54

I recently came across this (now deleted) question which to me seemed like a I haven't tried anything, can you please do my job? question. Therefore, I added a comment with more or less the standard copy-paste text I use for reviewing.

As you can see in the picture, OP was not exactly too happy about my response:

Enter image description here

Now I'm not trying to drag them or anything (I don't mean to discuss their - now deleted - rude comment), it's just that in the recent debate of Stack Overflow being unwelcoming and rude, the sentence

this entire site is discouraging to newcomers

made me think if I have actually done something wrong.

English is not my first language, so my comment might unintentionally sound rude.

Should I edit my standard answer for those cases and make it more friendly, and if so, what phrases, etc. do you recommend?

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  • 55
    Just flag the comments and get on with your day... Some people are just rude, and if they keep it up, they get suspended.
    – Erik A
    Commented May 24, 2018 at 17:49
  • 5
    I had a similar comment pre-set but I have removed the "code writing service" part of it recently...it can come across as *abrupt"
    – Paulie_D
    Commented May 24, 2018 at 17:51
  • 8
    He forgot ".... and the horse you came in on" Commented May 24, 2018 at 17:51
  • 3
    And of course: "don't let the door hit your horse's bum on the way out..."
    – halfer
    Commented May 24, 2018 at 17:51
  • 5
    I don't think this is much to do with the latest Be Nice thing - there have always been people who don't "get" Stack Overflow. Flag and forget.
    – halfer
    Commented May 24, 2018 at 17:52
  • 19
    I do find the "not a code writing service" canned comment a little bit harsh most of the time. It appears under "too broad" questions but those questions are generally just bad because the askers don't know how the site works; not because they want full working code. If you ask them I believe most would be happy with just pointers. That's why accusing them asking for free work might hit a nerve. This doesn't justify their rude behaviour though.
    – user2285236
    Commented May 24, 2018 at 17:53
  • 7
    Note that I sometimes post: "This isn't a "please do my work for me" site, which I'm sure wasn't your intention or even a "please point me in the right direction" site, but rather it's a question and answer repository, and part of your problem may be that you are misinterpreting how to use this site and how to best ask questions. Please go through the help center and the How to Ask to learn site best practices." I am hopeful that the "not your intention" softens any perceived irritation. Commented May 24, 2018 at 17:55
  • 6
    @Thomas your wording was... ok. It definitely wasnt great and did not 'coddle' the OP's feeling. On top of that, a lot of new users join stack with the pre defined mindset we are unwelcoming. So the slightest hint of offense is magnified. If you come to Stack expecting to be insulted or ridiculed..... you will for sure react strongly to an innocent comment that isn't worded with extra fluff
    – Patrice
    Commented May 24, 2018 at 18:08
  • 9
    @Thomas sorry if I didn't make it clear: you did nothing wrong here. You didnt put as much fluff as is necessary to defuse something like this... but the argument should be made that you didn't say anything to trigger such a reaction either. We can of course make strides to be more welcoming, and asking for and listening to feedback (like you did here) is a great way to do so. Some OPs will react like this one did to anything that isnt "here is your copypasta answer"... and no amount of wording change will prevent these from blowing up
    – Patrice
    Commented May 24, 2018 at 18:14
  • 4
    And to me it's also not rude if I may be honest. It's not the nicest possible comment to say what you said, but there is nothing rude in it. It is a curt and to the point message. But not rude
    – Patrice
    Commented May 24, 2018 at 18:16
  • 4
    @ThomasFlinkow The only thing you did wrong here is to let your battery get so low. Go charge it.
    – Mysticial
    Commented May 24, 2018 at 18:44
  • 6
    I don't take issue with the question, but I'm saddened when people think they've done something wrong when all they've done is post a perfectly reasonable comment explaining why the question isn't a good fit for the site. Like Erik said, flag and move on. You've done nothing wrong.
    – pushkin
    Commented May 24, 2018 at 20:43
  • 37
    For the record: the user account in question has been deleted by a moderator earlier today, for their persistent and uncalled for rudeness. They had posted all of two questions, and in both cases they chewed out anyone that dared come near their post. At no point was anyone rude to the user. There was nothing you did that provoked them, they brought along their own rudeness.
    – Martijn Pieters Mod
    Commented May 24, 2018 at 20:53
  • 2
    This is a typical "Hater gonna hate" situation. Flag it, move on.Nothing good comes from arguing with people who do not want to adhere to our rules/Standards.
    – Polygnome
    Commented May 26, 2018 at 8:25
  • 4
    Whenever someone starts their sentence with "fuck you", you should know that you don't need to take the rest of their writing too serious. Flag it, vote down, vote to close, move on
    – baao
    Commented May 26, 2018 at 8:26

