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Also, I'm not a moderator; I'm an employee. – animuson♦ 8 hours ago

Basically, can we give employees a different symbol than elected moderators? If we get into situations where the difference matters and they even have to point that out, then we should have a way to tell easily which of the two groups they belong to.


Important note: This is not about marking employees in a special way. I don’t care who is an employee at SO and who is not. This is about differentiating elected moderators with employee moderators (i.e. employees having moderator access, and them actively using it).

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    status-declined by Jeff Atwood Commented Jan 16, 2017 at 10:01
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    The Stack Overflow Extras addon has this as an option as I recall.
    – Paulie_D
    Commented Jan 16, 2017 at 10:03
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    @BhargavRao Fair enough but (a) that was 2011 and things can have changed, (b) Jeff isn’t in charge anymore, and (c) as outlined by the quote, “we are running alongside you” appears not to be the case when employees need to point out that they are not moderators.
    – poke
    Commented Jan 16, 2017 at 10:15
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    @BhargavRao Jeff Atwood doesn't work for or moderate for the company or site anymore.
    – TylerH
    Commented Jan 16, 2017 at 16:01
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    @poke I think if you have a look at the context of animuson's comment it will make sense why he had to make that distinction as he was requested to step down as a moderator. I'm guessing that 'stepping down' can really only apply to elected moderators.
    – Shiri
    Commented Jan 18, 2017 at 10:09
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    What I would really like to know is what purpose showing everyone whether or not a specific user is a moderator actually has for the community. To me it incentivises user-specific targeting in any given way: pestering for help, blaming for wrong decisions etc. and, to me, provides no obvious benefit aside from slightly more weight behind each of their posts.
    – Shiri
    Commented Jan 18, 2017 at 10:11
  • Maybe second paragraph of this answer helps Commented May 1, 2019 at 10:04
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    Related (completed) feature request on MSE: Add an immediately visible indication that a user is a staff member or an employee of SE - The diamond now has a "Mod" text explanation next to it, and there's a visible orange "Staff" badge next to the staff member's username everywhere as well. (These appear in posts and user profiles on Meta sites, and on user profiles on main sites as well.)
    – V2Blast
    Commented Jul 29, 2021 at 6:52

3 Answers 3

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The vast majority of folks that work here do not need, want or have moderator access on any of our sites. The principle of least privilege is something that a company of our size needs to utilize.

Identifying these folks differently would put all of us in a position of authority where folks would naturally want to turn for help, while only a small percentage of us could actually do anything to help.

Additionally, every single person that was once an active participant here and on other meta sites became quite reticent to participate more once hired because they feared that their status as an employee would have a chilling effect on discussions. Folks on the community team have to get over that quickly, because adding our voice to discussions here (without seeming to wave a big gavel) is a big part of our jobs. Others would see it as another obstacle to overcome to become active here, and many are a little intimidated by the occasional need to break out a flame suit in order to engage.

From a cost-to-benefit standpoint, I don't see the total disambiguation of employees to non-employees as worth the cost of raising the bar to participation especially at a time that we're encouraging many more people within the company to come here and talk more about what they're doing.

I can see the case for this making sense in , where it can be very useful to easily identify an answer written by an employee; we typically don't chime in there unless we've got something additional to say beyond what folks in the community have already said.

But that's easily fixed by us being more diligent about indicating that we work here, and doesn't really require everyone at the company to wear a special insignia wherever they participate. If Susan works in sales, but spends most of her free time as an amateur astronomer, I wouldn't want her getting pinged with issues where she very likely won't be of much help.

The way that our levels of access are structured mean every single employee would have this indicator, and at the rate we're growing, it's more likely to confuse people rather than help.

And then what of folks that leave the company? We'd take away their employee status, and anything they wrote depending on that special mark to convey additional significance would lose that context; this is already something that can be problematic when moderators occasionally retire their diamonds.

I think the best thing to do is continuing to be diligent to spell out "I. Work. Here. And this is something I'm saying in that capacity" when it makes sense, which is a conversation I'm going to raise again internally.

But as it stands, I'm declining this, because the problems surrounding doing this still apply, even though they've changed a bit since we went from 50 people to over 200.

