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I got a reputation hit not being aware that the question is off-topic, and people got into arrogant arguments with me instead of explaining in two words that the question was off-topic. Lucky for me, I got some reputation back because a kind person marked it off-topic and I deleted it later (thanks BCD).

I would like Stack Overflow to introduce a penalty for downvoting an off-topic question.

It is very simple: the question should not be downvoted, but put off-topic and removed with simple explanation "off-topic". I suppose the same should be done with duplicates.

It shouldn't be too hard for people to mark questions the right way, and avoid being arrogant.

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    Thank god that won't happen!
    – user0042
    Sep 10, 2017 at 18:07
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    "people got into arrogant argument with me instead of explaining" If they break our Be Nice policy, you are in your right to flag them accordingly. However, too often is the case where the OP misinterprets the feedback. In particular, downvoting is not an arrogant action. Sep 10, 2017 at 18:09
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    The down vote button says not useful so I can still use that button to indicate what I think of the content quality. If I'm close voting my vote is not binding, so I'm not sure (on SO sadly enough almost guaranteed) if my vote will be followed. So closing and voting are separate things with separate goals which should not be combined as they are not related to each other.
    – rene
    Sep 10, 2017 at 18:10
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    Sorry, but a question can be both off-topic and worthy of a downvote.
    – Joe C
    Sep 10, 2017 at 18:11
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    What then, will be the penatly for posting an off-topic question in the first place? I'm in favour of evisceration by machete, but I understand that is a niche viewpoint. Sep 10, 2017 at 18:14
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    Joking apart, it's a minor issue at best. Every hour, hundreds of posters issue off-topic questions because they WANT THEIR ANSWERS NOW AND DONT CARE ABOUT ANY STUID RULES OR POLICY THAT THEY CLICKED AS READ BECAUSE IT DOES NOT APPLY TO THEM SINCE THEY NEED AN ANSWER NOW AND RULES DONT APPLY. How arrogant its that? An occasional misplaced downvote is just noise. Sep 10, 2017 at 18:25
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    But your proposal speaks of a penalty for downvoting a question that does not belong here. How does that contribute to the decrease of incoming trash? Sep 10, 2017 at 18:34
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    Those with enough reputation can easily vote to close such questions. While it's true that we could use an incentive for using them, restraining them from an orthogonal action sounds more like a reason not to moderate content. There is no significant, direct reward from playing the garbage man in SO, we don't have to punish them even more for such a reason. Sep 10, 2017 at 18:45
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    'And I read the rules, it seems my questions were not off-topic.' - dare to put your money where your meta is? Post the link here to your not-off-topic, should-not-be-downvoted questions. If you are right, you will get extra upvotes, but..... Sep 10, 2017 at 18:47
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    it shouldn't be too hard for people to read the rules and stop asking off-topic questions but here we are
    – tima
    Sep 10, 2017 at 18:52
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    These things are all subjective, and so often there truly is wiggle room, but if we were to penalize question down-voting, how much should be removed? A whole point? No, too much. A fraction? Perhaps, but then that would change the whole reputation structure, and not just of this site. Is it worth it? Again, subjective, but I don't think so. Sep 10, 2017 at 18:53
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    @MartinJames at your service: stackoverflow.com/questions/46141876/…
    – rene
    Sep 10, 2017 at 19:53
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    Also... Your answer doesnt answer your question. Your question is "why do I have two that work, and what are their differences" and your answer is "here is the correct way to get it". I feel like it's incomplete
    – Patrice
    Sep 10, 2017 at 20:19
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    There are some on-topic questions that are worth a downvote. Sep 10, 2017 at 22:22

2 Answers 2

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This could never be applied because you can never tell why someone down voted. If someone down votes a question that later is removed because it is off topic it doesn't mean they down voted it for that reason. A question removed for being off topic could also be down voted because it is unclear, poorly worded or just because someone doesn't like the users name. It is up to the voter how they vote.

As you have said in your comments you have now learnt not to ask off topic questions I think everyone that down voted your question might have been on to something (I didn't see the question so can't say for sure). I am glad that you have learnt because of the down votes. This is what they are for.

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  • I still do not agree with any of you, and the reason is quite simple - if the option to flag as off-topic exist, it means it exists for a reason and should be used (I'd even say must be used). Something easier doesn't necessarily mean it's right... Anyway, as you said, I've learned my lesson, you are making it harder for others who didn't yet Sep 11, 2017 at 18:18
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    @user3454848 Users are not limited to a maximum of one interaction with a post. Yes, there is a mechanism to indicate that posts are off topic, and yes, we'd like people to use it whenever it's applicable. We also have a mechanism for users to indicate whether a post is useful or not, and we'd like people to use that whenever they have an opinion on the usefulness of a post. The two (along with other interactions with a post) aren't mutually exclusive, if someone feels a post is both off topic, and also not useful (a common situation) then both voting to close and downvoting is helpful.
    – Servy
    Sep 11, 2017 at 21:32
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It's hard to think of a better cause to downvote a question than it being off-topic. Other good causes include a question being unclear and not showing any research effort (i.e., the answer is immediately obvious from glancing at the documentation).

Not coincidentally, these are the reasons listed on the tooltip for the downvote arrow:

This question does not show any research effort; it is unclear or not useful

Asking an off-topic question is pretty clear evidence that you did not expend effort to research our guidelines for an acceptable question, and off-topic questions are absolutely not useful to anyone.

Pragmatically, downvotes on off-topic questions are necessary, and an integral part of the system, because they provide a signal that the question is not one that experts should pay attention to. It is a waste of their time and our limited resources if people have to look at off-topic questions. By the first few viewers downvoting them, it saves everyone else time, which they can then use to focus on questions that deserve an answer.

A common misconception among new users is that downvotes are somehow punitive. They really aren't meant to be. This site focuses on content, not users. Voting is a content rating system; nothing more, nothing less. Bad content should be downvoted; good content should be upvoted. Content that makes you say "meh" probably shouldn't be voted on. However, a fundamental rule of our voting system is that users are allowed to vote for any reason(s) they choose, as long as they are not casting votes fraudulently (i.e., by operating sockpuppets and/or by targeting their votes at a particular user.)

In any case, there is some good news: off-topic questions are generally deleted after being closed, and when a post is deleted, you will get the reputation you lost from downvotes returned. (The only catch is, deleted posts' scores still count towards the automatic quality bans, but as long as you don't make a habit of asking off-topic questions, this will not be a problem for you.)

As for

people got into arrogant arguments with me instead of explaining in two words that the question was off-topic.

Yes, that happens sometimes. People can be jerks. Other times, people are trying to be helpful, but phrase things poorly so that they come across as arrogant. Either way, we don't condone such behavior, and you should flag these comments for moderator attention so they can be removed. More generally, if someone is violating our "Be Nice" policy, then please let a moderator know.

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