8 Answers 8

-42

First off, the other person there was completely and 100% in the wrong with what they said. There is no justifying that, and we have been assured that they have been dealt with as such.


Now on the topic of your "stock" comment:

Stack Overflow is not a code writing service

Stack Overflow is a code writing service, among other things. We write code for people, we also explain concepts and debug problems. We do a lot of different things.

There are certain subjective limits to how much code we will write for people, or how much explanation we think is necessary for the asker to understand the answer they are to receive; but I regret to inform you that Stack Overflow is in fact a code writing service.

You are expected to write code yourself

Well, to a degree. You are expected to be able to write and understand code to the extent that is necessary to understand the answers you may receive, but this is really subjective and the bar is low.

That said, while debugging style questions are expected to contain an MCVE reproducing the issue (as well as a few other key ingredients), how-to questions do not have the same requirements. How-to questions need to be well-defined and reasonably scoped (i.e. general enough to be useful to future readers, while not being overly specific to the point that no one else will ever have the exact same conditions, or overly broad).

The problem with this question is that it was just too broad. We need the asker to limit their query to a reasonable scope, which requires them to break down their problem into smaller chunks and solve each chunk separately. Including code in this question would probably not have helped at all.

In summary: how-to questions are not inherently off-topic, and only debugging questions explicitly require code.


See also: What's better: a question with no attempt or with an unfixable/irrelevant attempt?

