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TL;DR

Add votes trend-line for hot posts in order to give better indication on outdated or improved answers.


Yesterday I proposed Auto expand vote count / warn when the post is controversial, which suggests to auto-expand vote count for controversial posts in order to give hints for users that something wrong with the post. Many users didn't agree for many reasons:

  • Can new users really tell that the answer is bad given X negative votes?
  • How will this help users viewing other answers and not sticking with the one with the shiny ✔?
  • We can't know the order of the votes; Is it a bad answer that was improved and was upvoted recently or it was once a good answer and is now deprecated/outdated?

Improving controversial posts - Take II:

What about adding a sparkline for answers that are getting much attention and are controversial? Take a look at the first answer for this question - It's accepted answer, with 64 upvotes. But did you know that in the last day it got more than 20 down votes?

Now let's imagine a new user landed on this answer. "Great! It's an accepted answer with many upvotes, I'll copy-paste it". Since we can't ensure that the user will read the comments that are warning about the danger behind the answer, imagine something like:

Sparklike

Of course with a brief comment explaining that we're viewing the trend line about the votes.

Don't you think we'll be protecting much better "blind" users from evil code supported by shiny ✔ and X upvotes?

I'm really aware of the complexity behind it, we can of course discuss how to reduce the complexity even more with similar ideas. Please share your thoughts.

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    Every time I hear of someone attempting to guide those that blindly copy and paste a question from Stack Overflow willingly, I cry inside. Not for the user that copies and pastes, no; for those of us who believe that they are not beyond our salvation.
    – Makoto
    Jan 8, 2016 at 23:26
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    @Makoto There is a problem, we can choose to ignore it and hope everything will be OK, and we can try to improve the way posts are handled by users.
    – Maroun
    Jan 8, 2016 at 23:27
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    It's not that I disagree - in fact, I rather love the inspiration behind it - I just think that its aim is to help those who really shouldn't be in their line of work.
    – Makoto
    Jan 8, 2016 at 23:30
  • @Makoto I completely agree with you - those users are beyond saving. It still seems fair to show this statistic to everyone, though, and a lot of evil answers can be harmful even if not blindly copy+pasted.
    – Pekka
    Jan 8, 2016 at 23:34
  • @Pekka웃 I'm not only referring copying-pasting answers, sometimes it's enough to understand the (bad) idea in order to harm yourself. Of course we can never ensure that someone will (or won't) do something, but what's the problem with trying to reduce the risk?
    – Maroun
    Jan 8, 2016 at 23:37
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    @Pekka웃: That's why I'm still interested in seeing this happen. I could make use of this information; it seems valuable. It's just that the aim is a bit off, y'know?
    – Makoto
    Jan 8, 2016 at 23:37
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    I do appreciate the burninate-like question title.
    – BSMP
    Jan 9, 2016 at 0:01
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    If Stack Exchange can do something well, it's titles. We know how to title posts.
    – corsiKa
    Jan 11, 2016 at 7:52
  • I feel the example answer is a bad one, as there is nothing objectively wrong with the answer. People have suddenly mass downvoted the solution because it's not a 'functional solution', even though it's an imperative language. The only difference between the top two answers is a matter of style.
    – Rob Mod
    Jan 11, 2016 at 9:44
  • "We can't know the order of the votes" Well… you can, with the timeline.
    – bjb568
    Jan 11, 2016 at 13:26
  • @bjb568 correct. That was in my previous suggestion. In the new one you can definitely know.
    – Maroun
    Jan 11, 2016 at 13:31
  • I'd rather see two separate lines in that graph... one for upvotes (green/blue) and one for downvotes (red).
    – canon
    Jan 11, 2016 at 14:05
  • @canon Of course.. I'm only suggesting the idea.
    – Maroun
    Jan 11, 2016 at 14:09

4 Answers 4

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While there are benefits to this, I'm not sure if it satisfies the title'd aim of making controversy clear in all cases. For example, an almost flat line

Controversial line

does mean controversy, since up votes and down votes keep on being given in the same proportions, but at first glance a flat line seems more like nothing is happening, rather than the presence of an active controversy.

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    I completely agree that not all sparklines will be in a good shape. But I think that just like people got used to votes, they'll get used to the sparkline as an indication of quality.
    – Maroun
    Jan 11, 2016 at 7:43
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    So why not a similar bar diagram, like we know it from the reputation stats? The only difference should be, that downvotes are really going down (in red) and upvotes going up in green (no calculation of daily difference). One could even maintain the base level by calculating the mean. Jan 11, 2016 at 8:11
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While I am uncertain of how much this will help copy-paste-pirates from emptying their rum barrels, I absolutely love the mini vote graph. It is very visually appealing, and contains a good deal of information not already available without a decent amount of inspection.

