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I am quite new to the edit review queue and am keen to make sure I make the right decision on whether to accept or reject an edit.

I rejected this edit since it basically does nothing to improve what is a very poor post other than to add some formatting. Something to do with excrement and polishing comes to mind. However, 2 other high-rep users approved the edit. Should I be rejecting edits like this?

Edit to a question with -6 score changes one line of text in bold to one line of text and a block of pre-formatted output. The one sentence and output is the only content in the question.

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  • 14
    There are people that think that any edit that improves the post should be done. And they are right. Reviewers will spend more time rejecting it anyways since SE made the review queues very grindy.
    – Braiam
    Commented Jul 30, 2021 at 15:12
  • 6
    The question is still gonna be closed, so I'd argue yes. It's a waste of reviewer time on a question that's gonna be closed and deleted anyway, and at that point, the suggester is also gonna lose their rep. Commented Jul 30, 2021 at 15:12
  • 2
    formatting ... I rest my case.
    – rene
    Commented Jul 30, 2021 at 15:16
  • 27
    If I knew a question was going to be closed, due to being extremely low quality, and the edit did nothing to prevent the actual closure of the question I absolutely would reject the edit. The question is clearly a homework question, in fact I I didn't already know it wasn't an audit, I would have assumed it was an audit review. Commented Jul 30, 2021 at 15:18
  • 1
    Since I have enough reputation to close vote now, I just open the actual question in a new tab, close vote, and skip the actual review.
    – BSMP
    Commented Jul 30, 2021 at 18:41
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    I think it is reasonable to approve an edit that makes a post significantly easier to follow. Even if it's going to be closed, at least to people closing it will have an easier time reading it.
    – khelwood
    Commented Jul 30, 2021 at 18:43
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    @knelwood - Unfortunately, approving edits like this will cause a question that could later appear in the reopen queue, to not be reopened. This is at least until the changes planned happen Commented Jul 30, 2021 at 21:12
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    If you have enough reputation not to trouble the review queues, then making it clear what the question is asking, even if it will be closed, is IMO worthwhile — if you don't mind making the effort. However, if your edit must go through the review queues, you must consider not just your own effort but also the efforts of the reviewers — it isn't worthwhile so don't edit. Since I have enough reputation, I might have made the edit to clarify the question. But if you don't have enough reputation, it is best to leave such questions unedited. In the review queue, it is an improvement — approve, IMO. Commented Jul 30, 2021 at 22:42
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    @SecurityHound Yeah. It's pretty bizarre that the site mechanisms are so broken that people are encouraged to avoid improving content.
    – khelwood
    Commented Jul 30, 2021 at 22:56
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    @khelwood They are working on changes that will fix the problem of minor edits sending posts to the reopen queue so hopefully at least that issue will be resolved soon.
    – BSMP
    Commented Jul 31, 2021 at 9:00
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    I wish there was a way of doing a minor edit and clicking a button that says "do not place in reopen queue", because posts only get one chance. Often we want to make a minor edit, and hope that others (or OP) will take it further, but don't want it to go for review. Often I will reject a minor edit if the question is closed, but allow it if it's still open, precisely because of this. An improvement is still an improvement, and the question may still be salvageable Commented Aug 1, 2021 at 0:25
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    see also: There is no shame in using “Skip”
    – gnat
    Commented Aug 1, 2021 at 8:02
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    Voted to reopen. This question has the correct answer on top, the other ones have answers that are wrong.
    – user000001
    Commented Aug 1, 2021 at 11:27
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    I like how on the answer the "thanks this works" comment is actually posted by a different user. Insert Jackie Chan confused meme picture here.
    – Gimby
    Commented Aug 2, 2021 at 13:29
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    @Charlieface BSMP's comment directly preceding yours links to an in-progress effort to address that exact problem, FYI.
    – TylerH
    Commented Aug 9, 2021 at 14:49

6 Answers 6

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This type of edit is known as polishing a turd. It doesn't matter how much you polish a turd, it's still a turd. In this case, it doesn't matter how much you make the terrible question look presentable; it's still a terrible question. Editing it is a waste of the editors time, a waste of the time for people who review the queue, a waste of the time for people who have the question "bumped" to the top in the active questions (if the edit gets accepted), and a waste of the limited amount of edits that can be queued; meaning an edit for a good question might not be able to be submitted.