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  • 4
    The editor stated that SO not being a "code writing service" indicates that the user is expected to write most of their code (even if erroneous), and not simply ask a coding question and let others code to answer. Commented May 24, 2018 at 18:01
  • Thank you very much for your feedback. I do realize that my comment was not written very well. I will think of another phrasing. I will accept your answer as soon as SO will let me. Commented May 24, 2018 at 18:03
  • 48
    I disagree with your premise. Yes, answers often have code in them, but we are primarily a question and answer repository. Code-only answers for example are frowned upon, but text-only answers are not. If code is present in an answer, it should serve to help better explain and perhaps demonstrate the answer, and occasionally it may serve as a copy-paste-solution for the OP, but there is certainly no requirement for this, nor even any inducement for this. Commented May 24, 2018 at 18:04
  • 9
    @Mulliganaceous and that is completely erroneous. How-to questions do not require code, and are not inherently off-topic. Suggesting that they are is to suggest that we only accept debugging style questions, which often have very little use to future readers, and often are not very interesting to read or answer.
    – user4639281
    Commented May 24, 2018 at 18:07
  • 6
    @HovercraftFullOfEels Yeah, I wouldn't say that SO "is" a code-writing service. I'd rather say that we are a code-writing service to the same extent that we are a debugging service; neither quite hits the mark, but there will be questions whose essence is "write me some code to do X" and questions whose essence is "debug this code I wrote", and the fact that a question matches one of those formats does not make it off-topic. As such, pattern-matching that a question matches the "write me some code" format and demanding that it be turned into a debugging question is unhelpful.
    – Mark Amery
    Commented May 24, 2018 at 18:07
  • 11
    @HovercraftFullOfEels "Stack Overflow is a code writing service" is a provocative way of making the point being presented here; however, once we look beyond that, I believe Tiny Giant is fundamentally right.
    – duplode
    Commented May 24, 2018 at 18:09
  • 32
    @ThomasFlinkow - The other person was clearly the one in the wrong here (and they have been dealt with as such). That said, comments stating that Stack Overflow is not a code writing service are often flagged as being rude or abusive and they do have a tendency to start fights in comments. As a result, I tend to find different ways of phrasing this, usually targeted at the specific problems with the question asked. In this case, it was that they needed to narrow this down to a specific aspect of the problem, so I might have asked them to refine what exactly they were looking for.
    – Brad Larson Mod
    Commented May 24, 2018 at 18:10
  • 5
    I still disagree. Looking back at my own and other folks answers, the ones that I think are the best have been much more didactic with more detailed explanation and less code. Commented May 24, 2018 at 18:10
  • @BradLarson thank you for clarifying that. I will refrain from using copy-paste comment templates or at least change it to something less (perceived as) rude. Commented May 24, 2018 at 18:11
  • 5
    FWIW, the seemingly tiny change of comma placement in Revision 2 here changes my reaction to this answer from "I'm pretty sure I know what you're really trying to say, and would agree with it if you'd said it right, but as you've worded it I technically disagree with this answer" to "I am in 100% agreement with what you've written here". +1.
    – Mark Amery
    Commented May 24, 2018 at 18:12
  • 6
    @Thomas Forgive me for not mentioning earlier that the other person was clearly and unequivocally wrong in how they responded to your comment. There is no justification for such behavior.
    – user4639281
    Commented May 24, 2018 at 18:19
  • @TinyGiant no problem - I understood and liked your answer from the beginning (that's why I accepted it so soon). I agree with your points, and I didn't want to say that StackOverflow isn't about writing code at all. The comment was poorly phrased. I wanted to express that StackOverflow isn't for "I have not tried anything, please write code for me" type of questions. Commented May 24, 2018 at 18:21
  • 5
    I'm glad this is the accepted answer, despite the inexplicably low score. It is 100% correct.
    – TylerH
    Commented May 27, 2018 at 14:28
  • 3
    [...] but this is really subjective and the bar is low. No, it's not. The "bar" is really high and that's the most important foundation of this community. It always works both sides - If You won't respect other people and their time, which they offer here for free, You will never be respected here.
    – Skipper
    Commented May 27, 2018 at 14:34
  • 3
    @Skipper I'm sorry but that's just wrong. There are bars that are high here, but that is not one of them. We do not expect our askers to be geniuses or experts, nor would that make any sense. We expect our askers to be professional or enthusiast programmers, i.e. they have enough of an understanding to be reasonably able to grasp the answers they are to receive. I don't understand how you think I'm disrespecting other people or their time here, or why you figure that I will never be respected but that seems unnecessarily rude to me.
    – user4639281
    Commented May 27, 2018 at 15:52
33

The user simply took exception to your comment. It could be argued that they were baited in to a response because you had made that comment, but that's a lukewarm argument at best.

In scenarios like this, I find it simplest to VTC and move on with my life. I have personally stopped engaging in comments in questions which I know should be closed, and simply taken the necessary actions to close it instead.

Since the user decided to make such inflammatory comments, those should definitely be flagged. This will help them understand that we don't speak like this in a professional capacity.

3
  • Thank you for your answer. I also don't care about the comments that much either, I was just confused on whether I had done something wrong. Never before has someone reacted to a comment of mine in that way. Commented May 24, 2018 at 17:59
  • 9
    @Thomas Flinkow you didn't do anything wrong. The asker did something wrong, and red flags are an eventually bannable offense. Commented May 24, 2018 at 17:59
  • 10
    @Mulliganaceous I doubt it wil lget that far. The OP will either leave SO forever, or just open another account for next week's works request. Commented May 24, 2018 at 19:13
23

I think that the bulk of your comment was pretty welcoming and doesn't need much help but if you're looking for a way to improve it, I think it can definitely be done.

