-24

So, I was looking at this perfectly logical Excel meta merge thread and I was struck by the fact that

  1. I agree with the idea of changing the tag
  2. I have sometimes had trouble classifying more complicated questions I have asked with only so many tags.
  3. The moderator in this question said, "I can just add extra tags until these questions can be properly classified."

If a moderator is saying that he can and should in special cases add extra tags, why not just allow for an arbitrary number of tags. The moderation, reputation, and editing systems together should keep things reasonable, but as various systems and the knowledge base here mature I find myself asking more complicated questions about the interactions of multiple systems. This leads to more tags and either more specific or more general experts required.

So maybe stuffing ten tags on something is reasonable, sometimes.

ED, four hours later:

This question is ridiculously unpopular, which is kinda funny. Fundamentally, the point of a tagging system is to organize data better, and the more valid labels you have for a specific question the more likely it will be useful later in saving everyone time on searching for, asking, and answering redundant questions. The entire tagging system could probably use a revamp wherein tags are tiered (IE: Databases -> RDBMS -> Oracle -> Oracle X.X -> Oracle X.X.XA -> specific libraries and problems) because technically, all those tags should apply, and it's a big fat B-tree. As it is, the tagging system is extremely lossy, and kinda hit-or-miss on finding things.

As a native speaker with a fantastically broad technical vocabulary, I can find what I want if it's out there, and ask questions just fine, but I've started to work with people in a foreign country and they find things significantly more difficult to both ask about and find answers for.

My two cents, I'll probably eventually close this dumb thing because it's costing me reputation somewhere.

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  • 10
    requiring lots of tags is a sign that your question is likely to be too broad. Jul 1, 2018 at 13:01
  • 1
    Ten tags is never reasonable, it selects entirely too many SO users that are not interested in the subject. Jul 1, 2018 at 13:07
  • Perhaps you're asking about something that is in the middle of several different fields of interest and types of problem. Jul 1, 2018 at 13:08
  • 3
    SO has 52,663 tags. They include the middle. Jul 1, 2018 at 13:10
  • @RobertLongson TBF: Also a sign of being too specialized implicitly. The question probably needs more details and specific research efforts mentioned. Jul 1, 2018 at 13:15
  • 1
    52,663 tags and only 5 apply to any given question? That's a fairly unlikely situation. Jul 1, 2018 at 13:30
  • 2
    Since you're supposed to isolate your problem somewhat before coming here, I'd be very surprised if you can't trim down all the tags that, while relevant to your code or end goal, don't relate to the actual problem you have
    – Patrice
    Jul 1, 2018 at 13:38
  • 1
    I don't think, despite what Shog9 says, that he can add an arbitrary number of tags (and I can't find on that question where he said that what you quote). I believe all tags combined need to fit in the posts.tags field, currently at length 250. And the other component that might choke on more tags is the tagengine. So there are not only functional but also technical reasons this might turn out to be more complex then just make it eight
    – rene
    Jul 1, 2018 at 14:48
  • I think this is what Shog9 means: stackoverflow.com/posts/20659616/revisions and here are some stats that might help to decide where the cut-off should be: data.stackexchange.com/stackoverflow/query/edit/869050#graph
    – rene
    Jul 1, 2018 at 15:29
  • 4
    @DylanBrams: "it's costing me reputation somewhere." No, it's not. Meta sites (except for MSE) do not give or remove reputation. Jul 1, 2018 at 15:34
  • @rene The source is in a comment here. But it's not an arbitrary number of tags; a question with 5 tags, one of which is excel-vba, would after the split have at most 6 tags -- the four other tags, and excel and vba.
    – Zev Spitz
    Jul 3, 2018 at 5:37
  • A net score of -24 is not ridiculously unpopular, it means that we mostly disagree with what you are saying, from your assessment of the situation to a perceived problem passing by your proposed "solution". If anything, you've explained your ideas well enough for us to know exactly that we don't agree with it, which is fairly ok. Jul 3, 2018 at 13:10
  • 1
    @rene Probably this one meta.stackoverflow.com/questions/322016/…
    – Braiam
    Sep 21, 2018 at 14:17

2 Answers 2

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Fundamentally, the point of a tagging system is to organize data better

Incorrect. The point of the tagging system is to better allow users with knowledge in a domain to find questions that they can answer. That's it.

