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EDIT - To make it clear:

I saw/see a potential conflict in the situation and want to avoid escalating it. I am asking for advice on how to do so. I'm also asking for opinions whether my original comment was rude or simply not friendly (since I see a huge difference there). In the last part I ask whether you believe that there should be badges that encourage ruses to get them.

I am not looking for someone to tell me who is right and who is wrong. I don't believe in such concepts. What I believe in is sharing perspectives to form a common picture and possibly reach consensus or understanding for the other party.

Original:

A wee bit of history:

  • during my crawl through some question some time ago I stumbled across this one and noticed that the question as in bad shape and probably in need of moderation to improve the question
  • I saw the first comment, that says exactly that and wondered why it wasn't flagged already
  • I tried to flag the question and noticed that this isn't possible while someone has a bounty added to the question
  • According to the bounty sponsor's bounty-comment the only reason for the bounty was to acquire a badge (i didn't even know you can get a badge for offering a bounty you're not planning to distribute)
  • So I upvoted the first comment and left another comment to the bounty giver. I don't remember the exact wording but my comment was something like this (maybe a moderator can magically get the original wording from the archives):

@bountygiver not only did you add a bounty to an essentially unsalvagable question, making it impossible to delete you also replied with a jquery solution to a reactjs question. I have no words...

  • The bounty givers first reply (now deleted) comment was VERY rude and offensive comment, so I flagged it for deletion (also, maybe a moderator can give us the wording of said comment)
  • Since the offensive comment was removed I thought to myself "Well, let them be. The question is still in bad shape but maybe there was something to learn from this after all". So I did not reply in comment as the matter was resolved for me
  • Today I get a notification of a comment. I click on it and the first thing I see is that my original comment was removed. The second thing is the new comment that says

Thank you for pointing me in the right direction by stating i should have paid closer attention to the tags. However may i suggest a nicer way to say what you commented? Because what you said is plain rude and belittling in a sense. Hows "Hey NodeDad, i can see you have been inactive for awhile so keep in mind to pay closer attention to what the questions tags contain, he need a reactjs solution. Can you provide one? If not maybe remove your answer." You essentially talked negatively about both me and the author of this question. So your entire comment is not useful.

Which brings us to today:

  • Given the first and now deleted comment by the user I feel that such a reprimand is completely out of place and I have a huge urge to reply with something like "you're the one to talk", which would be completely contextless as well.
  • apparently it took the author a couple of weeks to either see that his offensive comment is now gone or to actually see reason behind my comment
  • Starting a conversation on the question's comments is wrong since it has nothing to do with the question itself. Which brings us to this meta discussion and a couple of questions:

    1. Was my first comment "belittling" or "plain rude"? From my perspective my statement was factually correct and the last bit with "I have no words" was an expression of me being annoyed by this behaviour. Surely I could've chosen nicer words but I don't see why anyone should reward misbehaviour (adding a bounty for the sake of a badge, answering a question while ignoring the context) with kind words. That said I always try to be fair in my comments, flags, etc. But it's also not fair to add a fake bounty and to protect a question that should be edited (improved or deleted) from moderation. I guess I hit a nerve somewhere. In any case: I did not mean to be belittling or rude - I don't think I was - but I apologise if I offended someone with my direct speech.

    2. Given the deleted comments the only comment on the question targeting me is now completely out of context and there is no way for other users to see what has happened and possibly make up their own minds about the contextless reprimand. It's also not possible to see that the once put up bounty had a comment that said it was just there to get the badge. Also the bounty wasn't awarded (which really isn't an issue because there is neither a question or an answer here that deserve one, imho). So I guess my question is: Should I flag the comment for not helpful so it get's removed as well? I don't want to start a comment argument where whoever flags fastest and comments latest seems to be the righteous one. It might also not be to late to delete the question all together... but I really don't know what the right move is here.

    3. I believe a moderation queue for bounties is required OR there should be no badge for adding bounties. Either of these measures would stop people from adding dishonest bounties.