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    Note that my request is less for the distinction of employees vs. non-employees. If someone wanted to go “anonymous”, or with least privilege as you mention, then they could still do that. I’m mostly interested in the distinction between an elected mod (who has a direct community backing) and some employee with mod power but a very different background.
    – poke
    Commented Jan 16, 2017 at 13:38
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    @poke employees aren't listed on a site's users/moderators page Commented Jan 16, 2017 at 20:25
  • @poke How about people like Tim Post and bluffest who were mods but are now employees?
    – jkd
    Commented Feb 11, 2017 at 20:30
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Despite the passing of nearly six years, I still find myself in agreement with Jeff Atwood:

…at least in principle, there should be very little difference between my actions and another community moderator's actions.

And I think the visual indicators should echo this sentiment.

Stack Overflow has grown a lot in the intervening years, and hired a lot more employees, but ultimately their function and circumstances have changed very little. The employees who are most active on Meta sites generally hold the title of "Community Manager", and their job is—at least in part—to act as liaisons, representatives, and advocates for the community. Because these are community-run websites, powered almost exclusively by the efforts of decentralized masses, the most crucial job of these employees is to maintain order and keep things running smoothly with regard to this larger community.

I don't think the example you cite is one where the difference matters, and I don't imagine very many other circumstances where it might matter, either.

They might be getting their paycheck from Stack Overflow, but ultimately, the continued presence of that paycheck depends on active, engaged users who make this site what it is. Employees should be treated with the same respect and the same critical eye as moderators.

Frankly, in this specific case, animuson's comment reads more like an attempt to throw his weight around to me, and it kind of puts a bad taste in my mouth. Although when read in context, it's a bit easier to understand where he's coming from, since Alf's previous comment demanding that he step down wasn't exactly respectful or constructive. Still, I think this is an example of the kind of animosity that would be perpetuated by making a more visible distinction between moderators and employees. The employees are still at the service of the community; after all, they aren't paying us to be here.

Differential badging would also make it hard for employees to have or offer unofficial opinions, participating just like any other member of the community would. They usually have some pretty good ideas, and they do get paid to sit around and think about this stuff, so it's good to get their input. On the other hand, I think it would be very bad if everything they posted had an "OFFICIAL EMPLOYEE STAMP OF APPROVAL" sign on it, because then people would turn their brains off and fail to critically analyze whether their proposal was actually the best thing for the site—or worse, be afraid to disagree.

If the circumstance arises where an official pronouncement needs to be made, then they can indicate that explicitly and textually. Such circumstances are and should continue to be rare.

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  • Huh. I'm surprised to see this is so controversial.
    – Cody Gray Mod
    Commented Jan 16, 2017 at 13:13
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    Um yeah, I acknowledged that in the very next sentence: "Although when read in context, it's a bit easier to understand where he's coming from, since Alf's previous comment demanding that he step down wasn't exactly respectful or constructive." So of course the full comment chain has more than just one comment. That's the "context" part. It's been taken out of context here, and that's what I was initially looking at.
    – Cody Gray Mod
    Commented Jan 16, 2017 at 13:50
  • I will take my foot out of my mouth them. I read the post from beginning to end and for some reason my eyes must have just jumped over the sentence. Commented Jan 16, 2017 at 13:55
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    From reading the first paragraph it immediately strikes me that the real question is why animuson felt it necessary to make the distinction that he isn't a moderator and is, instead, an employee. It seems that his statement must therefore be wrong if he carries the diamond next to his name. Right? He is both a moderator and an employee. Edit: Reading on, his comment makes sense, but out-of-context his statement does seem prone to raising a question like this.
    – Shiri
    Commented Jan 18, 2017 at 9:58
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    @Shiri: If a person is just reading one single comment out of a long chain and are missing the context then they are the one to have made a mistake. It is no fault of the person who actually made the comment. In this case, it is very clear that animuson is pointing out that he can't actually step down because he is an employee and not an elected moderator. I see nothing wrong in that statement (although his other comments may not exactly be correct).
    – Harry
    Commented Jan 18, 2017 at 10:59
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This is somewhat resolved now that employee profiles are marked with a “Staff” indicator. Clicking on the user name to visit the user’s profile, the displayed profile name will now indicate when someone is just a moderator:

Moderator indicator

Or whether they are both moderator and staff:

Staff and moderator indicators

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