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This is the post in question. It accumulated four downvotes in an hour.

The post

The way I perceive the post, it conforms to the rules of the site

  • Clearly on-topic
  • Well-posed
  • Shows effort through experimentation and correctly questions the results

Questioning the result is of particular importance, it is the primary deterrent against cargo cults.

As a high school student, the OP understandably has limited experience. With that in mind, requiring OP to know where and how to do all possible research is unreasonable.

The problem

However, the obvious problem here is the question is undeniably basic.

This is once again a debate on whether we support such questions.

On the one hand, from the point of view of experts, most questions about a language is basic. I suspect it being the reason why these experts don't ask many questions: they know they can get to an answer themselves, it's called "research". But there are only a handful of such experts, can we not ask a question for fear of it being "basic"?

On the other hand, votes are indicative of usefulness. We vote based on the usefulness of a post. Since the post is deemed too basic, it got downvoted.

Do we support such questions? At what point do we decide the question worthy of support? I find the line hard to draw.

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    The downvotes may also be caused by the title beginning with C and C++. I'm not familiar with those tags, but from the discussions I've seen on meta, that's a sure way to quickly accumulate downvotes.
    – Erik A
    May 31, 2018 at 9:11
  • @ErikvonAsmuth The tag got edited out 8 minutes after the post. I'm not there right at the beginning so I don't know.
    – Passer By
    May 31, 2018 at 9:11
  • In case someone wonders, I immediately found a new question that might be deemed basic or difficult depending on your experience with C++. It is well-received.
    – Passer By
    May 31, 2018 at 9:18
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    It is being supported, it got two answers. Even got 3 helpful votes. Whether the answerers actually did him a favor is questionable, somebody ought to write a manual that explains how C strings work. Which of course is the sticking point, such manuals have already been written and neither belong nor fit in an SO post. He would be much, much better off with a link to such a manual. We are not allowed to provide him with one, could fit in a comment. May 31, 2018 at 9:28
  • @HansPassant "It is being supported", but what do I do? If we decide this shouldn't be supported, I should downvote. If it should be supported, then I'd think either it be closed as duplicate as some canonical or answered, but not downvoted. I should even upvote since I think the question well-written.
    – Passer By
    May 31, 2018 at 9:37
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    You'll have to decide for yourself. There is no "we", the vast majority of SO users have interest in neither the tags nor that question. Since you objected against it getting downvoted, I suppose it is logical to upvote it. Or do nothing, that's fine as well, like I did. May 31, 2018 at 9:52
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    I immediately found a new question that might be deemed basic or difficult depending on your experience with C++. --> This is not a fair analogy, whether a question is too basic is objective. Asking about return type deduction and std::option already demonstrates that the asker has reasonable experience of the language to encounter this kind of problem, it's essentially different from someone not understanding how char * works.
    – llllllllll
    May 31, 2018 at 10:07
  • @liliscent I missed the "essentially different" part. I don't see a categorical difference between the two. You drew a line somewhere saying one is basic and the other isn't.
    – Passer By
    May 31, 2018 at 14:59
  • @HansPassant I did nothing. I want to vote on merit for the site. Obviously I learnt nothing from the question, neither am I interested in its answers. I'm asking if I should be encouraging these kinds of questions. Or perhaps I misunderstood and voting is just indication for personal interest.
    – Passer By
    May 31, 2018 at 15:17
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    @PasserBy There is a categorical difference between these 2 cases. It's not uncommon that a real C++ programmer not understanding the mechanism of type deduction or latest C++ version, it doesn't matter much in practice. But anyone having read the first 20 pages of a beginner textbook should understand how char* works.
    – llllllllll
    May 31, 2018 at 15:21
  • @liliscent I could argue std::string is the one that should be understood, char* is an implementation detail. I could argue anyone should know how to write a trailing return type for a lambda, it's introduced in C++11 so it's 7 years now. How can you say with such certainty it is objectively basic or not?
    – Passer By
    May 31, 2018 at 15:28
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    @PasserBy A string class without the concept of encoding is close to useless, char* is at the root of both C and C++, why do you think the later is an implementation detail ? When I said too basic, I meant it's essentially asking us to write a tutorial/textbook, which is already stated in the answer below.
    – llllllllll
    May 31, 2018 at 15:45
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    Here's a great general approach: downvote posts that are bad (i.e., don't conform to expectations/standards), and simply ignore (no vote) questions you find basic or not useful for the greater programming community. [and of course, actually take the time to upvote good questions that are useful!! :)] May 31, 2018 at 17:00
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    @theforestecologist That's specifically contrary to the help center and the site's general rules on how votes are expected to be used. To quote the vote's tooltip, for example, "This question does not show any research effort; it is unclear or not useful (click again to undo)" You are expected to downvote posts that do not demonstrate research effort or that are not useful questions. Those are a part of the standards that are expected of questions on the site.
    – Servy
    May 31, 2018 at 18:30
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    @Servy like I said, yes, you should definitely downvote posts that don't meet SO standards (e.g., don't show research effort, don't include reproducible code, etc.). However, downvoting well-written (and rule-conforming) posts because you find them simple isn't a great approach given that all different levels of expertise come here seeking guidance. Just because you think a post is simple, doesn't mean that others won't potentially find it interesting/useful. SO is for all programmers. Instead of downvoting, provide a quick comment, link to helpful post, close as dupe, or just move on. May 31, 2018 at 18:44

2 Answers 2

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Call me old and grumpy, but questions like this read to me like "I want to learn about a language but I don't want to invest the 10-20 hours it costs to read a book explaining its fundamentals". Or even read the chapter about strings, which might cost like a tenth of that.