When I write comments for users (obviously not here on SO), I try to focus on what they can do rather than what they shouldn't do. You get to that, eventually, which is really great, but you start out by calling the OP out and (perhaps passively) accusing them of asking the site to write code for them.

StackOverflow is not a code writing service. You are expected to write the code yourself.

I can understand what you're getting at but you've used up some of your limited characters telling them something that's not helping them fix their problem. What these words mean to you may not be the same as what they mean to others and they sound pretty harsh to me. To use an absurd example:

Couple walks into a Mexican restaurant, sits down, peruses the menu.

Waiter: Welcome, may I take your order?
Husband: I'm not really seeing anything on your menu I like, do you have sushi?
Waiter: We are not a sushi restaurant; you have to pick something off the menu.

This is true... and it's pretty silly for the Husband to have even asked for sushi at all... but it's not really service-oriented or welcoming. Now, we aren't paid to be here... we're just helping out the people who need help but that doesn't mean we can't make a small amount of effort to follow the best practices of the service industry... so, instead, he might say:

Waiter: Well, we have ceviche, which has some similar elements. This is where you can find the description on the menu but that's the closest we can manage. Let me know if you have any questions.

So, here he's letting them know an option that is possible and that it's similar to what they're asking, giving them access to the information to learn about what that is while clarifying that it's the only option and then opening it up for additional assistance if needed.

So, in a comment situation, if there's something specific you can suggest that will improve their question, make that suggestion. Link to the MVCE post so that they don't have to find it themselves... but don't get link-happy and post 2-3 comments with a dozen links in them, either. It's better to help them in stages than to overwhelm them with information they'll have trouble absorbing.

Start with a greeting. I know it's dumb and silly looking but it can mean a lot and take a lot of the edge off and, while not OK in posts, is fine in comments. With users who are clearly posting their first or near first question, I try to say "Welcome" to them, or "Welcome to [sitename]". Heck, if you're using the AutoComments script, it does it for you.

Speaking of AutoComments... if you're using them, great... but I've found, over time, that while they're a good repository for helpful links, if you don't edit the comment to make it specific to the needs of the post you're commenting on, it's not going to be as helpful as it could be. So, use the AutoComments but also don't hesitate to tailor them to the post you're commenting on.


It's unlikely that you'll be able to make everyone feel welcome but there are always rough edges to grind off that will increase the likelihood of them feeling welcome. Yes, all of this takes more effort. I'm sorry about that... but once you've done it a few times, it really does become much easier and eventually it becomes sort of second-nature. Well, that's what seven years in retail did for me, anyway.


‡ - OK, so on SO it might be more like "I haven't read the menu yet but, do you have sushi?"

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  • Thank you very much for your effort to write such a long and detailed answer. It's a good starting point for me to overthink my comments. Commented May 24, 2018 at 18:36
  • 2
    Sure :D Glad to help.
    – Catija
    Commented May 24, 2018 at 18:41
  • 3
    Great, now I have to order Sushi ... please use non-edible examples next time....
    – rene
    Commented May 24, 2018 at 18:49
  • 2
    And now I'm hungry... Good thing the supermarket on the way home has sushi rolls to go.
    – Davy M
    Commented May 24, 2018 at 23:16
  • 2
    I was forced to drive 11km to get food:( Commented May 25, 2018 at 8:11
  • 4
    I generally agree with what you're saying. However, "Welcome to [sitename]" can come across as sarcastic, especially if it's followed by a "Don't do this" message. Especially since that blog post I try to frame my comments in the form of "Please do [this] to make it possible / easier for us to help you".
    – PM 2Ring
    Commented May 26, 2018 at 8:03
  • 3
    This is a thoughtful and well stepped appraisal and solution.
    – user3956566
    Commented May 26, 2018 at 9:54
  • 2
    @PM2Ring ah yes. I see what you mean and yes, the exclamation that comes with the script is not helpful. Welcome! Bla bla bla.. it's a tad evangelical
    – user3956566
    Commented May 26, 2018 at 10:06
  • 1
    With a lot of questions, it's a bit more like the person showed up at the Mexican restaurant and said, "Give me some sushi! It must be unagi and maguro sushi. I don't know what either of those are, so make sure you include a detailed write-up on what they are, along with the food. Oh, and I'll write you up on Yelp (reddit) if you give me anything other than the sushi I asked for." Commented May 26, 2018 at 17:11
  • 1
    This is a wonderful answer! It does take effort to be more welcoming but it feels better in the long run. Also responding in a considerate manner usually makes the other people be more nicer to you.
    – devsaw
    Commented May 27, 2018 at 7:11
  • The service industry issues performative niceities because there is a quid pro quo involved: they are nice, and tolerate unreasonableness, because you are paying. The quid pro quo in a community setting is that everyone plays by the rules (and newcomers are expected to learn them) and people put some effort in for reciprocity.
    – James
    Commented Oct 30, 2019 at 14:31
19

