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Imagine that new community members can only post in chat, and that they need to get 5 upvotes in order to earn the permission to make real posts. Only members with 30 pts can upvote them.

I feel like this would greatly increase the quality of posts made by new users, and it would help them learn the guidelines of the community.

Make the Stack Overflow chat more prominently linked

^ I'd recommend making the chat more prominent in the UI for starters. Chat in general needs a bit of product management. There is so much engagement that is being lost; taken to outside communities on Slack.

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    I mean... if people knew they were able to reliably get answers to their questions in chat, why would they ever post an actual question? How are we going to get people interested in helping new users in chat when the majority of questions should have instead been typed into google search?
    – Kevin B
    Mar 31, 2020 at 18:48
  • @KevinB different kind of questions could be asked there... It's a good spot for - "hey what tool can I use for this task" or "anyone have a good dataset for this type of model"
    – Kermit
    Mar 31, 2020 at 18:49
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    What could possibly go wrong.. ;) How many new users does Stack Overflow get per day?
    – Scratte
    Mar 31, 2020 at 18:50
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    We did have something similar to this in the past, called the mentor project. IIRC it was generally successful, but impossible to scale.
    – Kevin B
    Mar 31, 2020 at 18:51
  • @Scratte I wonder what percent of those users get roasted in their first posts and never return
    – Kermit
    Mar 31, 2020 at 18:54
  • @HashRocketSyntax A lot of them. But imagine the chatrooms being completely overrun by users that posts their Questions for other users to put stars on them just so they can post for real. Most chatrooms don't even want code block in their rooms because it makes the chat noisy.
    – Scratte
    Mar 31, 2020 at 18:57
  • @Scratte so put some boundaries around the rooms. And disagree on the code chat.stackoverflow.com/rooms/6/python
    – Kermit
    Mar 31, 2020 at 18:59
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    Please set up your chatroom so that we can post links to it for all the bad questions from new accounts. You can then help them learn the guidelines. I'm all for it, and I'm impressed that you are volunteering to help in this way. Apr 1, 2020 at 7:57

2 Answers 2

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As a Stack Overflow veteran of almost nine years, I've ventured into chat maybe two or three times, sometimes forgetting that it exists.

Chat itself is a small portion of the actual site itself, and the actual regulars of chat aren't likely interested in engaging with new members on a constant basis (whose only real objective is to get their question answered as opposed to learn how the site works, and the sooner everyone accepts that reality, the easier life will become).

Fundamentally speaking,

your suggestion will not scale

because new community members outnumber chat on any good day on the order of 10,000 to 1.

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  • The UI of the site makes it so. Put some entry level rooms in there. Do it on a trial run to get some data.
    – Kermit
    Mar 31, 2020 at 19:01
  • I'd argue that this mindset won't scale.
    – Kermit
    Mar 31, 2020 at 19:11
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    I agree with Makoto. We are awash in low quality questions without enough people able to put in time or effort to moderate, how will adding chat to the moderation requirements help? Mar 31, 2020 at 19:22
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    @HashRocketSyntax: I also would put more weight to your views if I see more concrete evidence of moderation effort such as a very active presence in meta or many helpful flags. This would show that you have "been in the trenches" for a good bit, and understand the beast that we're up against. Mar 31, 2020 at 19:25
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    @HashRocketSyntax: You can't compel anyone to go into a chat room and wait for new members who - and I stress again - only seek an answer to their question so that they can learn how the site works. They're gonna want their question answered and they'll be frustrated when that doesn't work out.
    – Makoto
    Mar 31, 2020 at 19:31
  • @Makoto you could incentivize it the same way everything else is incentivized in this comm. meta.stackoverflow.com/review compels ppl and so do badges.
    – Kermit
    Mar 31, 2020 at 19:32
  • @Makoto has a totally separate community been explored? like a different subdomain?
    – Kermit
    Mar 31, 2020 at 19:34
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    At some point, @HashRocketSyntax, you have to stop and realize that you're asking volunteers to do hard labor. I've been gently prodding you along to this but since you're not coming to the actual point... I have a day job. Many others who participate on this site have a day job. We also have lives outside of Stack Overflow. We do not have the capacity to take on yet another unpaid effort for users who - once again, I cannot stress enough - only seek an answer to their question in an effort that we hope will grant them clarity into how the site works.
    – Makoto
    Mar 31, 2020 at 19:37
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    Phrased another way @HashRocketSyntax, you cannot offer me enough badges or reputation to make me want to invest an hour into something like this. I'd be looking for cold, hard cash instead.
    – Makoto
    Mar 31, 2020 at 19:38
  • ..especially as new users cannot even be identified. Apr 1, 2020 at 8:03
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    ..and anyone seen as getting between a poster and their answer risks backstabbing on Facepalm/Twotter as 'hostile', 'toxic', 'bigoted', 'misogynist', 'racist' and all the other garbage that fell off the back of the welcome wagon:( Apr 1, 2020 at 8:14
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    @HashRocketSyntax The sentiment is laudable, but it's going to be very disheartening to try to teach someone anything when the only thing they keep repeating is "sir please just anser my urgent q thx". It has happened way too often and it's never any less discouraging every time. Yes, speaking from experience.
    – M.A.R.
    Apr 12, 2020 at 9:57
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Most users get their new Questions closed because they failed to properly inform themselves of the requirements for posting Questions. Some of them improve their Questions and have it reopened. Most of them do not. Chat will not be able to provide them with more information than the help and the FAQ does, unless it's a one-to-one interaction. So, we need one experienced user for every new user in these rooms.

Currently if users have reputation enough to enter chat, they already either answered or asked a Question (or had edits approved). But for your proposal to work, any new user with a reputation of 1 would have to have access to chat and be able to speak. This will require a lot of moderation just to keep the tone, and the trolls and spammers out of the rooms. But I suppose that's fine, because we already have one experienced user for every new user in the chat.

There's not enough experienced users for all the new users, so new users would have to wait their turn to enter the rooms. Lets say a few hundred experienced users would even be interested in this activity. (I'm not sure there's even a few hundred users total in chat now!). You'd have a very long line of new users getting frustrated waiting to post their one (or five, as you suggested 1) Question for review discussion in chat. Not to mention that they have to be online and responsive once it's their turn.

We almost already have this system in place. It's the review queues. Except new users do not have to be online and responsive when it's their turn. It takes less time, because there's no lengthy discussion going on. No other requirements than reviewing is asked of the reviewer. There's no asking them to answer the Question, no begging them to please approve it, and no fighting going on. I imagine fighting will be going on when someone's proposal is rejected.

But.. in theory there's nothing to stop you from creating your own room for this. If you really believe in it, you can post a link to your chat room on users closed Question offering your help to get their post into shape (remember the required 20 reputation points). If it works out, you've proved everyone here wrong, and I'll congratulate you on making new users feel happy and welcome. However, before you try it out, you should probably do a lot of reviewing first, to "understand the beast" as Hovercraft Full Of Eels' comment puts it.

One could also argue that this system is already in place on any Question with enough comments saying:

Please avoid extended discussions in comments. Would you like to automatically move this discussion to chat?

..which gives a link to a new chat room.

1: I'm assuming five stars from different users on the same Question is the same as one star on five different Questions

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