-3

I do disagree with this review being bad (after the edit): https://stackoverflow.com/review/reopen/29712905

It's very detailed, with all the steps, some screenshots and the latest comment goes into this direction too.


Also, I've seen this one: Add an "I don't understand" option for review audits
And I was wondering if I need to create a new post here each time I do disagree with an audit or if there is (or planned at least) something for when this happen.

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  • 3
    Acting on a post outside of the review queue is generally a good way to remove a post from the audit-pool. E.g. if you think the question is good enough and shouldn't have been deleted, vote to undelete. You have enough reputation to cast undelete votes.
    – yivi
    Sep 1, 2021 at 8:43
  • 1
    Out of curiosity, do you have enough experience in the question technology to judge if the question is really good enough to be undeleted and reopened? I find that's usually hard to cast reopen votes unless one is proficient enough in a question tech-stack.
    – yivi
    Sep 1, 2021 at 8:46
  • 3
    The question comes with a huge scroll bar and two nondescript image links. There's "detailed" and there's "info dump". Are you sure it's the first category? Sep 1, 2021 at 8:50
  • @yivi Yep, I can totally cast an undelete vote (just did), my concern is mainly me having to face a false-positive. On the experience level, I did some Java before but I'm not a cucumber expert. Still, the gap and the level of detail of this question is a huge step when comparing the initial question and seems totally fine. Of course, I can also filter with some tech that I am more proficient with (the reopen queue is plenty enough for this) but usually, I do not face any issues beyond me not paying attention enough/it being a false positive.
    – kissu
    Sep 1, 2021 at 8:51
  • 2
    The question reads more like a guide than anything else. It just finished off with "still face same error." but the error never actually appears in the question. It could really do with being made (by the OP) into an [mre]. (I have no expertise in the tags, so maybe it does need that much info?) Certainly putting the error in the question would be an infinite improvement though...
    – Thom A
    Sep 1, 2021 at 8:53
  • "Still, the gap and the level of detail of this question is a huge step when comparing the initial question". That's not enough to know if a question should be reopened. "Added more details" could mean "added irrelevant details and noise". It's better to only vote to reopen (or undelete) when once is certain that the post is good enough. An frankly, that requires subject matter expertise. One also needs to be very certain when voting to close or delete, but that, many times, requires no expertise on a subject.
    – yivi
    Sep 1, 2021 at 8:53
  • 1
    What I mean is that it's really not fair for you to say this audit is good or not, if you do not have the requisite knowledge to ascertain the quality of the question (e.g. by knowing if it can or it can't be answered).
    – yivi
    Sep 1, 2021 at 8:55
  • @MisterMiyagi the question is mainly a configuration issue. Non descriptive images are not that big of a deal here since the info is already available as text. I could totally edit those small quirks (and usually do) but since this one is deleted, I did not bother with it for bump reasons.
    – kissu
    Sep 1, 2021 at 8:59
  • @yivi I don't find it being noise so far. Also, if people waited to have a really good expertise in a specific domain before giving a good feedback, the traffic of reviewers would be far lower. I've already seen 1400 specific-tag reputation guys missing the point of a question. For me, it looks good enough for a 2nd chance especially when compared to all the reopen cast votes that I see daily (which are really meaningless changes, at best).
    – kissu
    Sep 1, 2021 at 9:01
  • 2
    That's not how reopening works. By saying it's "good enough", if you don't actually know if it's good enough, you are hampering the system, not helping. Obviously, for many types of feedback you need a subject matter expert. Otherwise, it's meaningless feedback. (I don't care about tag-score, since you bring that up; just that you personally can judge a question to be of good quality, beyond "feeling they deserve a second shot", which they can always take by posting a better question).
    – yivi
    Sep 1, 2021 at 9:02
  • @yivi alright, I guess I'll dodge java questions next time or simply eat the audit and go on. For the day that I do have another false positive in a field I am more proficient in, do I need to post another question here or do I have another way of disputing an audit?
    – kissu
    Sep 1, 2021 at 9:06
  • Again, acting on the post outside of the queue. Voting, generally. Since audits are selected automatically, feedback on the post makes it more/less likely they are picked up as audits. In any case, I find that if one filters by tag, it's very difficult to fail an audit.
    – yivi
    Sep 1, 2021 at 9:07
  • @kissu At least the second image does not match any code in the question. "enter image description here" really doesn't clear up whether it should or not. As for the "it's configuration" – the question only shows the base setup and a "you should do this and that" error. For such a long post, I would expect to see the "you should do this and that" code, not some base case from which we have to guess how they implemented the suggestion. TLDR: There are lots of gaps that one has to guess. Sep 1, 2021 at 9:12
  • @yivi this one does not remove the penalty of eating a warning tho. I am not clicking on "I understand" on the next false positive audit. Since it's automatic, there is a margin of error and a single upvote/undelete vote will probably not change it a lot (on top of being "too late"). I'm not saying that I do fail a lot, I am mainly committed to complete several queues per day every day and this can add up to a ban for a small period of time. Or is it computed as a ratio of passed/failed audits? If it's juste absolute amount of warnings, this is pretty limited for daily reviewers.
    – kissu
    Sep 1, 2021 at 9:13
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    The recommendation about "going slow" (sic.) on newcomers means "be mindful that the language and tone that use use to address new users is kind", does not mean "give new users a pass when it comes to question quality". Not even close. User reputation is irrelevant when judging if a post is good or not for the site. (We are diverting a lot from your original question, but maybe these misconceptions might be what drove you to fail the audit in the first place).
    – yivi
    Sep 1, 2021 at 9:23

1 Answer 1

5

The problem here is what I'd call a bug:

Questions that never completed a reopen review after editing should not be used as known-bad audits

This question's reopen review was invalidated with no reviews by the Roomba deleting the post on Aug 26 because it was closed and that was 10 days after the last edit. The only feedback the system had on the edited post was a single downvote on Aug 26. That's hardly enough evidence for a known-bad audit.

Known-bad audits should either use questions that were not edited after closing or received a full set of "Leave closed" reviews.

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  • Btw, how is the following case even handled: "2 close votes + major great update to a question + 3rd close vote"? Would be pretty bad to have it just closed without any attention to detail here. This is what it looks like here tbh (didn't took the time to see if it's feasable or not tbh).
    – kissu
    Sep 1, 2021 at 9:40
  • @kissu Looking at the post's timeline, it looks to me like the post was closed before any edits.
    – Ryan M Mod
    Sep 1, 2021 at 9:42
  • There's no way of knowing the detail of when a single close vote was casted tho. Or is there one? It being deleted after the edit is the issue in this specific question. My first comment here was mainly aimed towards other questions.
    – kissu
    Sep 1, 2021 at 9:48
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    @kissu That's correct, but the question was closed Aug 12 at 11:32 and the first edit was Aug 16 at 6:37, so all the close votes were necessarily cast before the edit. A third close vote cast after a question is fixed does happen, but it's hopefully uncommon: people should evaluate the question as-is and determine whether it still has issues. And as you note, it's a different problem than what happened here.
    – Ryan M Mod
    Sep 1, 2021 at 9:52
  • Yeah, there are pros and cons to this 3rd vote closing I guess. Having it as an audit is kinda troublesome IMO, hopefully it does not happen often.
    – kissu
    Sep 1, 2021 at 9:58

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