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The marketing people behind SO Teams told me that they could not enable SSO (Single Sign On) at our 150 people because it was reserved for 500+ strong organizations, or that's what I understood.

I just received an email from the same @stackoverflow.com email account about influitive.com services which led me to believe that I was being denied what I needed and being offered some unrelated else. Now I know that the marketing on top of our SO Teams query was an unfortunate mistake.

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In the end this query is about the mismatch in our requirement for SSO (Single Sign On) at 150+ strong, and the SO Teams development plan, which I'm assured includes implementing SSO as soon as early 2019.

The features we need (like supporting several teams) are in SO Enterprise/Hosted, which is currently a different offering.

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    PSA to the Meta-hounds: This one's probably not answerable or serviceable by us. Let the CMs weigh in on this. Downvoting this question isn't going to do anyone much good.
    – Makoto
    Commented Dec 5, 2018 at 23:59
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    I don't quite understand what you're trying to explain here. stackoverflow.influitive.com appears to be a place for SO to gather feedback from customers, where does the "selling services" come into play? Also, I assume the marketing people have been given instructions about requiring 500+ users.
    – user247702
    Commented Dec 6, 2018 at 0:11
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    Gotta be honest, I've no idea what any of this is about either. I've left a note for our marketing team; hopefully someone there does.
    – Shog9
    Commented Dec 6, 2018 at 0:16
  • Editors: delete, or tell me if I should. I apologize for stepping on the box thinking I otherwise wouldn't have a voice.
    – Apalala
    Commented Dec 6, 2018 at 0:38

1 Answer 1

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We have two products that serve fairly similar needs:

Teams is hosted directly on stackoverflow.com. Enterprise is either self-hosted or on a service such as AWS or Azure. Due to the overhead of supporting Enterprise instances and the importance of having a critical mass of users, we only offer Enterprise for organizations of 500 or more. Because Enterprise is a dedicated instance for each customer, we can support SSO. Since Teams are hosted on the Stack Overflow directly they use the same credentials as the public site and SSO isn't supported today.

The main reason we don't sell Enterprise to small customers is that it needs a certain critical mass to be successful. We estimate based on past experience that 500 people is approximately the minimum needed. But Teams works for smaller groups because many developers visit Stack Overflow regularly and will see questions from their own Team right there. As nice as SSO can be, having all your programming questions in the same place is arguably even better. (And if you already have a Stack Overflow login, there's little benefit to adding another one for your company's benefit.)

Being completely transparent, one of the reasons we have two tiers of products is segmentation. Large organizations are willing to pay more for features such as single sign-on (and probably wouldn't buy the product at all without it). Conversely, most smaller organizations (who Teams is aimed at) tend to care less about that feature and don't want to pay Enterprise prices for the privilege. As it happens, building SSO support into Enterprise required considerable effort and cost. Ironically, there are many different single sign-on systems and none of them work exactly the same way.

All that said, we are working on adding SSO to Teams since this is something other potential customers have asked for. We'll be sure to let everyone know the details when it's ready!

The email you got was part of our first ever customer advocacy program. The idea is that people who already use a product are likely to recommend it to others. We sent that email to people who had opted in to recieve research emails as well as some Teams users. It certainly wasn't our intention to ask you to advocate for a product we wouldn't sell you. I'm sorry for the confusion it caused. I can see how it might be like rubbing salt in a wound.

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  • Thanks for your answer, @Jon. It's the same answer received and accepted before. We don't agree with it, because we are a dynamic and growing company, in many ways different from "enterprise", but we complied, by seeking other options. It was the unexpected call to influitive advertising what led us to query further. I think your marketing strategy is wrong, but that's up to you and me over beers. Those selling us SO Teams shouldn't be selling us anything else until theyv'e sold us what we wanted to buy. I'll delete this Q&A tomorrow.
    – Apalala
    Commented Dec 6, 2018 at 0:53
  • For the record, I'm an "influencer", and not a "decision maker", all opinions expressed are mine and of not of others.
    – Apalala
    Commented Dec 6, 2018 at 0:57
  • Out of curiosity, why is SSO a requirement for you? You can limit your Team to users with emails on your domain, if that helps at all. Commented Dec 6, 2018 at 0:57
  • SSO is a requirement from our INF as we go from 150 to 500+. I didn't ask "Why?" because I think it's understandable.
    – Apalala
    Commented Dec 6, 2018 at 0:59
  • I apologize for the previous short answer, @Jon. The reason our INF requires SSO is because our operation is complex, and our infrastructure needs to interact with many systems. We're small in head count, but we do a lot. To keep doing it well, our INF requires SSO.
    – Apalala
    Commented Dec 6, 2018 at 1:10
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    We're feeling the pains of Dumbar's Number
    – Apalala
    Commented Dec 6, 2018 at 1:19
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    @Apalala what the heck is an INF? Is a new C*O lettering to learn?
    – Braiam
    Commented Dec 6, 2018 at 1:33
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    For what it's worth, Stack Overflow has an internal Enterprise instance that we used for many years. It has less than half the questions of our own internal Team which just hit its anniversary. We have less than 500 people, so our experience suggests Teams is the right product for ~150 users. Unfortunately, adding SSO to Teams would almost certainly make Teams more expensive. Perhaps your infrastructure team would make an exception for SO since we take the responsibility of supporting sign-on issues ourselves? Commented Dec 6, 2018 at 1:34
  • It's short for "infrastructure", @Braiam, which nowadays includes DevOps.
    – Apalala
    Commented Dec 6, 2018 at 1:35
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    @Apalala: This just in: I hear from a reliable source we are working on SSO for Teams. It might not be ready in time for your company to decide, but it is coming. Commented Dec 6, 2018 at 1:43
  • @JonEricson, I do not understand the distinction among "Teams" and "Enterprise", and I think it's provable that the 500 threshold is not on the mark, as it should be 150. It would cost us much, much more to make an exception, at being small, than it would cost you! Besides, You're wrong! ;-)
    – Apalala
    Commented Dec 6, 2018 at 1:45
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    Roughly the same difference as buying a plan from Gitlab and hosting Gitlab on your own, @Apalala: if you're using Teams, you're using the same servers as everyone else who uses SO, the same databases, the same infrastructure... If you're using Enterprise, you're using your own servers, or a completely isolated cloud host that you pay for. In exchange, you can do pretty much whatever you want with the Enterprise version, while the Teams version is somewhat more limited. We are trying to kinda bridge the gap there... But if you've ever written LDAP code you know the struggle.
    – Shog9
    Commented Dec 6, 2018 at 2:02
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    Thanks for the explanation @Shog9. You're right in that we're not seeking to host the software. We need software in the cloud to integrate within our dynamics, and our infrastructure guys have set a bar at the entry with SSO.
    – Apalala
    Commented Dec 6, 2018 at 11:14
  • woah, how long have you guys been supporting teams and enterprise?
    – Krupip
    Commented Dec 6, 2018 at 18:30
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    @opa: Teams came out this year and we've been selling Enterprise for several years. For several years before that we had Enterprise, but didn't go out of our way to sell. (I wrote a blog post about it in May.) Commented Dec 6, 2018 at 18:57

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