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Comments get silently removed from a user's visible history so it is unclear what comments are perceived as "rude or abusive" or "racist or hateful", or – possibly – "in need of moderator intervention" (and for what reason).

It would be useful if these comments remain in a user's comment list, only visible to this user, and marked as being deleted with the reason why. Having the opportunity to permanently delete them would be nice but optional. That way users will have immediate feedback on the reception of their comments.

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    consider providing feedback for draft of the new CoC discussed here. Since they plan an official statement about warning and suspending people, it would be better supported by software changes to make this process transparent. Possibly they could add a link to "recent deleted comments" to user profile, similar to already implemented links to recent deleted questions and answers
    – gnat
    Commented Jul 22, 2018 at 9:10
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    ...nevermind, I submitted this feedback myself
    – gnat
    Commented Jul 22, 2018 at 13:36
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    The problem comes down to this (in my opinion): [1] Tone and character is easily lost when communicating in a non-verbal fashion. [2] The internet is already full of trolls and rude people. As a consequence we almost expect to encounter those, which makes it easy to misinterpret a well-intended joke as a snarky comment instead. TL;DR - better avoid jokes, and if you have to throw one in, make it super obvious that it is.
    – Chris
    Commented Jul 23, 2018 at 14:37
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    They don't want SO to become reddit where funzies up votes bury the valuable content. I'm Ok with that Commented Jul 23, 2018 at 18:12
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    @OmarGonzalez If you're looking for answers in comments, you have a bigger problem.
    – Ian Kemp
    Commented Jul 24, 2018 at 8:20
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    Gotta be honest, I think we should have an amnesty date for comments posted before this whole welcoming thing started. I understand that you have always wanted us to be civil, but let's look forward. Don't consider the things that we have done before this welcoming push. I don't want to have to go through and delete all my old comments out of the worry that I might have been less than welcoming in the past.
    – zero298
    Commented Jul 24, 2018 at 16:04
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    300+ upvotes cast in 4 days to this post suggest that maybe it's time for a moderator to tag it featured - "tag to mark important meta discussions". This would also promote it to conveniently complement related CoC feedback request which is currently featured at sidebar
    – gnat
    Commented Jul 24, 2018 at 21:49
  • This has been requested here meta.stackexchange.com/a/313780/310756
    – user3956566
    Commented Oct 27, 2018 at 14:04
  • @gnat we can feature it when the burnination request is finished featuring. Perhaps flag asking for it to be featured when there's space for it? We try to limit to two featured posts at a time.
    – user3956566
    Commented Oct 27, 2018 at 14:31
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    @zero298 so do I. There's comments from years ago being flagged as unwelcoming. What are mods supposed to do with that? Retroactively impose a standard that has changed?
    – user3956566
    Commented Oct 27, 2018 at 15:27

1 Answer 1

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There's no exact threshold for when someone is warned about their comments, it's purely a subjective decision by the moderator or moderators involved. Different moderators will probably handle situations in different ways. From what I've seen, little has changed recently about how we approach situations like this. I warn or suspend for the same cases I would have a year ago.

The first goal with a moderator warning about comments is to make people aware that we and others might be having problems with the tone of some recent ones. This might be in response to a single insulting comment, a few recent rude ones, or a pattern of unconstructive behavior going back months. We only progress to suspensions if the behavior is particularly bad right away (flinging obscenities and slurs at people, etc.) or if our attempts to nudge people in the right direction are ignored and comments continue to be flagged. Even then, we often issue multiple warnings before progressing to short suspensions. The goal is to change behavior and prevent problems on the site, not to impose punishments based on some codified checklist.

For the record, here's the template message we use for warnings about this (sometimes modified or rewritten for specific cases):

I wanted to let you know that we've observed some rudeness in your latest activity. We get it; anyone who's ever tried to engage with others online has probably been tempted to lash out at someone else. This is just a friendly reminder that we require all participants to act in a professional and civil tone when using these sites. If another user has wronged you in some way, please do not respond in kind. Simply flag the content for moderator attention and move on.

If this is a simple misunderstanding, no harm done. Sometimes it is helpful to remind ourselves on occasion that keeping things friendly and constructive doesn't have to be at odds with being right — so enjoy the site, bring your sense of humor, and please be tolerant of others who may not know everything you know.

There has been a bit of discussion among moderators lately about when we should expand upon that with the particular comments that we found to be problematic. The moderator responding in this case provided a list of ones they thought were concerning. We'll often do that when asked for details about a warning, but we're debating whether we should more frequently highlight these comments upfront in the warning message.

I do have concerns about users being able to see all of the comments of theirs that had been flagged and deleted. I worry that this will lead to retaliation and further fights. We see this all the time in chat, where normal users can see what messages are being flagged. The flags themselves trigger angry accusations, counter-flags, etc. In many cases, people will be able to deduce (or assume) the person who flagged a comment, which I can see leading to further anger, targeted downvoting, etc.

