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I propose we add two meta-tags to the main SO site: [help-me] and [teach-me].

[Help-me] would serve to separate the askers that seek help with debugging/fixing their code.

[Teach-me] would mark the questions about basics of programming, such as how pointers work.

The reason I'd like to see these tags is to help the answerers find the questions they would like to answer. We have certain subsets of SO population that either don't care to see such questions, or like to answer such questions (and of course a lot of people who don't care). The explicit tagging will help us direct the right askers to the right answerers, without irritating or discouraging anybody.

Before people tell refer me to "The Death of Meta Tags" I have to say this in my defense. The main property of a meta tag is:

they do not describe the content of the question

The tags that I propose most certainly do. Any question that contains "Anyone can explain the code with instructive words or figures?" is a good candidate for [teach-me]. Any question that contains "I don't know why it takes two times for B to work" is a candidate for [help-me]. This is very much about contents.

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    "The tags that I propose most certainly do." They most certainly do not. They describe the form of the content, not the content itself. Commented Oct 31, 2017 at 14:10
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    Every question is a Help-Me case. But Teach-Me case ? That's wrong, they have to learn another way than having SO people explain them every programming concepts. Commented Oct 31, 2017 at 14:12
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    A question with "Anyone can explain the code with instructive words or figures?" is a good candidate to be closed as too broad. I also really can't follow your argument saying that the tags describe the content of the question. They apply to almost every single question on the website and don't give you any information about the specific content of the question. Having these would result in 99% of new questions being tagged with both of them. You might as well introduce a question tag and it would effectively have the same outcome.
    – Keiwan
    Commented Oct 31, 2017 at 14:13
  • @NicolBolas, I think that there is difference between "What is the correct behavior according to C++0x?" and "what is the difference between p=s and p->next=s?". And that difference is not just a matter of form.
    – user3458
    Commented Oct 31, 2017 at 14:14
  • @Keiwan, that was actually a question on how linked list and pointers in general work, with code and everything. I don't want to post a link, but please believe me it was not obviously appropriate for closing.
    – user3458
    Commented Oct 31, 2017 at 14:17
  • @Arkadiy: But that difference is only a matter of form. Explaining "correct behavior according to C++0x" should be exactly the same as explaining "the difference between p=s and p->next=s." All other things being equal. Commented Oct 31, 2017 at 14:22
  • @NicolBolas, in theory you're right, but in practice we do have people who enjoy one and not the other (see Antoine Pelletier 's comment above)
    – user3458
    Commented Oct 31, 2017 at 14:23
  • Just 'linked list' is a good candidate to be closed as dupe. 99% of all LL questions fall into a very few multi-duped buckets that the OP's continually fail to search for. The 1% overflow should be closed as too broad, on the gronds that the OP is just offloading the ditch-digging effort of debugging:( Commented Oct 31, 2017 at 14:44
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    What about questions that are neither "my code is broken" nor "I'm learning how to program"? 'Cause those are the ones that I want, personally.
    – jscs
    Commented Oct 31, 2017 at 14:58
  • @JoshCaswell You exclude the tags I propose, and then you're left with what you want.
    – user3458
    Commented Oct 31, 2017 at 15:14
  • @MartinJames , I find myself saying this often, but still: in theory, you're correct, the linked list question is a duplicate. In practice, however, referring the asker to the dupe is not enough to help him/her. As often happens in education, each problem is unique because each student is unique. Since we decided that we cannot close such questions as "insufficient research", we end up playing a teacher.
    – user3458
    Commented Oct 31, 2017 at 15:21
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    @Arkadiy No, you don't need to repeat the exact same thing to different people over and over again in their own question. There's nothing wrong at all with them going to an existing question with that exact same information. Just because people enjoy having someone re-type out that exact same information just for them doesn't mean it's actually necessary, or helpful.
    – Servy
    Commented Oct 31, 2017 at 15:29
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    I don't think tags are the right place for this, and I don't agree with the names. But I do think categorizing questions into "types" could be useful. Debugging vs. How-to vs. What is this, etc. Sort of like this proposal on the question template question. Commented Oct 31, 2017 at 15:39
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    @AntoinePelletier actually the answer I linked to isn't mine, but it is one I agree with. Commented Oct 31, 2017 at 18:15
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    @Arkadiy You can just google the error message to find as many duplicates as you could ever want. Naturally you shouldn't forget to downvote a question like that that isn't useful or well researched. It's a great example of a question that doesn't belong on this site at all, and thus the tags it should have are irrelevant, since it shouldn't have been posted to begin with.
    – Servy
    Commented Oct 31, 2017 at 18:45

2 Answers 2

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I can't see how this is going to help on SO. People come here to find a good solution to a precise problem. Or help other people with technologies they already know well.

Help-Me and Teach-me tags are not going to help them FIND their solution. And there's not much difference between these two. When you think about it : every answer I had made me learn something, and every user who posted them helped me...

Tags are there to classify different technologies or programmatic concepts.

