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I just flagged a question (now deleted) and its answer, both as spam. They used the following spam pattern :

  • User #1 asks a question. His nickname on SO is a company name - let's say "Foo bar".
  • User #2 answers the question with a link to a premium plugin (saying it's a perfect solution, cheaper than other, etc). The plugin author is a company named "Foo bar", just as the User #1 nickname.
  • User #1 accepts the answer, everyone is happy.

Thing is the User #2 website in his profile is the "Foo bar" website company. So both users are obviously coworkers (or the same person) using SO to promote their company's product.

So I left a comment on the answer explaining the user's affiliation with the product, and flagged both as spam. The flag on the answer was deemed helpful, but the flag on the question was declined (though the question was deleted). Why that? What is the proper flag to use in that kind of situation?

Here is the link of the question for 10k users.

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  • 1
    The question on its own is not spam, so a spam flag is not really suitable.
    – Floern
    Jan 3, 2017 at 13:05
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    Speaking of spam flags, I flagged this question as spam, but apparently Martijn disagreed with me. I'm not really sure how that thought process worked. This is the only thing ever posted by the user, it consists primarily of a link to a third-party service, and it's less-than-subtly hinting about how reliable the service is. If our standards for "questions" have really reached so low that we think this might be a legitimate one, then all hope is lost. Jan 3, 2017 at 13:51
  • @CodyGray: Maybe it may be linked to impact on user when spam flag is deemed helpful, the Q has been deleted, so I can speak for Martjin, but maybe he did warn the user and is the reason for declining the flag is to not impact him from start ?
    – Tensibai
    Jan 3, 2017 at 14:09
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    I don't buy that, @ten. If you roll up and start posting crap like this, there should be a penalty imposed. Besides, I'm tired of everyone evaluating the spam flag based on some arbitrary implementation detail. It should be evaluated solely based on whether or not the post is spam. If you don't like that flagging something as spam imposes a penalty, then post a feature-request to make that penalty optional. Jan 3, 2017 at 14:14
  • @CodyGray That's not my position :) Just a possible reason of the "why". Just saw I wrote can instead of can not, sorry if it caused some confusion.
    – Tensibai
    Jan 3, 2017 at 14:17
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    @CodyGray: we get plenty of crap questions every day. Most are not spam. Without a matching spam answer there is no evidence that that was intended as a seed. Rest assured that that account will meet swift action if any actual evidence of spamming is found, but for now I don't see a need to do anything more.
    – Martijn Pieters Mod
    Jan 4, 2017 at 11:14
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    @martijn So a spam flag cannot be used unless there is a "matching spam answer"? Where is that documented? How does that even make sense? It can't be spam until there is more spam? Jan 4, 2017 at 11:22
  • @CodyGray: we tolerate spam flags on seeds, because the post as a whole is spam. However, technically the seed is not spam; they are not promoting a service without disclosure. For that question you flagged was I see 0 evidence that it was trying to promote a service.
    – Martijn Pieters Mod
    Jan 4, 2017 at 11:25
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    The evidence is right there in the question, @martijn, and I already explained it in a prior comment. What is this nonsense about "tolerating" spam flags, as if they're something unwanted that you only tolerate from us blundering fools with flag privileges? I also don't know what you're trying to say about "seeds". The question I flagged as spam isn't potential spam, it's actual spam—again, for the reasons I already pointed out. It isn't just merely about the service, setting itself up for an answer. It contains little more than a link to the service and a remark about its reliability. Jan 4, 2017 at 11:28
  • We just have to agree to disagree there @Cody. I don't agree that it is actual spam.
    – Martijn Pieters Mod
    Jan 4, 2017 at 11:28
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    @martijn Can you explain to me what you think spam is? Because every dictionary is in agreement with my assessment. We may not be an "internet forum" in some respects, but we're close enough for the purposes of judging spam, and this article makes it pretty clear that question was spam: "consists of posts…that contains related or unrelated advertisements, links to malicious websites, trolling and abusive or otherwise unwanted information…posted…to get the spam in front of readers who would not otherwise have anything to do with it intentionally" Jan 4, 2017 at 11:33
  • @CodyGray: I'm sorry that you are unhappy with my decision, but this comment thread is not going to go anywhere. On a site where people can post questions, we get tons of misplaced questions about outside commercial services. That does not automatically make them spam. You have also been here long enough that you know by now that spam flags carry a heavy penalty, and that we moderators are therefor careful when we apply them. That post was a question about an external service, and as such I do not see that as spam. Not without further evidence of intent.
    – Martijn Pieters Mod
    Jan 4, 2017 at 11:37
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    @CodyGray: furthermore, the post is deleted, so I'm not sure why you keep harping on on this at this point. What is your goal here, to help keep the site clean or to maintain a 'perfect' flag ratio?
    – Martijn Pieters Mod
    Jan 4, 2017 at 11:38
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    My goal is to figure out where the disconnect is between your definition of spam, and the commonly held definition of spam. I might care less about the flag ratio if the system didn't shove rejections into my face. What I have been here long enough to learn is that moderators seem to be afraid to call spam spam because of concern about penalties that might be imposed. That's a problem. The flag doesn't say anything about penalties, it says "spam". I'm harping on this because it makes me very angry that you were trying to tell me that something I think is obviously spam is not spam because…? Jan 4, 2017 at 11:42
  • @CodyGray It kinda sounds like the policy towards spambait questions might be "wait a while so they can either dig themselves deeper, or show that it's just a bad question and not spam". In the former case, catching two spammer accounts instead of one is probably worth the wait. In the latter case, prematurely classifying it as spam would be problematic. Just a guess, though, since I can't see the actual post you're talking about. Jan 4, 2017 at 23:02

2 Answers 2

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OK. This was my fault.

When I first saw the flag(s) I didn't notice the name of the asker or the comment left on the answer (that was hidden by the mod flag overlay), so my reasoning was the same as Floern's.

However, when I'd dealt with the flag on the question I did notice the comment and then the asker's name so I marked that flag as helpful and ended up deleting the whole thing.

A comment on the question might have been a better option as it would have definitely been visible when I viewed the question. A custom flag is also an option, but these can take longer to process (as there are usually only a few spam flags active at any one time). In this case, as the question was so old it probably wouldn't have mattered either way.

I wouldn't worry about one declined flag, your ability to flag isn't going to be affected by this.

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  • Thanks for the explanation, I was not worry about my flag ability but if spam flag this kind of question was the right way to go. Maybe I could send a custom flag in that kind of case, if it make it more easy to handle for moderators.
    – vard
    Jan 3, 2017 at 13:20
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    @vard - a spam flag plus a comment on the question would probably be OK too. Either that or I get a higher resolution monitor ;)
    – ChrisF Mod
    Jan 3, 2017 at 13:21
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I use the following custom mod flag (on the question) in this exact situation:

This looks like a question that has been set up for a spam answer reply. Both users are members from today. Please consider deleting both the question and the accepted answer as spam and removing the two users.

The "Both users are members from today" is only included after checking that this is the case - it is normally a good spam indicator.

I spam flag the answer as normal.

So far I don't recall any declines using this approach.

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  • In this case it was complicated by the fact that the question was over two years old.
    – ChrisF Mod
    Jan 3, 2017 at 13:19
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    That's certainly helpful as that makes it easier to spot from the flag queue why what appears to be an innocent question at first glance was flagged. Note that this question was a lot older however.
    – Martijn Pieters Mod
    Jan 3, 2017 at 13:19
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    @MartijnPieters The "Both users are members from today" is optional and only used after checking. Jan 3, 2017 at 13:21

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