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I recently helped a user out in this* question. It seemed that the user was completely unable or unwilling to Google the problem, and I found the answer on the first page that I googled having only used Audacity (the software that they are having problems with) once.

I am glad that I have managed to help someone out, but I am concerned that I have negatively contributed to SO as a whole.

  • The user that I helped has not learned how to research problems by themselves.
  • He or she has learned that asking researchable answers on SO is an easy way to get answers.
  • There is a marginally lower signal to noise ratio

Should I have done something different?


*Edit: The original question has been removed.

Original question:

Title: Error: in Audacity Player

I have created a pcm file using decoded code in java. I want to run it in Audacity. but it is giving error message:

"Audacity did not recognize the type of file 'C:\Users\Administrator\Workspace\Decode\output.pcm. If it is uncompressed, try importing it using Import Raw '


Comments:

Me: Have you tried using Import Raw?

OP: No, I don't know how to do that

Me: I've no idea either, but literally the first result for googling "Audacity Import Raw" is this page (...) which says go to File->...->Import Raw

OP: Thank you, that solves my problem

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  • 32
    I don't see a general problem with throwing the users a bone, as long as you also make it clear that their question isn't welcome here (due to multiple reasons in this case), and probably also tell them to google first next time. If you didn't do so, you should have flagged the question as being off-topic as the user has a problem with Audacity, not with their own code. Thus it may be on-topic for SuperUser but isn't for SO. You should also downvote the question, as there's virtually no research effort. If everybody did just that, the problem would quickly solve itself due to question bans.
    – l4mpi
    Commented Sep 3, 2014 at 9:55
  • 6
    @Jonny Then personally I think you did the right thing. Some people have a habit of providing the nudge you did through an answer that is simply a link to a google search which is not the right thing to do. Commented Sep 3, 2014 at 10:06
  • 4
    ^-- That said, I agree that many technical people seem to be quite incapable of finding information. For questions on SO, I regularly try to just paste the title in Google and often the first 3 results are duplicate questions on StackOverflow. In such cases, I would give a question at least 10 downvotes if I could.
    – GolezTrol
    Commented Sep 3, 2014 at 12:53
  • 22
    @GolezTrol The only way for the asker to not be aware of the "suggested technology" is if they didn't even bother reading the error raised. The OP of this question didn't ask about anything that wasn't in the error. If someone can't do something as simple as search for the error raised, they have no business programming.
    – cimmanon
    Commented Sep 3, 2014 at 13:00
  • 1
    @Jay1b If direct search by question title fails to deliver a duplicate, then I do not see any reasons to downvote (of course if the title is not the "I've got a problem"). If there exists some decent but differently named duplicate, then deduplicate the question at consideration. If there are no duplicates and the question is on-topic - just answer it. Commented Sep 3, 2014 at 13:26
  • 29
    This isn't even a Google it problem. The solution is right there in the error message! Commented Sep 3, 2014 at 13:27
  • 3
    Why would you spend time answering a question that is so obviously off topic? Any time spent on this should have been to direct the OP to superuser.com. Commented Sep 3, 2014 at 14:08
  • 3
    When you say unable/unwilling to Google, I hear unable/unwilling to accept any help.
    – Geeky Guy
    Commented Sep 3, 2014 at 14:56
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    @alex440 To google has become synonymous with search. No one literally means go to google.com and search when they say google it. I find it hard to believe that all search engines are blocked in any country.
    – cimmanon
    Commented Sep 3, 2014 at 15:12
  • 2
    @PaulCroarkin - I'm not quite sure that I agree with you: I think that pointing them to SuperUser would just cause them to clutter up SU with an equally poor post, and the clutter was already on SO.
    – Jonny
    Commented Sep 3, 2014 at 15:12
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    I never understood why askers, even lazy ones, could think typing something into an Ask Question box on StackOverflow is easier than typing it into a Search box on Google. Commented Sep 3, 2014 at 15:19
  • 2
    On SO it's bad style, but in general you could use lmgtfy.com (=let me google that for you) to help make your point.
    – cassava
    Commented Sep 3, 2014 at 17:46
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    @cassava SO bans LMGTFY links in comments (with good reason) Commented Sep 3, 2014 at 18:08
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    What really bothers me is when I find a question where the title would have led right to the right answer on Google, but now leads to the unanswered (and often hopelessly stupid) question. Yes, I can fix that by answering the question. But if I do so, I'm encouraging bad questions. And, unless I can write such a brilliant answer that it's better than the relevant docs or tutorial (in which case I should have submitted that brilliant writing upstream!), it still leaves the internet dumber than it was yesterday.
    – abarnert
    Commented Sep 4, 2014 at 22:27
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    @TheLittlePig So... Because her environment imposes restrictions on her, users on SO should do her searching for her?
    – Basic
    Commented Sep 5, 2014 at 10:06

6 Answers 6

47

I've no idea either, but literally the first result for googling "Audacity Import Raw" is this page...