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  • 6
    I have a huge urge to reply with something like "you're the one to talk". NEVER DO THAT!. Don't get into arguments in the comments, especially ones that address the person, not the content. If something inappropriate happens, get a moderator involved, and disengage. Don't follow up. If a question with a bounty is truly terrible, you can also get a moderator involved to close it.
    – Erik A
    Jun 13, 2019 at 8:15
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    Your first comment wasn't exactly a good example of a friendly and constructive comment either, but that aside this seems like something not worth spending your energy on.
    – ivarni
    Jun 13, 2019 at 8:16
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    That first comment does seem like a legitimate concern. Adding a bounty to a poor quality question is already frowned upon. And if I were to look for a React solution to something, I wouldn't want to see an answer using jQuery instead. Jun 13, 2019 at 8:31
  • 1
    interesting, so many downvotes on a question asking for advice on how to handle things. Maybe I have it wrong and I should be much more hostile... The point is: I want to move on - I had moved on but then the other party re-opened that keg. If you think I should simply flag as "no longer needed" I can try that, but I'm not convinced that is a solution
    – konqi
    Jun 13, 2019 at 8:34
  • @ivarni i'm aware, but there is a difference between "not friendly" and "rude / belittling". While I'm not always friendly I'm rarely rude but mostly direct.
    – konqi
    Jun 13, 2019 at 8:45
  • 4
    Didn't vote on this myself, but I can see how someone would because it reads a lot more like a rant than a question. I don't think the takeaway is that you should be more hostile or how you landed on that conclusion. Meta voting works a lot different than on main, and votes here might just as well signal disagreement with the premise or that people think it's just noise.
    – ivarni
    Jun 13, 2019 at 9:04
  • sigh trust me, you would know if I was ranting. I honestly want to avoid further confrontation and I was asking for advice on how to do that and opinions on whether my original comment was actually rude or simply not very friendly (because there is a huge difference). I had to give the history or it would not be clear why I see a potential problem here.
    – konqi
    Jun 13, 2019 at 9:19

1 Answer 1

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Was my first comment "belittling" or "plain rude"? From my perspective my statement was factually correct and the last bit with "I have no words" was an expression of me being annoyed by this behaviour.

Without looking at the actual comment, hard to guess. If the quote you provide is correct, the "I have no words" is kinda over the top and unnecessary. Personally, I wouldn't have flagged. But I can see other users flagging something like that and a mod honouring it.

It's also likely that the comment was flagged as "No longer needed", since the comment served no additional purpose. As such, it was a prime target for deletion.

I understand your frustration. I really do. I do not think it was a terrible comment. For the most part, I believe it was OK. But it's also fine that comments like those get deleted once they served their purpose.

For very-bad-questions protected by bounties, you can raise a custom mod flag. Sometimes those get honoured and sometimes they don't. It will depend on the specifics of the question, if it already got answers or not, what the mod thought about the case, etc.

Given the deleted comments the only comment on the question targeting me is now completely out of context and there is no way for other users to see what has happened and possibly make up their own minds about the contextless reprimand

If a comment can't be understood because context is lacking (e.g. it was deleted), flag as "no longer needed" for deletion. Or custom flag and explain that the comment is replying to now deleted comments, so it doesn't look like you are trying to "silence" anyone.

I don't want to start a comment argument where whoever flags fastest and comments latest seems to be the righteous one. It might also not be to late to delete the question all together... but I really don't know what the right move is here.

Better not to start any kind of war. Flag and move on. Or simply move on. Do not take it personally and do not over engage. It's better for you and for the site. But mostly for you.

[From a comment] The point is: I want to move on - I had moved on but then the other party re-opened that keg. If you think I should simply flag as "no longer needed" I can try that, but I'm not convinced that is a solution

That's exactly the solution. You moved on. They pinged you again. Keep moving on. Flag and forget. That's exactly the solution. What other kind of solution do you think it should exist for this situation?

I believe a moderation queue for bounties is required OR there should be no badge for adding bounties. Either of these measures would stop people from adding dishonest bounties.

This is huge feature-request. It doesn't make sense to tack it at the end of a question about comments. But nevertheless, I do not think we need yet another queue. For bounties-protected-bad-questions we already have custom-mod-flags.