Rejecting the edit is the right call here, as it means that the person doesn't get that (albeit temporary, as the question will get deleted) 2 rep, and hopefully they'll learn why their edit was rejected and spend their time making edits to questions that are worth the time of other users.

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    I dunno about the terminology here. "Polishing a turd" is overtly antagonistic toward the person asking the question; the point of using such language is to affirm your own secure position in the in-group, and identify the person asking such as question as on outsider. SO as a whole rewards such behavior. The most I can do is to recommend/beseech you to try to put yourself in their shoes and adjust your language accordingly. Commented Jul 30, 2021 at 19:36
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    @RobertDodier - you criticize the phrase, but don't offer a suggestion for a better way to describe the act of editing a question that clearly doesn't follow community guidelines and will likely be deleted. What terminology would you find more acceptable?
    – Craig
    Commented Jul 30, 2021 at 22:10
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    @Craig The simple removal of the first two sentences, and the consequent removal of the lead phrase of the next, is sufficient. There is no need for the characterisation of it in that manner. What is left is calling the question "terrible", which it indeed is. That description is not in any way enhanced with the addition of what is, let's be clear, an unprofessional attack.
    – ClickRick
    Commented Jul 30, 2021 at 22:44
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    @user4581301 I don't see a benefit to others for editors to indulge their antagonism and disdain. I have to wonder where the emotional reaction is coming from. Commented Jul 30, 2021 at 23:38
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    Mostly from the "Why can't I suggest edits?" meta questions that pop up every day-or-so. Commented Jul 30, 2021 at 23:50
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    @RobertDodier The benefit of being antagonistic toward low quality content is that it makes us more motivated to moderate it and dissuades other people from creating it. If you're encouraging toward everything people do regardless of its negative impacts, you'll never see improvement.
    – jpmc26
    Commented Jul 31, 2021 at 3:59
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    @jpmc26 I disagree that negative emotional investment is necessary to discourage low quality content and encourage high quality. No need to be endlessly accommodating either; if being helpful and friendly is too much, and sometimes it is, then just downvote it or delete it or blandly say it's off topic or no effort or whatever. Commented Jul 31, 2021 at 5:09
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    @RobertDodier I disagree that we can possibly do anything against the flood of it without having a cultural opposition, and it's not possible to sustain cultural opposition on purely affirming and neutral behaviors. While there is certainly merit to not going down the rabbit hole of making everything condemnation, the other extreme is just as worthless.
    – jpmc26
    Commented Jul 31, 2021 at 8:33
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    @RobertDodier I am not trying to affirm my position in any kind of "in-group". If I were, I would have said so. I also don't imply the user is an outsider (in fact I have no knowledge of the user that posted the question). New and old users can ask questions of similar low quality. It's not about being inside or outside, it's purely about question quality and that the question in question in not good quality; editting it to make it "presentable" doesn't change that fact. Hence the phrase. I didn't make up said phrase; it's been around for a long time and isn't unique to Stack Overflow.
    – Thom A
    Commented Jul 31, 2021 at 11:58
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    @Larnu "I didn't make up said phrase" is a pretty weak argument, isn't it? There are all kinds of vulgar phrases in common use which shouldn't be applied here. If the question can't be fixed up, you can just say so. Incidentally, you are participating in the in-group/out-group dynamic even as you profess ignorance of it. An interesting test which is relevant here, is who gets away with using vulgar language. Can newcomers get away with it? No way. It's reserved for the established crowd. Commented Aug 1, 2021 at 5:12
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    @PasserBy Well, that's tremendously convenient, isn't it. When we use vulgar language, it's always for something of substance. Coincidentally, we get to decide what's substantial and what's not. Naturally, if newcomers don't get it, that's just too bad for them. Commented Aug 1, 2021 at 7:31
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    @RobertDodier with respect, if you think "turd" is a vulgar word, then there's no pleasing you; it's not vulgar at all... I am afraid else where on the internet yo'll find far worse language than someone using an alternative (and non-vulgar) word for feces. If, however, you think my post is vulgar flag it; don't engage. But, again, if the post was vulgar I wouldn't have posted it...
    – Thom A
    Commented Aug 1, 2021 at 8:07
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    @RobertDodier "Naturally, if newcomers don't get it, that's just too bad for them." Yes, it is. Unfortunately, we cannot understand the problems for someone. They have to figure things out for themselves. You cannot put that responsibility on us. Individually explaining it to every single person isn't sustainable. We have quality standards. We must enforce them if we believe they are helpful, and we must be willing to extol them as well. And that naturally means judging some content negatively. There is nothing wrong with that. Stop trying to vilify people just for saying something negative.
    – jpmc26
    Commented Aug 1, 2021 at 9:12
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    Turd is a humorous word, actually. It is the word of choice when making a joke involving dookie. Better to use turd than any of the ones used in serious transactions. I don't really know what the problem would be in general; when speaking of "polishing a turd" it is a comparison to the act of polish a turd, it is not saying that a question or answer is a turd. Not at all. Polishing a turd is a really fruitless endeavour, it is humorously overstating how pointless it is to edit a really bad question or answer. It'll still stink.
    – Gimby
    Commented Aug 2, 2021 at 14:26
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    Disagree with one thing in the above comment: If you use the term polishing a turd with respect to editing a weak post, the weak post is definitely being equated with a turd. With some posts I do not see this as a bad description. Commented Aug 3, 2021 at 17:26
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The review queue is for reviewing the quality of edits, not for determining whether the question should be deleted.