If your goal is avoiding confrontations while still providing guidance, I, like others here, suggest dropping the "Stack Overflow is not a coding service" opening gambit, as it might be taken by the OP as an accusation of laziness. My general advice would be focusing as sharply as possible on how the problem with the question might be rectified. Here is one speculative take:

Answering this question as it currently stands ("How to do this, up to and including commands") would require covering too much ground, which makes it not a good fit for the format of the site. I suggest doing some more preliminary research focusing on libraries that handle .xlsx files, and then coming back here if you have specific questions about how to use them.

As helpful as tone tweaks might be, there is of course no guarantee that an OP who thinks it is appropriate to tell you to foxtrot oscar will react constructively to such a comment. If a virulent reaction does happen, just remind yourself not to get entangled in an unproductive argument: flag and move on.

3
  • Thank you very much for your answer , and thank you for providing me with a nice starting point for further answers. That's exactly what I needed, sounds much nicer and is more to the point than my copy-paste thingy. Commented May 24, 2018 at 18:27
  • 2
    @ThomasFlinkow You're welcome. Personally, I dislike copy-paste comments in general, though I understand the point of view of those who consider them an useful compromise while powering through the review queues.
    – duplode
    Commented May 24, 2018 at 18:31
  • 2
    Yep there will always be the foxtrotting oscars, but we need to work together as a community to not react to these comments.
    – user3956566
    Commented May 26, 2018 at 9:56
6

Regardless of the situation, no one should be rude to you like that. This just shows the lack of professionalism we have to deal with in questions that ask us to do all the work.

For questions which don't exactly fit a close reason, but are clearly just "do my work for me" posts, just down vote, and move on. Seriously, there is no reason to try to close these if they don't fit a reason, roomba will get them.

A canned comment helps no one. It certainly didn't help the OP, which in theory was the intent of the comment. Instead it enraged them, because it made you a target. Canned comments are meta comments, and we have a whole site for that right here. If the user wants to know why their post was downvoted or closed, let them ask at meta.

If you are going to write a comment, then take the time to personalize it to the post, and if it still comes out as "we aren't a code writing service", then just move on. There is a reason why "What have you tried?", "idownvotedyoubecause", and What Stack Overflow Is Not are deleted.

5
  • 5
    specially true for aggressive canned comments like the "not a coding service". There are nice canned comments too and it's okay to use them Commented May 26, 2018 at 9:08
  • Nice Canned Comments® available here: meta.stackoverflow.com/a/371823/3345375
    – jkdev
    Commented Aug 8, 2018 at 9:37
  • 2
    @jkdev - Those comments may be polite, but they aren't really helpful. Canned comments are a waste of time because they show an utter lack of interest from the person using them. For example, your first example of "Would you be able to post the code that you have tried so far?" is polite, however, it doesn't really address the fact that we need specific code, not all the code they tried. We need to get a minimal amount of code in order to reproduce behavior. It helps to explicitly lay out which behavior the code needs to be shown for.
    – Travis J
    Commented Aug 8, 2018 at 18:26
  • @TravisJ You're right that this proposal could be improved. (I posted some not-production-ready examples just to illustrate the concept of Nice Canned Comments®.) For example, "Please provide an MCVE" is more precise than "Please show your code." Comments that are customized per question would be even more helpful. My point is that we can craft a set of Nice comments to be generic, yet effective -- working well in most scenarios. They'd be especially useful in review queues; I've found that users often respond to generically phrased Nice comments by editing their post so that it's answerable.
    – jkdev
    Commented Aug 9, 2018 at 7:48
  • We are just going to have to agree to disagree on the "effective" aspect of canned comments.
    – Travis J
    Commented Aug 9, 2018 at 9:25
5