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  • that last part is not a feature request - more a request for discussion. I wonder if mods like custom-mod-flags on such trivia - if it could be avoided when there was no badge to be gained by the feature
    – konqi
    Jun 13, 2019 at 8:41
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    I imagine mods ABSOLUTELY LOVE ALL FLAGS ALL THE TIME. Otherwise, they wouldn't have run for mods in the first place. It's in their programming. They are flag-munching robots, and they are insatiable.
    – yivi
    Jun 13, 2019 at 8:44
  • regarding your last edit: I would prefer a solution that involves both parties to agree that mistakes were made but it's okay now. Given the number of downvotes on the question I will vote to delete my own question. It's possible that I'm just sad because I aways believed that SO is a friendly place where problems are solved and not created and I hate to be wrong. I also believed taking such disputes to meta was the correct way - seems I'm wrong in that assumption as well. Hm can't even do that, your answer blocks me from doing so. Oh well, moving on... Thanks for your insights though.
    – konqi
    Jun 13, 2019 at 8:52
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    You want dispute resolution. Someone telling who's right and who isn't. That's not useful. Better to avoid disputes than to resolve them. SO is a friendly place, mostly. But sometimes some users will do less than friendly things. E.g. the I have no words could be construed as not very friendly by some. A rude comment was posted in response, and likely was flagged/deleted. The solution for these things is to delete them, not to further engage. If you believe someone else was rude, just flag it as such and let a mod deal with it. Rudeness is an exception, we have exception handlers for that.
    – yivi
    Jun 13, 2019 at 8:57
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    @konqi Pro-tip: It's indeed best to shrug it off. Sometimes people will feel offended by the pettiest of things. And from personal experience, continuing to exchange comments never really helps. :( Jun 13, 2019 at 9:01
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    I've deleted the reply comment... @konqi - as this answer says - don't engage, just flag and walk away. Your original comment was flagged, a mod chose to delete it, reading the context, I'd have done the same. Your comment really wasn't necessary and while I know it's exasperating sometimes, just don't express it. Shrug it off, move on, don't worry about it, and let mods handle it. Jun 13, 2019 at 9:03
  • @JonClements i saw it, and accidentally flagged the wrong comment for deletion myself, shame on me.
    – konqi
    Jun 13, 2019 at 9:04
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    @konqi This is not an altogether wrong approach to deal with unpleasantness here in SO (or in life in general, maybe).
    – yivi
    Jun 13, 2019 at 9:15
  • or you'll get stabbed in the back with this kind of behaviour. (or on SO someone downvotes all of your questions/answers, maybe) - just saying...
    – konqi
    Jun 13, 2019 at 9:22
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    @konqi and again, moderators will step in, and someone might find themselves without an account if that course of action is required... In short, instead of bringing your frustrations to meta (and again, I understand them - don't get me wrong), just mod flag and we'll do the needful. Jun 13, 2019 at 9:28
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    @konqi Why exactly do you want these matters to be worked out without moderation? That sounds similar to letting the community fight crime without the police. Jun 13, 2019 at 9:54
  • 2
    @konqi Most things, the community can deal with directly with votes and reviews. (E.g. the question you linked has already been closed by the community). Other things, the community can't handle. Those are exceptions, and for that we have "human" exception handlers. The mods deal with exceptions.
    – yivi
    Jun 13, 2019 at 10:07
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    For a "1-on-1" disagreement there is usually nothing to do. As long as no rules are broken, there is no recourse nor there should be any recourse. Two users disagreed. One of them was wrong, or maybe both were wrong. Nothing to see. If one of them broke the rules, that's a clear case of an exception. Raise an exception and let it be handled.
    – yivi
    Jun 13, 2019 at 10:08
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    @konqi well then ping the commenter back and get in a flame war... I don't see what else lol. Everyone's telling you to disengage... You say you want something with no mods involved. So... You want to go down the path of 'Ill talk with the guy to have one of us apologize '? Cause honestly, short of getting one person to 'admit' they were wrong .. I don't see how more interaction with such a user would help here.... Or be productive for anyone involved
    – Patrice
    Jun 13, 2019 at 11:41
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    I try to go through life making as few enemies as possible. As such I try to settle even small scores. You may call it "the path of I'll talk with the guy" - yes. "admit someone was wrong" - I don't need that. I found it's usually enough to ask or say: Are we good?! (Also I'm usually the one admitting to everything, turns out that most people are forgiving but need someone/-thing to blame. In the office we call it the default-guilty-person, doesn't translate well - sorry)
    – konqi
    Jun 13, 2019 at 13:01

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