-12

I've flagged an answer as rude/abusive (R/A), because I'm a reasonable flower and I find

You may wana do breast detection using depth camera.

inappropriate for respectful discourse, specially if the topic at hand is about differentiate between a man and a woman. Just for the record: That is the complete answer.

That flag didn't go down well as it got declined by the moderator handling it. I need to add that I didn't downvote the answer (sitting at +2/-2 at the moment), so that might have influenced the decision.

I realize there can be a thin line between what is inappropriate and what not, and given my reasonable low decline rate, I thought I had developed some sense of where that line is.

Obviously I need some extra feedback here to adjust my judgement going forward. I would appreciate answers (or comments) that can address these points that I wonder myself about:

  • Is that sentence in that context appropriate?
  • What should have told me that an R/A flag wasn't the right option here?
  • Is there a chance I'm over sensitive and if so, how can I safely turn that a notch down?

I considered reflagging with a custom flag, but I reckoned that would prevent me from learning of the motivation behind the decline. Please note that I'm not here to blame the moderator or even expect them to come forward. I'm more interested in the broader perspective of y'all on this specific case.

22
  • "I need to add that I didn't downvote the answer [..] so that might have influenced the decision." ... mhhh, how? How should a mod tell if you had downvoted the answer or not? They don't have that data.
    – Tom
    Commented Jun 1, 2021 at 10:06
  • 6
    In any case It's a wrong answer, breasts do not uniquely identify a person as a woman. Downvoting was definitely something that needed to happen.
    – Gimby
    Commented Jun 1, 2021 at 10:13
  • 13
    I don't think it's rude either; after finding the answer using a google. It's low quality (it's a comment, not an answer) and wrong due to assumptions on gender identity, but also a lot of how people see genders has changed in the last 9 years (since the answer was posted). I don't see what's rude/abusive about it. Could you elaborate on what you think is rude/abusive in the answer?
    – Thom A
    Commented Jun 1, 2021 at 10:14
  • @Tom I expect the mod view to show the score. A negative scored answer might lead to a different trigger in the mods handling process. It is all a bit subjective I admit.
    – rene
    Commented Jun 1, 2021 at 10:15
  • 4
    Well I hope the score doesn't matter when a mod handles a r/a flag. But I guess that depends on the mod who handles the flag.
    – Tom
    Commented Jun 1, 2021 at 10:20
  • 5
    Giving the poster the benefit of the doubt, you can read the answer as a genuine attempt at a constructive suggestion. So not r/a even if it is a bad answer. If they posted it on any other question, it would probably be r/a.
    – khelwood
    Commented Jun 1, 2021 at 10:55
  • 9
    Nothing even remotely rude there.
    – Dalija Prasnikar Mod
    Commented Jun 1, 2021 at 11:12
  • 2
    Yes, I'm with you. Spelling "wana" like that would be considered quite rude in my circle.
    – Clive
    Commented Jun 1, 2021 at 11:24
  • 5
    @nbk Is that a problem? Only 6 to 8 weeks old answers should be flagged?
    – rene
    Commented Jun 1, 2021 at 12:47
  • 13
    @nbk If I stumble on a Q/A that was made active for what ever reason I curate what I find. Age is not an issue in my assessment but I'm aware other POV exists on that specific matter.
    – rene
    Commented Jun 1, 2021 at 12:53
  • 2
    @nbk I beg to differ but thanks for sharing your point of view. I'm sure others will agree with you.
    – rene
    Commented Jun 1, 2021 at 13:05
  • 2
    @Clive If your circle also thinks it's rude to drink from a cup without extending the pinky finger, then I would believe you. That's making Mt. Everest out of a microscopic mole hill.
    – TylerH
    Commented Jun 1, 2021 at 13:24
  • 1
    @TylerH Indeed - the tongue and the cheek definitely conspired on that one :)
    – Clive
    Commented Jun 1, 2021 at 14:02
  • 2
    @10Rep No, a NAA flag being declined does not necessarily mean that the answer is worth keeping around. It simply means that it's not the right flag category for the answer. NAA flags are handled in bulk, and there are a lot of those flags raised. So it makes a lot of sense to only have non-answers be flagged as NAA. There are other ways to get rid of answers that we don't want on SO, e.g. via a custom flag, or by delete votes.
    – cigien
    Commented Jun 1, 2021 at 20:58
  • 1
    @10Rep Yes, that may be the case. Which is fine IMO, since deletion is a powerful privilege, and should not be used lightly. If one has less than 20k, one could always post a request in SOCVR. There are enough users there who're quite happy to use delete-votes on such answers. (I didn't know about VLQ flags not existing on old answers, so thanks for that).
    – cigien
    Commented Jun 2, 2021 at 1:51

1 Answer 1

30

I'm writing up the point I made in my comment a bit more verbosely here.