When I am a user on other exchanges, sometimes I want to click to see if the voting has been controversial or not. Having a graph of the voting pattern like this would be a great help in those situations, and so I imagine it would be very helpful on Stack Overflow.

I don't think this should be limited to controversial answers (or questions). I think it should just be across the board, the mini vote graph icon thing is just pure genius in my opinion.

Also, this does exist in other little known sites (Google Finance) as well - so there is presumably already research somewhere which said these are useful when viewing trends.

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    Though I do wonder: Does it show the average direction over all time, or rolling average over n days / votes? Jan 9, 2016 at 1:13
  • @Deduplicator I imagine it would show over all time, but for larger spans it would graph using larger increments of time. Jan 9, 2016 at 6:37
  • I agree. However I'm not sure if complexity might be an issue.
    – Maroun
    Jan 9, 2016 at 11:56
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People's ignorance will always be able to overpower your ability to provide information - meaning whatever great post quality heuristics you implement, those who just need quick code won't even notice. In the meantime...

  • it will get people confused (it might not be clear what the graph means)
  • good signal/noise ratio not guaranteed

But I like the graph too, let's just allow graphs everywhere for everyone, because graphs are awesome.

If SE makes vote graphs I will make a regression calculator userscript.

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  • I think that math guarantees good signal ratios, 99.9% of the times.
    – Maroun
    Jan 11, 2016 at 10:01
  • Not at all. Well, the signal on that graph will be always clean signal - but the implication in human mind might be not due to (a) possible misinterpretations and (b) effect of sharing the link to question (like the Meta effect). Jan 11, 2016 at 10:09
  • For example I get random reputation bursts when (presumably) someone shares my answer/question on a forum and I suddenly get few upvotes. Jan 11, 2016 at 10:10
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First off let me say thanks to the community for caring about users. Gold stars all round.

Adding additional context to views should be an "opt-in" feature. That being said, I would prefer numbers to charts.

It isn't obvious to me how to tell how many up/down votes an answer has. I'm not sure whether this is because I don't have enough privilege or because it is obscured in the UI. I suggest we make this more obvious in the style of the thumbs up/thumbs down.

If thumbs up/down isn't acceptable to the community, I would also suggest that in the current system the reputation of the person voting should matter more. What if there were such a thing as vote "weight", weighting positive or negative votes according to the reputation of the person voting? This might be able to mitigate vote-happy copy-pasta folks. On the other hand, weighting would undermine vote transparency.

The sparkline chart could be useful for overall metrics, however as @michal-charemza said it may not actually solve the problem you're looking to solve. Anyone who relies on copy-pasta isn't going to discriminate based on a sparkline. Thumbs up/thumbs down is a highly familiar convention, and I would argue more intuitive than reading a chart.

To address the specifics of the question:

Can new users really tell that the answer is bad given X negative votes?

Thumbs down would indicate that an answer has been rejected by a specific number of people. A counter argument could be that thumbs down is typically a "dislike" based on emotion. Objectively correct/incorrect answers exist on Stackoverflow, while the like/dislike convention implies arbitrariness.

How will this help users viewing other answers and not sticking with the one with the shiny ✔?

The fact that the user adds the checkmark for accepted answer is a design decision that helps more than it hurts. I have to go with @makoto on this one that the target audience of this community has to be a user that holds themselves accountable for the quality of their code. All information is provided in the spirit of open source, "as-is" with no warranty or guarantee.

We can't know the order of the votes; Is it a bad answer that was improved and was upvoted recently or it was once a good answer and is now deprecated/outdated?

I don't think order counts so much as quantity, since over time the community will police outdated questions. However, the sparkline might be useful for representing the history of a question. It is extra information that should be opt-in rather than the default.

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  • Thanks @approxiblue for the formatting
    – saranicole
    Jan 11, 2016 at 15:04
  • I'm not suggesting removing the count, but having the sparkline in addition. The votes down/up are not enough - How will you know who came first, down or up votes? If the upvotes arrived after it means the post was improved and it's fine, the other direction is the opposite.
    – Maroun
    Jan 11, 2016 at 15:06
  • If you consider "trends" an important enough indicator of an answer's validity, I suggest that relative trends in the context of a question is better than a trend per answer. Maybe this was your original intent all along, but I do like the idea of a sparkline chart that has all the answers represented over time. However, I would say the chart is still not enough - in that case maybe have a "community answer" in contrast with the user accepted answer, with the relative trends in the sparkline as the supporting evidence. Still all opt-in of course ...
    – saranicole
    Jan 11, 2016 at 15:11
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    Sure. Any improvement for the current feature-request should be considered! Thanks.
    – Maroun
    Jan 11, 2016 at 15:12

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