16

I came across this audit in the triage queue. I said "Requires Editing" but the system told me that the question was "Unsalvageable" and "gibberish". Now, unsalvageable might be a matter of opinion, but it's not gibberish; I was able to discern a (poorly written) question and a (poorly written and edited into the question) answer, and those problems could be fixed by rewriting and removing the answer part.

It seems to me that we usually try to err on the side of editing rather than deleting, so the failed audit surprised me.

There's a comment (now, but not when it appeared in my queue) about repasting the same thing over and over to bypass the quality filters, which is clearly degenerate behavior, but it wasn't obvious to me that the user was doing that (although in retrospect it does seem that way); all I saw was a copy and paste issue and a failure to proofread.

Do I need to recalibrate my trigger finger, or was this audit really ambiguous?


Delete the outlook365 email after reading in JAVA

I wan to read outlook 360 email and delete the emails after reading.

PFB code to read the outlook 365 emails.

we are using outlook365 email.We are able to read the emails

    import java.text.SimpleDateFormat;
    import java.util.Date;
    import java.util.Properties;

    import javax.mail.Address;
    import javax.mail.FetchProfile;
    import javax.mail.Flags;
    import javax.mail.Folder;
    import javax.mail.Message;
    import javax.mail.MessagingException;
    import javax.mail.Session;
    import javax.mail.Store;
    import javax.mail.search.FlagTerm;

    public class OutLookReader_imaps {

        Folder inbox;

        // Constructor of the calss.

        public OutLookReader_imaps() {
            System.out.println("Inside MailReader()...");
            final String SSL_FACTORY = "javax.net.ssl.SSLSocketFactory";
            Properties props = System.getProperties();
            // Set manual Properties
            props.setProperty("mail.imaps.socketFactory.class", SSL_FACTORY);
            props.setProperty("mail.imaps.socketFactory.fallback", "false");
            props.setProperty("mail.imaps.port", "993");
            props.setProperty("mail.imaps.socketFactory.port", "993");
            props.put("mail.imaps.host", "outlook.office365.com");


            try {
                /* Create the session and get the store for read the mail. */

                Session session = Session.getDefaultInstance(System.getProperties(), null);
                Store store = session.getStore("imaps");

                store.connect("outlook.office 360.com", 993, "MY-EMAIL-ID", "PASSWORD");

                /* Mention the folder name which you want to read. */


                inbox = store.getFolder("INBOX");

                /* Open the inbox using store. */

                //inbox.open(Folder.READ_ONLY);
                inbox.open(Folder.READ_WRITE);

                Message messages[] = inbox.search(new FlagTerm(new Flags(
                        Flags.Flag.ANSWERED), false));
                //Message[] msgs = inbox.getMessages();

                System.out.println("No. of Unread Messages : " + inbox.getUnreadMessageCount());
                System.out.println("No. of Messages : " + inbox.getMessageCount());
                System.out.println("No. of Deleted Messages : " + inbox.getMode());

                FetchProfile fp = new FetchProfile();
                fp.add(FetchProfile.Item.ENVELOPE);

                inbox.fetch(messages, fp);

                try {

                    printAllMessages(messages);

                    inbox.close(true);
                    store.close();

                } catch (Exception ex) {
                    System.out.println("Exception arise at the time of read mail");
                    ex.printStackTrace();
                }

            } catch (MessagingException e) {
                System.out.println("Exception while connecting to server: " + e.getLocalizedMessage());
                e.printStackTrace();
                System.exit(2);
            }

        }

        public void printAllMessages(Message[] msgs) throws Exception {
            for (int i = 0; i < msgs.length; i++) {
                System.out.println("MESSAGE #" + (i + 1) + ":");
                printEnvelope(msgs[i]);
            }
        }

        public void printEnvelope(Message message) throws Exception {

            Address[] a;

            if ((a = message.getFrom()) != null) {
                for (int j = 0; j < a.length; j++) {
                    System.out.println("Email From : " + a[j].toString());
                }
            }

            String subject = message.getSubject();

            Date receivedDate = message.getReceivedDate();
            Date sentDate = message.getSentDate(); 

            SimpleDateFormat df = new SimpleDateFormat("dd/MM/yyyy");

            System.out.println("Email Subject : " + subject);

            if (receivedDate != null) {
                System.out.println("Received Date: " + df.format(receivedDate));
            }