Just IMHO the system will work better if we consistently follow the guidelines for each queue.

BTW, no need to be coy about saying "turd."

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    Seems to me "skip" is a better choice and spend your review points elsewhere.
    – Joshua
    Commented Jul 31, 2021 at 17:08
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Should I be rejecting edits like this?

No, the edit is IMO an obvious improvement.

The problem is rather that edit shouldn't have been done at all. But to me that's another story.

Once it's in the "Suggested edits" review queue, it shall be reviewed solely by the quality of the edit. In other words: You are reviewing the "edit quality" - not the "question quality".

So in this case I would accept the edit but as an additional action, I would also "vote to close".

2
  • I agree with this answer with the only caveat that I wouldn't accept that edit if the question was already closed. In that case the question would go to the reopen review queue for no good reason. Except that, I agree that the edit could be accepted. If anything, it would bump the question and help to get it closed faster...
    – Tomerikoo
    Commented Aug 9, 2021 at 9:22
  • Exactly, if the edit makes a question better, it's a good edit. It does not matter in what way it makes it better or in whatever state the actual thread may be. And if an answer is bad, it should get down- or not get upvoted anyways, that's a (theoretically) self-solving problem and nothing to worry about when approving edits - generally (there's often some very unusual case where exceptions may be made). Commented Oct 31, 2023 at 13:10
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No. An edit should be reviewed on the merit of the edit itself, not the quality of the question or answer being edited. There's no harm done by accepting an edit that improves the formatting of a question or answer, irrespective of the content of the question or answer.

