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I came across a question which exemplifies why simultaneously answerers feel burned out and new users feel maligned.

This is not a dig at any particular user (questioner or responder), but an observation and a plea for more structured guidance for all users. Even a discussion to determine whether I actually have a point.

Zero-effort, unclear questions should be VTC and/or downvoted. One good comment may be helpful, which others can then upvote. However, no comment is necessary.

What we have here is a mess where the answerers have expended more effort than the questioner...

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    I don't see the problem with these comments. They are totally polite and constructive, would you feel maligned by them, just because they are not a direct answer to the question? For the commenters, if they already read the question to understand it, will posting their thoughts make them more burned out?
    – user000001
    May 5, 2018 at 12:37
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    Each comment in isolation is fine. As a new user, maybe a learner who feels he's entitled to free tutoring, only complimentary feedback and a ready-made answer to copy-paste, maligned is absolutely what I might feel. That's not to say I agree with this attitude, but we see this implicitly and explicitly on a regular basis.
    – jpp
    May 5, 2018 at 12:40
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    @jpp "However, no comment is necessary." so in one hand people tell you it's offensive to downvote, other say close question is offensive, other tell downvote without comment is offensive, and now a comment that help to improve the question is offensive... well I'm done, solve this equation without me, if you find that these comment is offensive flag them, but don't expect I will not do exactly like these user who nicely take their time to comment an question to help a newbie. (the fun is that in French, JPP mean "I can't take it anymore")
    – Stargateur
    May 5, 2018 at 12:43
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    @Stargateur, My solution (since I think you are asking?) is to upvote the first comment, VTC and move on. That is, in fact, what I ended up doing. Others might have their own solution. Happy to hear your thoughts. Here, for example, there are comments which repeat each other - surely misdirected effort?
    – jpp
    May 5, 2018 at 12:45
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    @jpp "there are comments which repeat each other - surely misdirected effort?", I'm not a python dev but these comments don't look like their repeat each other. "My solution (since I think you are asking?) is to upvote the first comment, VTC and move on.", users are allow to comment a question, there is nothing that disallow what you describe as bad.
    – Stargateur
    May 5, 2018 at 12:51
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    If you downvote, you are some anonymous curator. If you comment, you are a named target. Many users don't care what you say in a comment, only that a) they have no answer and b) there is a user name on a comment, someone who must be responsible for stopping an answer appearing, and who can then be slagged off as 'unwelcome'. May 5, 2018 at 14:11
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    I agree, many comments to poor question are meaningless and boring. I think it would be better to let the software disable comment section when a question is clearly poorly-received. For example, when reaching -4, let the system disable comments, remove all existing comments, and let the community user leave a auto-generated comment pointing OP to the help-center.
    – llllllllll
    May 5, 2018 at 14:33
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    @Stargateur "users are allow to comment a question, there is nothing that disallow what you describe as bad" -- You are also technically allowed to downvote a question because the Moon is in Scorpio. That doesn't make doing so a good idea.
    – duplode
    May 5, 2018 at 17:14
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    The third comment on that question rubs me the wrong way somehow, but I can't quite put my finger on why.
    – BoltClock
    May 5, 2018 at 17:23
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    I don't agree with "Zero-effort". At least there is code. May 5, 2018 at 19:20
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    @BoltClock Clearly your issue is the incorrect use of "then" instead of the "than".
    – rmaddy
    May 5, 2018 at 19:20
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    Let's talk about the real issue: why is it tagged python-3.5? May 5, 2018 at 19:24
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    To me all the comments are trying to point the novice programmer in the right direction. Even if i do not agree with all the comments. And the downvotes are correct since stackoverflow is not for debugging your code?
    – Persijn
    May 5, 2018 at 19:28
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    There is no effort related close reason except in that most close reasons stem from a lack of effort in one way or another.
    – user4639281
    May 5, 2018 at 19:29
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    @liliscent there are a lot of questions where i have to post a comment asking why the post is getting so many downvotes for no good reason. This happens almost on a daily basis for me.
    – Persijn
    May 5, 2018 at 19:29

2 Answers 2

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How to handle totally no effort questions: example

IMO, this is not immediately a no effort unrecoverable question from a new user.


There are folks who 1) down-vote 2) vote-to-close 3) comment. They can be disjoint sets.

On Monday I might see something like this and VTC or DV.

Had it been Friday, I might say "Hmmm will a little feedback from OP, this could be improved and ask a question via a comment."


Certainly this is a low effort post, but maybe not zero. With an engage OP addressing the comments, it could be brought up to good standard.

I disagree that this is a post where we should all do the same thing. Guess that is why it usually takes 5 to close a post - it needs a consensus.

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  • Minor nitpick: I often do all 3 eventually, so the sets are for a fact not disjoint ;) But I know "the sets might have non-empty symmetric differences" doesn't roll off the tongue. May 5, 2018 at 19:35
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    @AndrasDeak With new OPs and with low, (not zero ) effort post, I like to comment to prompt the OP to improve - guiding where to go or pointing out a weakness. Later (hours to days), VTC if no significant improvement. So sometimes I am disjoint and later jointed. May 5, 2018 at 19:39
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    at least some sanity here. May 5, 2018 at 19:46
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I think many people here misunderstood @jpp's suggestion.

answerers feel burned out and new users feel maligned.

The core problem here is users' feeling if we still allow comments for an already poorly-received question.

People get more psychologically involved when interacting with people, than interacting with a machine/software/system.

That's why we encourage users to flag a rude comment instead of engaging themselves with the offender.

The same principle applies here. The code in this question is unsalvageable, OP obviously needs a tutorial/textbook, no comments will magically make any difference. What's more, OP won't be grateful to these comments, instead, they will complain SO users as being condescending to relentlessly point out so many errors in their "work", especially when the question is already poorly-received.

A reasonable solution is to make question like this one disappear as soon as possible. Let the system clean it up, no interpersonal interaction is needed, just like how we deal with flags.

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    Yeh I think the problem is people took this post as a proclamation of what should be permitted. Rather, my aim is trying to discuss: how do we reach the desirable outcome (question closed) with least friction and time wastage?
    – jpp
    May 5, 2018 at 20:50

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