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An edit was made to a question of mine, which I am slightly unhappy about.

Before I go revert parts or all of the edit, I would appreciate some second opinions.

Yes, I was perhaps a bit more verbose than strictly necessary, but:

  1. I do not think that absolute maximum terseness is the prime directive here, and

  2. I think some of the text removed was necessary for the remaining text to make sense.

Specifically, I think that the paragraph which now reads in its entirety

Then the i! would be avoided.

does not make sense. The original was

Note that if it could be made more terse, then it would also be made more neat, because that ugly i! could be avoided.

Opinions, anyone?

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    Removal of noise is a common practice like I just did to this question (which was, in truth, before I read the linked question to see what the changes were). Improvement of grammar and spelling is rarely anything other than a "good" thing as well as it makes the question more readable for everyone.
    – Thom A
    Commented Mar 29, 2023 at 13:25
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    What was edited out, was emotion, commentary, not relevant to the reader or necessary for answering. Removing this improves readability.
    – CodeCaster
    Commented Mar 29, 2023 at 13:27
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    If an important detail was removed by accident, you can add it. But don't add the whole noise back into the question.
    – Dharman Mod
    Commented Mar 29, 2023 at 14:25
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    I do not think that absolute maximum terseness is the prime directive here no, but neither is maximum verbosity, so there’s a balance to be struck. We’re encouraged to improve everything we possibly can in a post when making an edit, so it’s not uncommon to see chunks of text removed that aren’t causing a problem but also aren’t strictly necessary. Your question got a free makeover, look at it that way
    – Clive
    Commented Mar 29, 2023 at 14:58
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    @Tsyvarev I think that the paragraph which now reads in its entirety "Then the i! would be avoided." does not make sense. The original was "Note that if it could be made more terse, then it would also be made more neat, because that ugly i! could be avoided."
    – Mike Nakis
    Commented Mar 29, 2023 at 15:32
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    Why do you think it doesn’t make sense? It’s not really important that we take your opinion of that operator’s beauty (or otherwise) into account is it?
    – Clive
    Commented Mar 29, 2023 at 15:45
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    Well, I think that objectively expressed feelings about the code's view could be very well part of the question post. Especially when these feelings are part of the problem. However, the original "Note that if it ..." looks quite long. What about "I want to avoid that ugly i!."? (As for me, I find that i! funny, but I have no idea about its meaning).
    – Tsyvarev
    Commented Mar 29, 2023 at 16:31
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    @Tsyvarev thanks for the suggestion, I fixed that. By the way, the exclamation mark tells the C# compiler to go ahead and obtain the value of i despite the fact that i is nullable and yet it has not been checked against null in the current scope. (It has been checked in a previous scope, but the compiler cannot possibly know that.)
    – Mike Nakis
    Commented Mar 29, 2023 at 16:58
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    Oh, nice, now I seem to understand the very question on SO: it is about avoiding a hint to the compiler (via exclamation mark) when the hinted information is contained in the previous line (the Where clause). Well, this i! is not so "ugly" as goto in C, but the reason to avoid it is definitely objective. Most likely, that reason is well-known for everyone who programs in C#/LINQ more than a day, so epithets for i! are not so vital. But I think that single-word "ugly" won't harm the question post.
    – Tsyvarev
    Commented Mar 29, 2023 at 17:34
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    Meta talk is not the same as verboseness. E.g., a post can be verbose with zero (zilch) meta talk. Or be short and full of meta talk (e.g., "I get error X. Can anybody help me? I have been trying to fix this for weeks now and have searched the entire Internet. I also asked ChatGPT, but it will only tell me lies and make up stuff that doesn't exist."). Commented Mar 29, 2023 at 18:45
  • @philipxy: My phrase "I have no idea about its meaning" was about i! construction (and MikeNakes explained me that meaning). As for "ugly" word, I find its general sense being sufficient to describe some programming language constructions as unnatural and confusing. E.g. as I noted in the previous comment, a goto construction in C is ugly. (But sometimes using goto is a lesser evil than alternatives).
    – Tsyvarev
    Commented Mar 29, 2023 at 20:21
  • @Tsyvarev Thanks for the "meaning" clarification. But "ugly" adds nothing to the post.
    – philipxy
    Commented Mar 30, 2023 at 0:23
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    Ugliness or a beauty is a personal opinion. Personal opinions even when they're red herrings are self-sabotage because they cause people to fire from the hip and cast close votes. The removal of the red herring is a pretty big service towards you, I'm glad to see that the system can still work.
    – Gimby
    Commented Mar 30, 2023 at 8:41
  • "Note that if it could be made more terse, then it would also be made more neat, because that ugly i! could be avoided." I don't think this claim follows logically, even putting subjectivity aside. Why couldn't it be that there's a more terse version of the code, but the i! is still necessary? Commented Mar 30, 2023 at 12:08
  • (1) I feel the edit changed the framing of the question to an unnecessary extent (in particular in the i! paragraph mentioned here) without actually clarifying its main point. (2) The suggested duplicate target (a completely general feature request) isn't a good fit for a request for comment on a specific edit.
    – duplode
    Commented Mar 30, 2023 at 15:56

1 Answer 1

1

There are a few different issues in play here, and I don't think this is quite as clear-cut as some of the comments here suggest.

Streamlining posts by, for instance, removing initial paragraphs that don't address the matter at hand generally counts as useful copyediting. While personally, had I come across your question organically, I guess I wouldn't have found it enough of a problem to bother with editing just for that, I can see why the edit was made, and the motivation is broadly valid.

This general point aside, I think your objection #2 is justified. In your original text, the remarks about ì! conveyed that your wish to avoid it was motivated by code neatness. That is relevant context to answer authors when evaluating which alternatives would be more appropriate in a solution, and removing it does change the meaning of the post. On a related note, there were some suggestions in the comments here that the word "ugly" had to be removed because it was inherently subjective. That feels completely off-base to me: we aren't supposed to police post content to this level of granularity.

A subtler aspect of the edit is that, in your original text, the core question was not formulated in one single passage, but spread across several paragraphs. That being so, the streamlining done by the edit had the side effect of making the remaining text feel a little disjointed, by removing the (supposedly) inessential turns of phrase that arguably acted as glue. The compromise edit I did to your question attempted to deal with that by bringing the different parts of the question together in the second paragraph -- and I now see you have further improved on it today, by integrating the end note about the generality of the question to the main body of the text.

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