Firstly, however, I feel that the context of the question the answer was provided to should be given, as that is actually really important here. The question the answer is posted to is asking for a method, using Microsoft's Kinect product, to determine the gender of a person the device can see. Depending on the gender then different advertisements would be displayed.

I am working on an advertising application using Kinect, and what I want to do is when a man comes within a range of Kinect, it should display ads related to mens products and same goes with women.

Can it be done? Where should I start?

Now onto the answer quoted above (which was also provided 9 years ago and I think that is important and I come onto later). For the question I describe above, this is not rude (in my opinion). It is actually a real attempt to answer the question, with a methodology idea; you can determine the gender of the person by the detecting if they have breasts or not. If they do assume female, if not male.

Now, I'm not saying that is a good answer. Assuming someone who visibly has breasts is female and thus someone who visibly doesn't is male is likely to yield the wrong answer for many reasons. Clothing can easily hide the shape of someone's body, breasts come in many different sizes, people's bodies change as they age, someone who identifies as female might psychologically be male and have no breasts and vice versa, men can have breasts or be a shape that could look like it at a glance, people can have their breasts removed for medical reasons, the list goes on. But does, in a simple boolean statement and programmatically, is "has breasts = female" rude? I would strongly suggest no; it's wrong and rudimentary and I can see some being offended by such a device assuming their gender incorrectly, but it's not rude.

Also, as I mentioned, this answer was posted 9 years ago. In my opinion, Gender Identity has changed a lot over the last decade; both in acceptance and the the way people identify themselves. This doesn't make something that was said 9~ years ago that was "ok" then but isn't now "right", but it I do feel that a "pinch of salt" needs to be taken when reading something that might be seen as "not ok" but permissible then.

Certainly, however, I don't doubt that there will be some that find that the above quoted answer is rude, for the pure reason that assuming that if you can see someone has breasts they are female, however, on the whole this I would guess isn't going to be many. If someone really does feel that it isn't appropriate for that reason, a custom mod flag should be raised explaining in more detail (however, without disrespect I would hope the flag to be declined). A flag as "low quality" though would most likely get accepted, as the answer is at best a comment and not an answer.

6
  • 1
    I am not a person who likes political correctness, but if a device found me a female when I am a male I would get offended by two things: 1. Why is it trying to find out my gender? and 2. I am not a female. I assume that it would offend many people, meaning it is rude. By today's standards, an RA flag should at the very least be disputed, and not declined IMO. Because many reasonable people would find it offensive and hurtful.
    – 10 Rep
    Commented Jun 1, 2021 at 19:45
  • 5
    That isn't a fault of the answer being flagged as "rude" though @10Rep , it's the fault of the question asker who wants to assume a person's gender. If that truly is "rude" in this sense then the question should be flagged, not the answers.
    – Thom A
    Commented Jun 1, 2021 at 19:56
  • Ok, rewriting my comment here. Seperating genders is not the bad thing about the answer. That's done pretty much everyday, such as in forms that you fill out, resume's, applications, etc. But in these examples, do they seperate gender based on your body? That's what I find wrong. If someone came across by that answer today, there's a chance it could hurt them, so I find age to be an irrelevant factor. Unless the original question mentioned gender profiling by body, I'd say the answer is RA. There's no telling how many people could be offended by it, and that shouldn't matter IMO.
    – 10 Rep
    Commented Jun 2, 2021 at 1:51
  • 1
    "Unless the original question mentioned gender profiling by body" The question is about telling the gender of someone by a kinect, a camera, @10Rep ... The thing is it going to see is their body; be it the clothes on it, their face, their profile... Though the questions doesn't specifically ask "by their body" it is strongly implied.
    – Thom A
    Commented Jun 2, 2021 at 7:55
  • 1
    Also, I disagree that determine a person's gender by their body is "rude"; again as humans we do it every day. The rude part is acting on assumptions that are wrong; if I see someone who I can't tell easily is a man or a woman, but decide they are likely a woman because they appear to have breasts but don't change my behaviour in any way, that isn't rude. If I were to go up to that person and say "Excuse me ma'am, do you mind if I get by?" and it was a man, it could be considered rude. If I just went up to them and said "Sorry, I can't tell, are you a man or a woman?" that is rude.
    – Thom A
    Commented Jun 2, 2021 at 7:57
  • 1
    It's true but it's our own brain that does it and it is pretty much an automated process; saying that "humans do it" is not really all that fair, humans can't stop it from happening. You can only choose to not act on it. In this case it's someone deliberately trying to implement marketing intelligence that will do what a human brain automatically does; it is something that can be stopped and I am not surprised that it gets resistance. Underserved though, collecting facts to build a model based on what a camera sees is a valid question and will attract answers that need a neutral reader.
    – Gimby
    Commented Jun 2, 2021 at 8:59

You must log in to answer this question.

Not the answer you're looking for? Browse other questions tagged .