – BVernon
    Commented Nov 5, 2023 at 6:25
  • 1
    @BVernon Karl's post says this site works the same as all other network meta sites. Big difference from 'all other network sites'.
    – TylerH
    Commented Nov 6, 2023 at 15:28
  • As for when you searched and believe your post is different, you can edit your post to clarify at the top or bottom how it is not a duplicate/not the same question as the one used as the duplicate target and attempt to get it reopened. Failing that, you can ask about the specific question here on Meta and a broader community will weigh in on how and why it is or is not a duplicate.
    – TylerH
    Commented Nov 6, 2023 at 15:30
  • So then the answer to my question is that the "most official" guides to how to ask a question on Meta are based on subjective posts. There are no, actual "official" guides as there are on regular SE sites. Is that correct?
    – BVernon
    Commented Nov 9, 2023 at 21:10
  • To be clear, no animosity intended by my comment above. Just getting to the point.
    – BVernon
    Commented Nov 9, 2023 at 21:11
  • @BVernon Mostly correct; there's no Meta-specific help center. However, there are FAQ posts and other posts here on Meta that are made by community members, that are tantamount to a "help center" in that they are discussed, reviewed, and revised by the community and elected moderators, and have remained applicable for a decade or so in many cases. If you see answers on how to do something/how to behave that have overwhelmingly positive scores (e.g. +40 or +100) it is generally accepted practice here to consider that the "current Meta guidance" on the subject.
    – TylerH
    Commented Nov 9, 2023 at 21:22
  • There are of course exceptions, and nuances, but it's hard to cover those in detail, especially in a comment section. Those exceptions and nuances, are best discussed in the moment on a specific thread.
    – TylerH
    Commented Nov 9, 2023 at 21:24
  • I think, ultimately, the effect of this is that the rules are subjective and can change over time based on who is most involved. And it's a bit of a clique. So it's not a great place for an outsider who just wants to read a concrete-ish (at least as concrete as any other site) set of rules. It's sort of a place for people who have too much time on their hands, I guess.
    – BVernon
    Commented Nov 14, 2023 at 0:47
  • @BVernon You've just described every organization/group of people that has ever existed, literally.
    – TylerH
    Commented Nov 14, 2023 at 15:24
  • Not at all. And it is what it is so there's no need for you to be defensive about it. I don't prefer it; you do. Fine. But there is a much more concrete, documented set of rules for StackOverflow and other non meta sites. Granted, they are still somewhat subjective and subject to change, but on a far, FAR lesser scale. They are intended to be as objective as possible rather than "whatever the current group of most active users feels like at the moment".
    – BVernon
    Commented Nov 14, 2023 at 19:53
  • 1
    Defensive? I'm just answering a question you asked.
    – TylerH
    Commented Nov 14, 2023 at 20:17

You must log in to answer this question.

Not the answer you're looking for? Browse other questions tagged .