I'm not sure if you added that part of your comment before or after you posted here, but I would argue that it does help the OP learn how to research problems by themselves.

The downvotes and votes to close have (hopefully) taught them that they shouldn't ask easily researchable questions on Stack Overflow, and the impending deletion of their question will take care of the temporary dip in signal-to-noise ratio.

If you just give people answers to their easily researched questions, it does work against the goals of the site, but if you use all of the tools available to educate the OP on what kinds of questions they should and should not ask, then I think it's fine to point them in the direction of the answer as well. After all, it would be a little bit hypocritical of us to just close a question as "easily researched" without demonstrating how to do that.

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  • I did add that comment before posting here.
    – Jonny
    Commented Sep 3, 2014 at 12:12
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    Hasn't it been preached for years that something being on Google does not make a question invalid on Stack Overflow? Isn't it one of the goals of SO to appear as (one of) the top result(s) in Google? The only exception being any official documentation appearing as a top search result and giving a clear answer to the question being asked, in that case a question is bad.
    – user247702
    Commented Sep 3, 2014 at 14:24
  • @Stijn Did you read the original question? "Being on Google" isn't the only problem with it.
    – Bill the Lizard Mod
    Commented Sep 3, 2014 at 14:53
  • I can't read the original question. <10k
    – user247702
    Commented Sep 3, 2014 at 14:54
  • @Stijn Jonny edited it into the question here.
    – Bill the Lizard Mod
    Commented Sep 3, 2014 at 14:55
  • It does say I'll summarise the posts below, which I perhaps mistakenly interpreted as it not being the full question. I probably also focused a bit too much on the Google part of this Meta question.
    – user247702
    Commented Sep 3, 2014 at 15:00
  • @Stijn Whoops, you're right, that was a summary. I included the full text.
    – Bill the Lizard Mod
    Commented Sep 3, 2014 at 15:03
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    @Stijn: "Isn't it one of the goals of SO to appear as (one of) the top result(s) in Google?" But when the existing top results all answer the question perfectly, having a mediocre-to-terrible SO question beat all of those results is not helping anyone.
    – abarnert
    Commented Sep 4, 2014 at 22:29
  • +1 for it would be a little bit hypocritical of us to just close a question as "easily researched" without demonstrating how to do that :)
    – avalancha
    Commented Sep 5, 2014 at 11:22
  • +1 for all of this, particularly as it includes the criterion that the post be later deleted to undo the harm to SO. Commented Sep 5, 2014 at 13:39
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If you can be bothered to help lazy users, well there is no mechanism or policy to stop you. But please read the hover text for the downvote button and decide whether the question warrants a downvote.

4

When answering a question "that simple", always ask what the person has done or tried before posting it in stackoverflow.

I had a learning curve on how programmers collaborate with each other on this site and if you really want to help him or her, let them show that they have done their homework. One of two things will happen, they will learn to research, or they will abandon this practice, being that they'll have to work for their answer.

My 2 cents.

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  • Asking "What have you tried" is not helpful at all to the op or the users who are trying to answer the question. It's simply a shorter way of saying "I might know the answer but i'm not willing to give it to you until you show your work." The question should instead simply be downvoted, and possibly left with a comment linking to the faq on why such a question isn't acceptable.
    – Kevin B
    Commented Sep 3, 2014 at 14:35
  • @KevinB One could ask more specifically like "Did you do XYZ?" That way you just ask for additional information which the questioner just might have forgotten to add accidentally. Also the questioner learns this way what informations are typically needed. That and downvotes is the best strategy. Commented Sep 3, 2014 at 14:50
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    "What have you tried" has helped me write better questions. Showing your work gives more examples of what the question is asking and better context for it. Simply thinking through what I have tried and explaining it for other people gives me more ideas for other things to try and has helped me answer my own question instead of posting on SO.
    – Eva
    Commented Sep 3, 2014 at 14:59
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    @Eva I agree completely. Many times I've discarded asking questions before hitting submit, because I've performed due diligence in editing the question and that has led me to the answer. A bit like "rubber planting", a term we used to use, meaning that to explain the question to someone else (or indeed, a potted plant) was enough to help you find the answer yourself.
    – Echelon
    Commented Sep 4, 2014 at 9:10
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    @Eva Don't laugh but I end up discarding the majority of my questions before I get to the submit button. Listing steps I'd taken, dead-ends I'd hit, etc in a coherent way often exposes the hole in my thinking.
    – Basic
    Commented Sep 5, 2014 at 9:57
  • @Basic: That's fantastic, and desired. Your next step is to learn to apply that logical thinking in the first place, before you decide you need to post to SO. :) Commented Sep 5, 2014 at 13:40
  • @LightnessRacesinOrbit Very true but unfortunately, it's something we all do from time to time ;)
    – Basic
    Commented Sep 5, 2014 at 15:35
  • @Basic: Definitely! Though the difference is that, for me, it's not even close to a "majority" ;) Commented Sep 5, 2014 at 16:16
-2

Even if a user asks something stupid that they could easily find on Google ("hey, how do I find information about how to use the Google Search API?" :-) - it is still a valid question. Nothing should be done to "help" users as it risks patronising users to say "lemme Google that for you". Just answer and smile at the points when they flag you as giving the right answer.

