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I have posted a couple of questions recently about specific Stack Overflow questions. My questions were closed as duplicates (though I did achieve my goal in each case).

So the question is whether or not it is appropriate to close a question as a duplicate that focuses on a specific Stack Overflow question unless there is an existing Meta question about that particular question.

My proposal or feature-request is that the system not allow closing as duplicate any question that asks about some issue about a particular Stack Overflow question unless that particular Stack Overflow question has already been the subject of a conversation here on Meta Stack Overflow.

I noted in one of my earlier questions that I had no other means of getting a question reopened, because I was not smart enough to edit it, and I did not have sufficient reputation points to push it to the reopen queue. Since then I learned that even if I edited it, since the question was more than five days old, my edit would not push the question to the reopen queue. Basically there was no way for me to ask for help with a community mistake.

Here are my personal examples:

Here is the question I wanted to have closed today:

I saw that my flag was deemed helpful on the question, but it was still open. I looked through Meta Stack Overflow and discovered that if I raised this question on Meta Stack Overflow it would most likely be closed as a duplicate. If our focus is on closing questions on Meta Stack Overflow as duplicates rather than improving Stack Overflow then Stack Overflow will suffer.

My conclusion after reading this

So rather than implementing some new boring impotent flag for this purpose, we decided to take other criteria into account, things that might indicate a closed question that could use some additional review. Currently, this means that a closed question will automatically be added to the reopen queue when it is... ...Edited (body edits only) within 5 days of closure by the author. Or, ...Edited (body edits only) within 5 days of closure by a 3rd-party, provided the editor has not also flagged the question or voted to close it. Or, ...Sufficiently popular, where popularity is calculated based on question score, top answer score, or views per month. We're still tweaking the exact thresholds for these.

is that despite multiple claims that my edits of any question would push it to the review queue to be reopened are not correct. If the question was closed more than 5 days ago my edits will not push it to the review queue.

Please look at the questions I asked about and make your own decision whether or not the ultimate action (reopen or close) improved SO.

Jon Skeet notes below that he would not like Meta to be an appeal platform for Stack Overflow. I agree to a certain extent - I would not like to read appeals from original posters of questions. I am willing to narrow my scope such that only questions brought by other members would be eligible for this preferential treatment.

Jon also noted that I started addressing one issue and ended with another. I disagree with that analysis. I am trying to provide specific examples of where the system does not currently allow an appeal process.

Before I posted this particular request I did consider asking instead that edited questions more than five days old get automatically pushed to the reopen queue. I decided against that idea because I could see that as causing the reopen queue to be overloaded by people trying to game the system.

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  • inb4 this is closed as a dupe of something.
    – JAL
    Jul 13, 2016 at 4:25
  • 3
    But in all seriousness of you feel that your questions shouldn't be closed as duplicates edit them to explain why. That's what the reopen queue is for.
    – JAL
    Jul 13, 2016 at 4:28
  • Right! that works really well.
    – PyNEwbie
    Jul 13, 2016 at 4:30
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    Out of interest, do you think one question on SO shouldn't be closed as a duplicate of another because it doesn't contain the exact same line of code, even if the reason behind the problem is exactly the same, and by reading the answer to the other post the questioner will understand what do to with their code? The same reasoning applies here.
    – Jon Skeet
    Jul 13, 2016 at 6:09
  • @Jon Skeet No I do think questions on SO should be closed as duplicates when there are clear analogies available. I do not think that is true on MSO. I think the S/N should be lower here than on SO
    – PyNEwbie
    Jul 13, 2016 at 18:59
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    I guess we'll have to agree to disagree on that then - as the rest of the community has so far, overwhelmingly (+3, -26).
    – Jon Skeet
    Jul 13, 2016 at 19:02
  • @Jon Skeet Do you have another solution? I would love it. I have gotten a lot from SO. There are too few questions I can answer. Actually that is not true - I try to avoid answering HW and gi me teh code questions I could answer a lot of those. I see identifying bad questions and questions that have been -wrongly- closed as my best possible payback but there is no mechanism for that.
    – PyNEwbie
    Jul 13, 2016 at 19:06
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    Your "wrongly" is no doubt other people's "rightly" - both here and on MSO. And of course when you have enough reputation, you will be able to vote to reopen questions.
    – Jon Skeet
    Jul 13, 2016 at 19:10
  • @Jon Skeet have you taken the time to look at the underlying SO questions that caused me to go down this path? Not the MSO questions but the SO questions. We are both spending too much bandwidth - here but if you have and disagree I wish you would share with me why.
    – PyNEwbie
    Jul 13, 2016 at 19:16
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    @PyNEwbie: To my mind, the SO questions are irrelevant to your proposal in this MSO question. If two MSO questions about different SO questions have the same answer, it's reasonable to close one of those MSO questions as a duplicate of the other. It's very unclear why your question starts off talking about one thing and then ends up talking about something entirely different, as far as I can tell.
    – Jon Skeet
    Jul 13, 2016 at 19:20
  • Fundamentally, I would like MSO not to be a sort of "appeals process" about individual SO questions. To my mind, SO questions should only be given as examples of a broader question: "How should we handle questions such as...", "What level of editing makes sense on questions such as ..." It should be about the system and principles, not individual cases.
    – Jon Skeet
    Jul 13, 2016 at 19:21

3 Answers 3

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Without addressing your specific meta questions that were closed as duplicates, (I haven't looked at them and have no opinion on whether or not they were truly duplicates) but rather the general intent of your feature request:

The fact that no one has asked on meta before about a specific SO question does not preclude the possibility that someone has asked essentially the same meta question about a different SO question, or even that they specifically asked about that issue in the general case.