Example : If you are looking for a C# solution, you'r going to look into C# questions, regardless of how it has been asked. Same for answerer : if you'r good at Javascript, you'r going to want to answer Javascript questions.

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    To be blunt, "help-me" tag should attract people who do not mind debugging other people's code on the web. And that same tag would allow people who actually want to answer questions to avoid debugging.
    – user3458
    Commented Oct 31, 2017 at 14:39
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    I see your good intentions... maybe the names of the tags you are proposing doesn't exactly reflect your ideas... Commented Oct 31, 2017 at 14:49
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    It's more about theoretic question vs debugging questions Commented Oct 31, 2017 at 15:14
  • Please feel free to edit the question with better tag names.
    – user3458
    Commented Oct 31, 2017 at 15:14
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    There could be separate tags that are forced when asking a new question, you would get to choose between : debugging, theory learning, or code improvement. As it would be... forced ? (maybe just highly suggested ?), then answerers will know what to expect from OP ! Commented Oct 31, 2017 at 15:53
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We will not be doing this.

Despite your counter-assertion, these are actually perfect examples of "meta" tags, consistent with the linked blog post. If you read the rest of Aaronut's quotation, you'll see why:

The reason meta-tags are a problem is that they do not describe the content of the question. They describe some other aspect of the question, like the author’s skill level, or the author’s motivation for asking it, or generally what “kind” of question it is (poll, how-to, etc.).

Meta-tags are actually a subset of a larger problem that I usually call dependent tags. These are tags that don’t say anything by themselves – you can’t tell what the question is about unless they’re paired with some other tag (or several of them). These tags are a problem because people don’t realize this and will often use that as the question’s only tag.

and absolutely do not describe the content of the question. They describe the form, type, nature, and motivation of the question and/or its asker. With your loose definition of "content", nothing would be a meta tag.

The very next sentence after the one you quoted gives the example of "the author's skill level" and "the author's motivation for asking it", which are precisely what tags like and would be attempting to describe. Stack Exchange doesn't even care about these things. The motivation of the asker is not relevant and should not be factored in when answering a question. We don't care if the question is a homework assignment, something you're doing at work, or part of an open-source project. It simply doesn't matter because it has no bearing on the content (i.e., the technical substance) of the question. The skill level of the asker isn't even terribly important, other than that a really high-quality answer will often be written with that in mind, using it to calibrate the required level of background information.

Furthermore, as it says in the next paragraph, these tags "don't say anything by themselves". You have no idea what the question is actually about based on either one of these tags.

would serve to separate the askers that seek help with debugging/fixing their code.

These askers don't need separation, and neither do their questions. Questions seeking debugging help are first-class on-topic questions on Stack Overflow, and don't need any special treatment. We merely require that these questions include a clear description of the problem and all code necessary to reproduce it. This is captured by the "MCVE" close reason, to wit:

Questions seeking debugging help ("why isn't this code working?") must include the desired behavior, a specific problem or error and the shortest code necessary to reproduce it in the question itself. Questions without a clear problem statement are not useful to other readers. See: How to create a Minimal, Complete, and Verifiable example.

but this requirement is for purely practical reasons, and would continue to apply even if the question were tagged . We cannot help you if you do not give us the required information.

What's not clear is in what way a tag would help you or me, or anyone else—asker or answerer. Everyone who comes to this site to ask a question is asking for help. If we were going to have a tag for this, we'd be better to call it , but that's still a "meta" tag, and still not useful.

You argue:

The reason I'd like to see these tags is to help the answerers find the questions they would like to answer. We have certain subsets of SO population that either don't care to see such questions, or like to answer such questions (and of course a lot of people who don't care). The explicit tagging will help us direct the right askers to the right answerers, without irritating or discouraging anybody.

but this is a solution in search of a problem. Prospective answerers are not going around looking for "debug-my-code" questions—they are looking for good, clear, answerable questions. And even if they were looking for "debug-my-code" questions, they certainly aren't failing to find any. If anything, they fail to find good, clear, answerable "debug-my-code" questions, but that's a failure of the part of the asker to include the information we need them to include, and not something that will be helped by the introduction of a new tag. There is an ongoing discussion here regarding what we can put in a question template to help people ask better questions.

As I stated previously, questions seeking debugging help are first-class, on-topic questions on Stack Overflow. None of our askers are seeking to avoid them. The only thing they want to avoid are bad or unanswerable questions, so if tagging is to help us here, we'd have to introduce an or tag, but: (1) again, this is the epitome of a "meta" tag, (2) it doesn't solve the problem, and (3) we already have a solution for this problem: downvotes and close votes.

would mark the questions about basics of programming, such as how pointers work.

This sounds like an attempt to end-run around the scope and requirements of Stack Overflow—a way to make it possible to ask and answer questions that we would not normally accept. Unfortunately, this has been tried before and failed. Ask gnat about it some time. :-)

Stack Overflow is not a tutorial site, nor is it a help desk. If you have a practical programming questions that can reasonably be answered in our format, then it is on topic here and doesn't need any special tags. It can and should just be answered. Beginner questions are fine. Questions that are too broad and literally require an "Introduction to Programming" book to answer are not fine, and wouldn't become fine just because we slap a tag on them.