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    For practical reasons (already too few reviewers to review edits), reviewing edits on posts that are going to be deleted anyway is harming the site.
    – BDL
    Commented Jul 30, 2021 at 20:36
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    Edit suggestions are currently a finite resource, and once the suggested edit queue is filled up, Crom only knows how many useful edits ae lost. Commented Jul 30, 2021 at 23:17
  • FYI, the original post edit is applied on belongs to merits (or shortcomings) of the edit. Blindly applying principles disregarding the context is the worst thing a review could do. And thankfully, we try not to. Commented Jul 31, 2021 at 12:08
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    @BDL: Sorry, I'm missing something. As I understand it, this question presupposes that we're reviewing an edit on a post that's going to be deleted anyway. The only question is whether we should vote "accept" or "reject". Neither answer affects how many reviewers there are to review edits -- does it?
    – ruakh
    Commented Jul 31, 2021 at 18:42
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    @ruakh: Accepting the edit sends the wrong signal. How else than by rejecting should we tell the editor that such edits shouldn't be done? If you want to stop an editor from doing such edits, we have to make sure that they are not rewarded for them.
    – BDL
    Commented Jul 31, 2021 at 18:51
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    @BDL: I don't think that rejecting the edit really sends the signal you want it to, either; the editor won't understand why his/her edit was rejected. If this is your goal, then you should push for UI changes that actually achieve that goal.
    – ruakh
    Commented Jul 31, 2021 at 19:05
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    @ruakh: Rejecting might or might no send the right signal. But accepting definitely sends the wrong signal.
    – BDL
    Commented Jul 31, 2021 at 19:43
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    @BDL: Rejecting sends an actively harmful signal, along the lines of "Buzz off, we don't want you here". Is that harm justified?
    – ruakh
    Commented Jul 31, 2021 at 19:50
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Per Security Hound - the advice in this context would be one to generally follow, but if you're still unsure, skipping the review is always an option too.

If I knew a question was going to be closed, due to being extremely low quality, and the edit did nothing to prevent the actual closure of the question I absolutely would reject the edit.

-8

No. Why would you reject something that slightly improves formatting?

Regarding the "Polishing a turd" -- Its an arrogant statement because many who state such things are often not speaking objectively, but rather appealing to their own incredulity, which means that that because they can not see the value in something, that therefore no value exists.


Edit:

Oh; I kind of assumed that this question was on CodeGolf or something. Asking to write a program on SO obviously falls out of scope and fits the "turd" definition, and I was speaking towards more heterodox situations like these:

Question: How can I make a const in python?

Reviewer: "Why would anyone want to make a const in python? Just don't overwrite the value. Simple as. This question is a turd."

I still agree with the comment below, about how a polished turd is preferable to a turd. At the very least, that might teach the user how to properly format his [bad] question.

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    It's not that I can't see the value, it is literally that that post had no value. It wasn't asking a question it was demanding we write a program for the user! There was no effort, no research, no attempt, no question; just a user with a sense of entitlement that expected we use our free time to do their (home)work for them, for free (so they can take the credit). If that isn't a turd, nothing is.
    – Thom A
    Commented Jul 30, 2021 at 18:52
  • Disagreements over value is why we vote. Does the post have value? Of course it does. Everything has value. Does its value exceed its cost? In that I'm firmly in the "delete the post" camp. Commented Jul 30, 2021 at 19:02
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    @Larnu then delete the question. Edits that make an improvement should never be rejected. Why would you choose a turd over a polished turd. Commented Jul 30, 2021 at 19:55
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    I didn't edit the question @PhilipRego , nor would I. I'd VTC, downvote, and vote to delete if the option were there. I'm not going to waste the time of the community with getting them to review an edit because I cannot improve the question to make it on topic.
    – Thom A
    Commented Jul 30, 2021 at 20:33
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    @Philip - The problem with approving bad edit proposals, yes and edit proposal in question was bad, is that if the question were closed it wouldn’t result in the question being reopened and thus wasting the one opportunity for it to appear in that queue. The proper response to an edit like this is to, skip the review, and vote to close and delete the question. I would even perhaps personally flag a moderator since, the edit does not address the issues with the question, and improving the format of a question of such questionable quality is deeply concerning Commented Jul 30, 2021 at 21:16

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