            System.out.println("Sent Date : " + df.format(sentDate));

message.setFlag(Flags.Flag.DELETED, true);
        }


        public static void main(String args[]) {
            new OutLookReader_imaps();
        }
    }

i am able to delete after reading the mails. PLease try above code it will work i am able to delete after reading the mails. PLease try above code it will work

the above code worked like cool.i am able to delete after reading the mails. PLease try above code it will work

the above code worked like cool.i am able to delete after reading the mails. PLease try above code it will work

the above code worked like cool.i am able to delete after reading the mails. PLease try above code it will work

the above code worked like cool.i am able to delete after reading the mails. PLease try above code it will work

the above code worked like cool. the above code worked like cool.

4
  • 1
    @Cody Unfortunately we cannot see the question in question. Is that because you handled it as mentioned? Would be nice to have a screenshot or text cite in this meta question.
    – user0042
    Sep 1, 2017 at 14:42
  • 1
    to me, the duplicated lines at the bottom are a big red flag that this may be something other than a legitimate post. (but actually proving that it's not legit is another thing.) Sep 2, 2017 at 21:09
  • Perfect example of a complete trash question - completely unsalvagable. Pretty nice audit for once - people who start to edit crap like this are wasting everyone's time.
    – Lundin
    Sep 4, 2017 at 8:50
  • @Lundin I've been convinced that you're right; unfortunately, as Cody Gray pointed out in a linked question, the instructions in the Triage queue explicitly say that "Editing required" includes edits by the author. Oh well.
    – trent
    Sep 4, 2017 at 13:58

2 Answers 2

21

Yeah, I can see how you might feel that audit was ambiguous.

We're having a bit of a problem at the moment with users bypassing our automatic quality filters by "padding out" their questions with gibberish. Whether that's via copy-paste or simply holding down a key, I consider that to be a clear abuse of the system, and I handled that post accordingly.

However, I can see how, as a user in /review, you would want to choose "Requires Editing" on something like that. You charitably see a question buried in there, and your instincts to "be nice" kick in, leading you to think that the question might be salvageable by editing.

Unfortunately, because a moderator marked it as abusive, the system thought it was a clear-cut case and automatically selected it as an audit. We do not currently have a way to preemptively exclude posts from becoming audits, or even remove them after the fact. If this had resulted in a review ban for you, I would have lifted it. Since this is the only audit you've failed, I'd say your trigger finger is probably fine.

On the other hand…an awful lot of editing would have been required to turn that into a question that would be suitable for Stack Overflow. Just removing the gibberish at the bottom would not have been sufficient—it still needed to have a real question edited into it, along with a description of the problems/errors with the code.

I very much doubt that these are edits that you (or any other reviewer) could have performed, and based on our current guidance for review, this means that "Unsalvageable" would have been a better choice.

If you recalibrate your trigger finger in any way, make it tend more towards "Unsalvageable" for borderline posts. If an edit would have to totally rewrite a question, adding in a bunch of omitted details, then "Requires Editing" is really not a good choice. (I've argued before, in my pre-moderator days, that these options are confusing and the guidance should be presented more obviously, but it mostly got a "meh" response from those holding the power to change it.)

3
  • 4
    I like to think of requires editing as meaning it can be saved with edits from a 3rd party, not that it is able to be turned in to a good question from the asker should they put in more effort. I don't know if the options can be worded like that or perhaps my view isn't even the majority opinion!
    – dave
    Sep 2, 2017 at 1:42
  • 1
    That was a really tough abusive nuke, a simple mod delete was not enough? Sep 2, 2017 at 20:14
  • 2
    'can be saved with edits from a 3rd party' - with this in mind I would also mark more posts as 'Unsalvageable', because only the asker could add the missing parts. I think this should be made clearer.
    – jps
    Sep 4, 2017 at 8:33
13

What would you have realistically edited from this question? As a first pass, let's start with the gibberish at the bottom; removing that would make this cleaner.

What are we left with now?

Delete the outlook365 email after reading in JAVA

I wan to read outlook 360 email and delete the emails after reading.

PFB code to read the outlook 365 emails.

we are using outlook365 email.We are able to read the emails

[code]

i am able to delete after reading the mails. PLease try above code it will work

Any subsequent passes would fix:

  • Grammar
  • Spelling
  • Sentence structure

But then...once you get that far, what are you really left with as a question?