Any question that contains "Anyone can explain the code with instructive words or figures?" is a good candidate for .

And also a good candidate for closure as "too broad", unless some serious attempt is made to narrow down the scope of the question. Then, if that was done successfully, it would become a good question and doesn't need to be indicated by or adorned with some kind of special badge.

Any question that contains "I don't know why it takes two times for B to work" is a candidate for .

"I don't know why x" is like 90% of questions on Stack Overflow.

All good answers teach. All good answers help. You don't need tags to request this.

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  • Such a long response to a -45 question. I must have struck a nerve.
    – user3458
    Commented Nov 1, 2017 at 9:59
  • Hmm, no, not really. I just think legitimate questions deserve good answers, and you are certainly not the first user to propose something like this. Also, I tend to write long answers. Don't take it personally. Downvotes on Meta simply indicate disagreement.
    – Cody Gray Mod
    Commented Nov 1, 2017 at 10:00
  • That's my point - you argue at length against something that community does not like very much :)
    – user3458
    Commented Nov 1, 2017 at 10:01
  • "This sounds like an attempt to end-run around the scope and requirements of Stack Overflow—a way to make it possible to ask and answer questions that we would not normally accept. " - nothing could be further from truth
    – user3458
    Commented Nov 1, 2017 at 10:02
  • I do exactly the opposite. SO has evolved to be 3 things: Q&A site, Code debugging/writing service, Tutoring service. This causes some resentment among those of us who like the Q&A aspect the best. My proposal would let the questions that many consider junk and noise (yes, despite SO rules and protestations, many do so) be answered by those who want them and ignored by those who don't... But SO is bound and determined to NOT let the users ignore the questions they dislike. Those pages don't view themselves.
    – user3458
    Commented Nov 1, 2017 at 10:08
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    This website is not a tutoring service, and it has always been a code writing service of sorts, as long as you're able to phrase your request in the form of an interesting programming question. The debugging thing is rather new, but that's why we have strict guidelines surrounding "debug my code" questions. If the problem is junk questions, then the solution is not sweeping them under the rug.
    – Cody Gray Mod
    Commented Nov 1, 2017 at 10:14
  • "Sweeping them under the rug" is indeed what SO has been doing. And - look at the two questions mentioned in the original post and in my comment to Servy. These are typical questions that a first-year CS student (a slow one) would ask a teacher, if he/she dared. I contend that they are different from our normal questions and require different, more teaching-oriented approach. Servy disagrees. I still think my approach would benefit the askers more, but this is a reasonable disagreement to have.
    – user3458
    Commented Nov 1, 2017 at 10:19
  • As to the "help-me" tag - SO was only writing code as far as the code was needed to illustrate the answer. Now we get half-backed non-working attempt at the solution or pseudocode, and the asker expects and (very often gets) working solution. This is not the same. And, of course, you admit that the debugging thing is new.
    – user3458
    Commented Nov 1, 2017 at 10:22
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    I'm sorry, I looked in the original post, and I don't see any mention of two questions. If I had seen them, I would have tried to address them. I didn't read all the comments, but skimming them, I don't see these, either. I see links to Meta questions, but not questions on main. At any rate, no, this is not a tutoring service. Questions shouldn't have different handling. This is like what people tried to do years ago with the [homework] tag, the whole reason that "death of meta tags" blog post was written.
    – Cody Gray Mod
    Commented Nov 1, 2017 at 10:24
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    You are misremembering the early days of SO. Tons of code was written for askers, and still is. Sure, you could argue it's purely for illustrative purposes, but that's the whole point. You ask how to implement something, and someone answers it. It's how the site was conceived to work, and how it still does. Everyone complains about "give me the code" questions, but their real problem is with low-quality, unclear questions, not the fact someone is asking for help writing code.
    – Cody Gray Mod
    Commented Nov 1, 2017 at 10:26
  • I tried to avoid Meta effect on the poor student. Search for quoted "Anyone can explain the code with instructive words or figures" and you'll see it. The other one is buried deep in comments.
    – user3458
    Commented Nov 1, 2017 at 10:28
  • @Arkadiy If you're going to go out of you way to obscure your example and prevent other people from seeing it, you can't really fault answers for not addressing the specifics of those examples. You've made the decision to keep your question general, rather than focusing on specifics. That's fine, you're certainly allowed to do that, just don't fault an answer for not addressing an example you haven't actually given. If you do want answers to address it, include them in the question along with why they're relevant and what you want to discuss about them.
    – Servy
    Commented Nov 1, 2017 at 16:06
  • @Servy I am not faulting anyone - the discussion has been good enough as it is. As far as I can tell, all participants understand exactly what kind of questions I propose to tag, they just disagree that they are worth tagging,
    – user3458
    Commented Nov 1, 2017 at 16:09

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