Seriously - I work as a software developer and I virtually live in Google (OK StackOverflow first! (-: ) but I don't tell my boss that. Indeed, few bosses know exactly how much Googling their developers do but it is a LOT. All my colleagues do, I do, my last boss does. It is just a way of working, but not everyone does this. It takes all sorts to make the world go around and I stopped trying to change people a long time ago. Easier to try and make yourself more patient than it is to change someone else's learned helplessness. Whether the question is a good question for the Exchange is a different question.

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    I often comment: "This [link] might be useful. Found it while searching for [keywords]." For this I don't have to test if it indeed is a good answer and maybe it solves the question and the questioner learns that searching can save him some time. Commented Sep 3, 2014 at 14:54
  • Nice. Still could be seen as condescending by some - but at least you are not forcing someone to do things you way. Commented Sep 3, 2014 at 14:58
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    If everybody was this complacent, we'd have much more noise. I have no reservations against "patronizing" users who don't understand what makes a good, useful question.
    – Trojan
    Commented Sep 3, 2014 at 17:58
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    Furthermore, if Google is such a useful tool in industry, why wouldn't you want to teach others - students, colleagues, etc - how to use it? I doubt that anyone would debate its commonality, but do you want a colleague who comes to you to ask "how do I find information about how to use the Google Search API?" It's a waste of both their and your time. Teaching them saves that step.
    – Trojan
    Commented Sep 3, 2014 at 18:00
  • I personally think the question under discussion is beyond recovery (and maybe the asker too). Not only are they unable to Google for keywords, they're unable to follow the very helpful suggestion in the error message itself that tells them how to solve the problem. If that's really the level of coder we're aiming to help then those of us who can read a simple error message should move on elsewhere so we can cover real problems without the cruft.
    – Basic
    Commented Sep 5, 2014 at 10:04
  • It's appalling that there are people that actually think getting Imaginary Internet Points for intentionally flooding the site with extremely low quality content is a good thing that should be encouraged. The whole reason the site was created was to create a place that wouldn't be like this, where having quality content was important. The rules/guildelines of the site make it crystal clear that these aren't valid questions. You must have literally never even glanced at the help center's guidelines if you're asserting that the questions are even remotely valid questions.
    – Servy
    Commented Sep 5, 2014 at 14:10
  • Please. There is no need to go on the offensive and start slandering people. I am saying that the bar for "have they searched for this on Google or not" is the overall question here. I specifically state that the issue of it being a good one for the site is a different one. That's why it was closed off. When did it get so bad that people can't even try and put forward a solution without being flamed? Seriously - there are better things to get upset about instead of crying that people don't do what you want them to do. Commented Sep 8, 2014 at 10:43
-5

In general, I'd say that any question is worth answering. The answer itself gets more useful if it provides not only the answer, but also how it was gotten (the specific google search, in this example).

Even if the question itself doesn't add much to SO, it does teach the OP how to go about on SO and ask better questions. See your effort as coaching the OP, more than adding knowlegde to SO. We're here to help each other, after all.

To limit the "damage" of these questions, that's what downvoting is for.

(Somewhat off topic: in my google search results, I always look for hits on SO, first. So in that respect too, answering questions on SO is helpful)

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    When someone asks a bad question just answering it and doing nothing else doesn't teach them how to to ask better questions. It does the opposite. It tells them that asking those types of questions results in answers. If you want them to learn how to ask quality questions then tell them how to ask a quality question and explain what is wrong with their question. If you only answer the question when it's a good question, then they learn how to ask good questions.
    – Servy
    Commented Sep 5, 2014 at 14:13
  • meta.stackoverflow.com/questions/270418/…
    – gnat
    Commented Sep 5, 2014 at 14:53
  • Well, that's what I meant to say: "(...)The answer itself gets more useful if it provides not only the answer, but also how it was gotten (...)". I don't believe refusing to answer a question helps getting better questions. Instead, I'd feel like being shut out, and go try my luck elsewhere.
    – Phil
    Commented Sep 6, 2014 at 10:22
-11

One thing I have done in the past is use letmeGooglethatforyou.com or for short lmgtfy.com. You type in what they need to search for and get the short link and give them that link. It literally moves their mouse for them and shows them how to Google.

It comes off as a little smart, but it seems to get the point through.

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