Too many tags on a question is usually indicative of at least one of the following:

  1. A question which is too broad.

  2. There are a number of tags which are too narrow to have significant domain experts who routinely patrol them.

The is a classic example of the latter. Yes, it's possible to be a "domain expert" in printf-based formatting. But people with such domain expertise are probably going to be patroling the tags often used with printf: C, C++, etc.

5
  • Not incorrect. Tagging is useful both for finding questions you can answer AND finding pre-existing answers that may apply to your question. Jul 1, 2018 at 15:32
  • 1
    @DylanBrams: "finding pre-existing answers that may apply to your question" How will a tag work better than Google or even SO's search function? Or the SO "related question" list? We have much better tools to find things that "may apply to your question" than tags. Jul 1, 2018 at 15:33
  • If you have a specific enough question and enough domain knowledge, yes, but if your question is not specific enough (yet) tags could be useful in the search process. I have spent many hours digging for answers to only find that my terminology was slightly incorrect, and that there were already many answers to my question using different language. Jul 1, 2018 at 15:35
  • 1
    @DylanBrams: That's what Google is for. Besides, how would a tag (whose name is based on terminology) improve matters when you don't know the right term for something? Jul 1, 2018 at 15:37
  • With access to more (or ordered) tags, you could apply (and search for) them in increasing order of relevance / breadth. As it is, a few months ago I had a question about Pivot / Crosstab and Map-Reduce as applied across a couple systems. Because I didn't know exact language or how to address the problem using a specific DBMS, I ended up flailing a lot, and needed the help of a very specific type of expert. I believe better tagging would help me cross disciplines. Jul 1, 2018 at 15:46
5

First off, a small clarification: yes, I can flaunt the limit on 5 tags/question in certain circumstances if need-be... But this isn't an ability normally available to moderators, nor is it something I'd do just for the hell of it; it's a capability that comes in handy in very specific situations involving multi-stage bulk modifications to tags across thousands of questions, where information would likely be lost otherwise (or, I'd have to track that information externally until the process was complete, which is effectively the same thing as far as any 3rd-party observer is concerned).

As rene mentions, there's a hard limit on the total length of a question's tags as represented by a string: 250 characters. Since that includes the separator character (|), this means even if we went with single-character tags there couldn't be more than 124 tags on a question before the system would break. We could, with some non-trivial effort, increase the length of that field... But long before that we run into a different problem:

The UI just isn't built for excessive numbers of tags

Tag names can be up to 35 characters long now. Even with only 5 tags, that quickly becomes a mess if multiple tag names grow very long. Rendering these below questions chews up valuable room on the page, pushing answers further down; rendering them in search results makes for tedious and hard-to-read results.

Worse... Very few people use tags correctly even with the current limits. The sweet spot is probably around 3 tags per question: platform, language, library. Maybe a specific API. Version tags tend to work very poorly in general, but getting folks to use them properly is all but impossible; if the folks asking questions knew how to look up which version of their software was relevant to the API they were working with, most of these questions wouldn't need to be asked in the first place.

The now-defunct Documentation project had a much more elegant solution: you could mark up a post or even specific parts of a post with one or more versions, thus allowing information to be correctly categorized by the folks best suited to do the categorization. If we're ever going to solve this problem for Q&A, it'll likely have to come in the form of a similar solution, not by an explosion of tags.

1
  • "there's a hard limit on the total length of a question's tags as represented by a string: 250 characters" Tell me the truth. You like to have blood sacrifices to get stats about tags.
    – Braiam
    Sep 21, 2018 at 14:01

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