Some of these comments are part of arguments, and seeing them be deleted would simply remind someone of the argument and cause them to carry it on. I've found quiet deletion to be very effective in shutting these down, like taking oxygen away from a fire.

There might be a better way to indicate this that doesn't require calling out specific cases, such as a system-provided "X number of your recent comments were flagged as rude or abusive" warning on your next comment or some other measure. Even with our manual warning for rudeness, we're currently discussing whether more clarity with these would lead to better results.

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    "I worry that this will lead to retaliation" against whom? The user only see that their comments where deleted, but wouldn't be able to know who started the action to retaliate against.
    – Braiam
    Commented Jul 22, 2018 at 15:47
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    I'm trying to imagine how this is moderated. Is there for mods an easy stat on a users profile telling them how many comments are red flagged? Or did the mod do as I did, went over their recent comments (hundreds of them) to get a picture of their commenting behavior and act based on what they found?
    – rene
    Commented Jul 22, 2018 at 15:56
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    "worry that this will lead to retaliation and further fights" -- this reminds me the start of the story about showing deleted posts. In 2011 Jeff said it would lead to unbelievable amounts of whining. In 2013 Shog said we run an experiment to see if it indeed breaks things. 5 years passed and sky didn't fall and things are well under control. Wonder if in this case we can just skip 2 years of indecision and proceed straight to the experiment
    – gnat
    Commented Jul 22, 2018 at 17:52
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    @rene - Moderators can see lists of a) all comments by a user (existing or deleted), b) all deleted comments for a user, and c) all flagged comments for a user (with approved / declined flag status and who flagged). When we receive a "too many deleted rude comments" system flag, it links directly into the latter. These lists provide a quick overview of recent and historical comments, but even if they are obviously troubling (obscenities, slurs, etc.) I always have to check the context around them to make sure this wasn't triggered by something worse and that I understand the whole story.
    – Brad Larson Mod
    Commented Jul 22, 2018 at 18:23
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    @Braiam - If one person leaves a comment critical of someone's answer or question, then later find that it was deleted in response to a flag, odds are they'll assume it was flagged by the poster. We see this time and again even with the current system where flags silently disappear, and I've seen quite a few cases where it led to serial downvoting or retaliatory flagging. Again, chat flags being visible are a great example of how people respond poorly to seeing that their content has been flagged, even when the flagger is hidden.
    – Brad Larson Mod
    Commented Jul 22, 2018 at 18:30
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    Maybe delete silently, then show the deletion and reason on the user's account 48 hours later? It would be nice to have this feature. Commented Jul 23, 2018 at 11:10
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    "There has been a bit of discussion among moderators lately about when we should expand upon that with the particular comments that we found to be problematic." My vote is always. If it is supposed to be a learning experience then we must know the content that prompted the warning.
    – TylerH
    Commented Jul 23, 2018 at 13:43
  • @BradLarson I presume that you would only show the text of the deleted comment, and nothing else.
    – Braiam
    Commented Jul 23, 2018 at 13:45
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    I agree with S List. @usr2564301 You might want to add this to your feature request. Or make another feature request, with this detail added to it.
    – anatolyg
    Commented Jul 23, 2018 at 14:25
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    I think what we're looking to avoid is Reddit's shadowban policy, where users are intentionally banned in a way that keeps them from knowing that they're banned. This arises from the belief that users creating undesirable content are unable to improve themselves and their content should be removed silently, with as little fuss as possible. Most users don't agree with the above policy, and I'd like to think the Stackoverflow mods don't either. Informing someone when their content is removed is a simple action that firmly enforces forces the belief that users can and want to improve.
    – Matthias
    Commented Jul 24, 2018 at 0:12
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    @TylerH Indeed, I'm a mod on another site and my team has been doing this regularly for quite a while, and it seems to work out pretty well. Of course, what works on another site doesn't necessarily work on Stack Overflow, but I think my mod team's experience suggests that it's worth considering. (My point is mainly to agree with you that the idea seems good and give an anecdote to back it up.)
    – David Z
    Commented Jul 24, 2018 at 3:33
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    @Matthias - It has always been the moderation philosophy of these sites that we should first attempt to correct behavior and give people a chance to redeem themselves before anything else. That's why we provide warnings of various kinds before escalating into anything more serious. Even account suspensions are timed. Shadowbans have been repeatedly discussed here and rejected every time. I believe in redemption, and have seen a number of people turn around bad behavior in response to a nudge.
    – Brad Larson Mod
    Commented Jul 24, 2018 at 14:18
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    I think the OP's point was that correcting ones behaviour is easier if one can actually review their own behaviour, outside of a vacuum and perhaps after-the-fact when folks are a little more objective. I think I can see the counter-arguments but on balance the feature request seems like a worthwhile thing to have. Certainly there are some old comments that I remove upon improbable and much later examination (e.g. randomly stumbling upon an old thread) - being able to see those that were already removed for me would aid in shall we say "personal development" in a similar way. Commented Jul 24, 2018 at 15:47

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