Generally speaking, there is one aspect you should consider: In different cultures there are different opinions on what is rude and what not. One should always keep in mind that SO has a worldwide scope and as such attracts users from all kinds of cultures. When you are used to work in a culturally rather homogeneous workplace this is easy to forget.

From your profile I gather that you come from Germany. Germans have a rather straightforward (almost blunt) style of communication. From that perspective you have said something that holds some truth and you didn't insult the other person along the way. In Germany, the other person might openly disagree with you, but most likely would not take offense.

However, some (especially Asian) cultures are different. Simply saying "no" to a request can be considered rude (that's why you should be careful with the reply "yes" there, which can mean nothing more than "I've heard what you have said"). In this cultural context your reply can be seen as rude or even insulting.

On an international page like SO it is a good idea to find a middle ground that most people can live with after a little adjustment. Maybe you use a slightly less blunt wording next time and the reader should read your comment with a positive attitude.

Talking about attitude...

In your specific case, what the OP of that particular question replied to you is an insult in any culture I know (and much ruder than your reply). I believe you shouldn't be dealing out harder punches than you can take yourself. In this light I'd say that this particular fella seems to have an attitude problem.

1
  • very nice point I haven't even really thought about. I will refrain from that blunt wording next time. Commented May 27, 2018 at 15:10
2

I'm sharing my views on this event, split into two parts.

Putting the conclusion in the first place, you've done nothing wrong, but it could be improved.

1. Stack Overflow is, undeniably, a bit too unfriendly, or harsh, to new users

This has been discussed many times. One of the highest scored questions about this is The rudeness on Stack Overflow is too damn high . Other answers have already made it quite clear, so I think there's little need for me to elaborate on this.

2. Some (new) users are just plain egoism/arrogant etc., and gets annoyed by (or even without) minimum insult/offense

A few days ago I saw a question about an implemention-defined bahavior in C++ (now closed & deleted). The question itself was hard to say to be asked in a courteous manner.

What I did was leaving a close vote before moving on. There's little to no value in investigating further into that question, nor arguing with the excited user. Anyway, Stack Overflow is a place to give answers and Happy Working/Studying. Don't get yourself depressed or annoyed by furious users that have always been hanging around and ranting.

0
-13

People are usually here because they can't figure out the answer anywhere else, and are therefore quite desperate. I know, because I'm that person sometimes. There's no need to be rude, but I've had responses that suggest I'm lazy before, and it's incredibly disheartening. I try really hard to work things out, but the simple truth is that I'm just not as good at this as a lot of you guys - and I'm sure I'm not alone there! There's absolutely no need to be rude though!!