Yes, of course asking a question on Stack Overflow is quicker than that. You'll get an answer in mere minutes. It clarifies one small aspect of the language, just for you.

But wait.

Does the question show research effort? And not only in the sense of carefully analyzing and debugging their code, but also resorting to, say, existing materials?

If I type "how does C know" into Google, the first thing that's suggested to me is "when a string ends". There's the answer: How does C know the end of my string?. In there it's all about strlen(), null-terminated strings and whatnot.

Their question shows nothing of that, hence a lack of research, hence downvotable.

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    By all means, be grumpy. Reading books used to be "normal", everyone knew that to gain knowledge you went to school and read books and so you just did. Good times. It also used to be normal to eat home cooked meals every day. Good times, healthier times. Now move on to the 21st century: there are chains of cheap fast food restaurants all over the world and the magic "ask question" button. Can we blame people for flocking to these low effort means to an end? Not really but that doesn't mean I have to be happy about it as lowering IQs and growing guts are the fruits of our progress :/
    – Gimby
    May 31, 2018 at 13:53
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    @Gimby SO gets a few thousand questions a day. If even 1% of people learning programming were asking on SO every time they wanted to learn how to find the end of a C string or other such questions for the first time, that number would be an order of magnitude higher. Asking questions like that on SO is not the norm, it's just that even having .01% of new developers doing that is still enough to cause major problems for the site. Even if books are much less common, most people are still searching, looking at digital tutorials, or other resources designed for teaching newcomers.
    – Servy
    May 31, 2018 at 14:04
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    To be clear to others, downvoting questions because of their lack of research is a separate thing from voting to close them. Rudimentary, low-research questions may be downvote-worthy, but that does not make them off-topic. IMHO it would be good to clarify this in the answer lest people start using this as a justification to close-vote on-topic questions just because they are basic (which is not a valid close reason).
    – TylerH
    May 31, 2018 at 16:25
  • @TylerH And rudimentary questions almost inevitably have a duplicate anyway, so should be closed as well as downvoted.
    – DavidG
    May 31, 2018 at 16:33
  • @Gimby The past always seems better. relevant xkcd
    – Chris
    May 31, 2018 at 16:39
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    @DavidG If and only if a question is a duplicate should it be closed as such.
    – TylerH
    May 31, 2018 at 16:53
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In my own very personal opinion, stackoverflow tend to be an expert place.

Rudimentary questions, as you state them, are downvoted because of that.

In my experience, this is even more the case in advanced/broad tags, such as c/c++.

I feel bad with that because well, stackoverflow is a q&a website.

If you think not knowing strlen or the basics of C strings shows a lack of research, someone else could be legitimate to downvote your question about registry allocation, because in the end, it’s a few clicks ahead in google scholar.

You are always the rookie of someone else.

As of these questions, I would say that really often, they are closed as duplicates.

When they are not, expert or not, it’s our duty to aknowledge the OP’s lack of experience and give him a useful answer, no matter the difficulty.

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  • What did I just say? Immediate downvote May 31, 2018 at 17:20
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    Basics questions are not downvoted because they're basic. They're often poorly researched, and they're downvoted because of that.
    – mason
    May 31, 2018 at 17:20
  • Read my answer not just one line May 31, 2018 at 17:21
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    I read your entire answer before I downvoted.
    – mason
    May 31, 2018 at 17:21
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    Have a look at JavaScript tag. You’ll see millions of useless questions which are kindly answered. In c++ if you don’t ask something about an UB or ambiguity in the standard you get immediate downvotes. May 31, 2018 at 17:26
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    So what? If a question is poorly researched, it should be downvoted. Regardless of technology stack. I don't see what your answer adds to this discussion. Are you saying it's okay to ask questions without doing proper research?
    – mason
    May 31, 2018 at 17:27
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    @RegisPortalez Watch the js tag for a little while. You'll see TONS of useless questions downvoted and closed. If you only look at older questions or questions that exist right now, you won't see the ones that were deleted nor will you see the current useless ones deleted. You're only looking at a snapshot.
    – Kevin B
    May 31, 2018 at 18:58
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    "Have a look at JavaScript tag. You’ll see millions of useless questions which are kindly answered." Right, which is why the javascript tag is a cesspool of the same questions answered over and over again and a ton of gold badgers unwilling to mark them as duplicates. Jun 2, 2018 at 18:51

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