I want to read emails and delete the emails. I'm able to delete after reading the emails. Please try above code, it will work.

Um...that ain't a question. It's not even clear what they're asking.

I disagree that this can be ambiguous. Had you applied editing, you'd slowly come to the realization that this question can't be edited into shape by you.

Take your time with actually reading through and ciphering off what these questions are actually saying. Some things can be saved through edits, but it's okay to regard it as unsalvageable after a few swings at it.

12
  • The real ambiguity I guess I see here is in the meaning of the phrase "Requires Editing". I frequently salvage unsalvageable questions through editing, so I can follow the impulse to want to edit a terrible start into shape. Triage doesn't let you actually do the edit, so you don't actually get to prove whether or not the edit is possible, and you're supposed to make rather snap decisions about it (as opposed to actually doing all the thinking that would be required were you actually going to edit it). But this is a soapbox I've stood on before about "Requires Editing" vs. "Unsalvageable".
    – Cody Gray Mod
    Sep 1, 2017 at 15:04
  • 1
    @CodyGray: Yes, I recall having those discussions. However, I still stand by my stance here. The simplest thing to do in this context is to say, "If it requires editing, can I edit it? Would it still be suitable for the site after I'm done?" I don't disagree that the text in the review queues is misleading, though. I hope that they fix that soon.
    – Makoto
    Sep 1, 2017 at 15:08
  • I can't see the edit history of the post. What I can see is that it has been edited at some point. My assumption was that the "question" was "I'm using <some Java code> to read emails in Outlook 365, but how do I delete them after reading?" and the "answer" later edited in to muddy things up was "using <some other Java code>". Perhaps I'm wrong and the original version was just as unclear, but regardless, I think there are ways this "unsalvageable" question could have been salvaged
    – trent
    Sep 1, 2017 at 15:09
  • @trentcl: It was only edited once, by the OP, and it was made a whole lot worse by their edit. It wasn't much better with their original content; "It doesn't work" or similar aren't things we can fix with edits, etiher.
    – Makoto
    Sep 1, 2017 at 15:10
  • @Makoto I can't see that because the question has been deleted. Nevertheless, I'll concede that the edits necessary to fix the question would have been pretty drastic.
    – trent
    Sep 1, 2017 at 15:12
  • 2
    @trentcl: I'm really not trying to get you to see that the edits would've been drastic. I'm trying to get you to see that the edits would have to have been from the OP. There's only so much power that we have when it comes to editing things, and adding missing details is not one of those powers.
    – Makoto
    Sep 1, 2017 at 15:13
  • 2
    Oh, odd… The question in question was edited. I don't remember if I noticed that at the time or not. What's strange is it was edited by the OP to add in the gibberish. The original version of the question was…better. Not good, mind you, but better. I don't know what might have possessed them to do that. I guess they tried to format the code that they left unformatted, but that caused the code vs. text ratio quality filter to go off, so they got mad and filled it with gibberish instead.
    – Cody Gray Mod
    Sep 1, 2017 at 15:19
  • @CodyGray: In either circumstance...not much worth saving there IMO.
    – Makoto
    Sep 1, 2017 at 15:22
  • 1
    I'm not disagreeing with that. The upvote on this answer is mine. :-)
    – Cody Gray Mod
    Sep 1, 2017 at 15:23
  • @Makoto From what I've seen, "this post can't be saved except by the OP" is not a valid reason to delete; at least, the policies on irrelevant and code-only answers imply to me that the rule is "downvote it, but leave it up indefinitely in the hope that OP will come back one day and fix it". If there's a rule about questions that only OP can fix, this is the first I've heard of it.
    – trent
    Sep 1, 2017 at 15:27
  • 1
    In any case, I accept the correction and I'll try to be more cautious -- in the future, if I'm unsure about a review like this, I'll just skip it.
    – trent
    Sep 1, 2017 at 15:29
  • 2
    @trentcl: Yeah it is. If it can't be saved by anyone but the OP and they're not responsive, it can't be said to have "lasting value". If it's simply not addressed by the OP after a period of time, the system will automatically delete it, provided it meets certain criteria. But yes, the safest thing to do if you're not sure is to skip it. You can't be punished or faulted for not knowing.
    – Makoto
    Sep 1, 2017 at 15:38

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