13
  • 4
    This can use some examples because I don't think I'm rude but based on feedback I get now and then I conclude I am. Please teach me how delicate I need to be and how I need to rephrase so I get an interesting question to answer and you don't feel harassed.
    – rene
    Commented May 26, 2018 at 9:12
  • 6
    A question needs to show some evidence that the OP has tried to solve their problem. Without such evidence it's natural to assume that the OP hasn't made an effort, especially if the question looks like a homework assignment.
    – PM 2Ring
    Commented May 26, 2018 at 9:51
  • 2
    @PM2Ring there's still no need to be rude. If there's two ways to say the same thing, one is rude, one is kind, always pick kind. It doesn't mean the message has changed, just the attitude behind it.
    – user3956566
    Commented May 26, 2018 at 9:57
  • 1
    @YvetteColomb I most certainly agree! As I just said here positive comments are better all 'round than negative ones. I don't claim to be a saint in this respect, but FWIW it's not uncommon that I receive a thankyou comment from the OP when I dupe-hammer their question and leave a suggestion to help them use the info at the dupe target, so I figure I must be doing something right. ;)
    – PM 2Ring
    Commented May 26, 2018 at 10:03
  • 2
    @PM2Ring Look I've made way more than my fair share of mistakes.. none of us are perfect and it's normal to feel impatient at times, as there's a lot of unanswerable questions on the site and it's frustrating. I'm hoping as a community we can learn to be supportive, and inclusive, without feeling that we're under fire.
    – user3956566
    Commented May 26, 2018 at 10:05
  • @PM2Ring that's a nice thought but actually there is no requirement to show that you've tried to solve the problem. The requirement is that the question is on-topic, reasonably scoped, and not a duplicate; everything else is irrelevant noise.
    – user4639281
    Commented May 27, 2018 at 16:33
  • 1
    @TinyGiant Agreed, and I'm happy to answer questions that haven't exhibited such evidence if I feel the asker is sincere. OTOH, if it looks like a blatant homework dump, or other form of "gimmetehcodez" then I think it's appropriate for the OP to show some effort before people start writing code for them.
    – PM 2Ring
    Commented May 27, 2018 at 16:39
  • @PM2Ring if you subjectively feel that the OP is sincere enough. You can see how that argument breaks down. The op is now supposed to gauge the sincerity level that may be assigned to their question before posting so as to prevent anyone from assuming that they are insincere? If it's on-topic, reasonably scoped, and not a duplicate, nothing else is of any real importance. Note that a lot of the time that people are complaining about sincerity or effort or what have you, there are actual problems with the question in the form of scope, topicality, or the fact that it is a duplicate.
    – user4639281
    Commented May 27, 2018 at 18:04
  • The point of the matter is that if we stopped worrying about all of the irrelevant nonsense, we might actually be able to see and focus on the real problems. Telling the op that they need to break their problem down into smaller more manageable pieces because it is too broad is so much more helpful than telling them that we aren't a coding service, or that you think their question isn't sincere enough, or whatever.
    – user4639281
    Commented May 27, 2018 at 18:09
  • 1
    @TinyGiant Well sure, it's a subjective judgement. But hey, if I'm going to voluntarily expend time & energy on helping someone I get to choose who I want to help. And for me that means someone who's here to learn, not someone who's merely here for a free ride. However, I don't berate people or say "What have you tried?". The closest I come to that is saying "If you want help with this, please show us your code and we can help you fix it".
    – PM 2Ring
    Commented May 27, 2018 at 18:30
  • @TinyGiant FWIW, I probably spend more time posting constructive comments to help OPs make their question (more) answerable than I do writing answers. (I also like to assist the low-rep answerers in fixing up flaws in their answers, and encouraging them to add a little bit of explanatory text rather than posting code-only answers). I firmly believe in encouraging OPs to write good quality questions by positive suggestions rather than by telling them "you're doing it wrong, you have to do <this>". But if I feel an OP isn't worth the effort, I'm not inclined to waste energy on them.
    – PM 2Ring
    Commented May 27, 2018 at 18:33
  • @PM2Ring There's a difference between a question being acceptable, and a question being something you want to answer. If you don't want to answer it because you don't feel that they put enough effort into solving their problem, that's fine. Someone else may think it is perfectly fine the way it is and want to answer it. My point is: saying something needs something when it doesn't actually need that thing, and would really just be a better if it had that thing, is misleading and detrimental to your goal. ...
    – user4639281
    Commented May 27, 2018 at 18:54
  • 1
    ... Saying "While not required, this would be a much better question if it included X, and I would be more willing to provide an answer." would be much more effective at achieving your goal, and would be the truth.
    – user4639281
    Commented May 27, 2018 at 18:54

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