Preventing duplicates from being closed on meta simply because they point to a different example on SO would be counterproductive.

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  • Why would you think that. Basically you are asserting that the herd always works. I have found over 100 questions closed as duplicates that were essentially asking for some action on SO where the action was accomplished. I really think that your statement have no opinion on whether or not they were truly duplicates is part of the problem here on Meta. People close questions because they are generally duplicates but not specifically and the specifics matter a lot when thinking about making SO better
    – PyNEwbie
    Jul 13, 2016 at 4:13
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    I don't agree with 100% of duplicate closures I've seen, and I do think that sometimes the specifics matter. I just think that if your feature request was implemented, it would prevent many general duplicates from being closed just because of insignificant specifics. I don't think that would make SO better. Jul 13, 2016 at 4:33
  • And what is the cost of not closing the question?
    – PyNEwbie
    Jul 13, 2016 at 4:33
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    @PyNEwbie the cost is in the time wasted writing the same information out again, rather than pointing people to where it's already available and spending that time answering new questions.
    – jonrsharpe
    Jul 13, 2016 at 8:36
  • @jonrsharpe - no the cost is that those STACK OVERFLOW questions that need action by people like you get ignored and stay closed
    – PyNEwbie
    Jul 13, 2016 at 18:20
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    @PyNEwbie that's not actually a cost, the supply of questions being far higher than the supply of people who can answer them, but you use all the formatting you like
    – jonrsharpe
    Jul 13, 2016 at 18:22
  • @jonrsharpe sorry, I bolded that to make it clear that my concern is not cluttering meta but cleaning SO
    – PyNEwbie
    Jul 13, 2016 at 18:46
  • It applies to SO and MSO the same.
    – jonrsharpe
    Jul 13, 2016 at 18:47
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The moment there is nothing unique to the new question any more - when the new question is perfectly and concludingly answered by a duplicate - it is perfectly ok to close as a duplicate.

This has several advantages:

  • it provides the OP with a link to the information they need. This link is more "official" than something posted by random users in comments. It's the community's way of saying "look here."

  • it signals to the community that the question has been answered elsewhere, and there may be no need to add a contribution of your own, saving users' time and effort.

  • it gives the OP, and anyone reading the question in the future, a pointer towards a canonical resource where it is answered.

  • It's neat and tidy.

It does happen that a question is closed as a dupe too hastily, or kind of rudely.

I frequently find myself voting to reopen unfairly closed duplicates, and fuming at the tone-deaf/hasty fellow users who cast the votes.

That doesn't happen nearly enough to justify adding a feature like the one you suggest, though.

In that case, if you can't vote to reopen yet, there is still comments as an avenue of communication with the OP or with the community.

Help the OP in comments (I do that all the time; even if the closing is justified, it is often basic decency to give the OP a custom short answer) or make the case why the question isn't a duplicate after all.

Hanging around on Meta and looking out for cases where the community may be judging a question wrongly (and being outspoken about it) is really the most effective remedy to this.

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  • It is hard to be outspoken when the close votes seem to swope in at times.
    – PyNEwbie
    Jul 13, 2016 at 16:35
  • @PyNEwbie yes, I recognize it isn't always easy around here.
    – Pekka
    Jul 13, 2016 at 16:40
  • I don't mind I just think there should be a method to rationally address these types of issues.
    – PyNEwbie
    Jul 13, 2016 at 17:07
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I agree with your suggestion.

I think it is important that when a question is closed, the OP can have a place to ask or discuss about the reason for closure of it. Under the current system, if the OP post such a question, it can be closed. This is not constructive.

If the original question X was closed as duplicate of a question Y, and there is a question B which asks why Y was closed, then, if OP post a question A which asks why X was closed, it might be closed as a duplicate of B.

The problem is that the claim that "X is a duplicate of Y" could be incorrect. If it is incorrect, the closure of the meta question A as a duplicate of B is also incorrect. In other words, it could be based on a false assumption. So, at least, I think that we should prohibit close such a meta question as duplicate.

In addition, if the OP posted the question A1 which asks why a question A0 was closed, and A1 is also closed, then he could post a question A2 which asks why A1 was closed. To prevent this pointless chain of events, I think we should protect the first one question.

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    It could also be a correct claim that a question actually is a duplicate, just because a user who is currently or constantly upset with the community disagrees that their question is a duplicate, doesn’t change the fact it actually is a duplicate. Jun 23, 2021 at 13:26
  • @SecurityHound I don't know which closure you are talking about, X and Y, or A and B, but if X is not duplicate of Y, then A is not duplicate of B.
    – user13087034
    Jun 23, 2021 at 13:50

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