14

I follow tags related to Arduino and other microcontroller programming and I don't know what to do with questions about USB port not showing up or device not responding. I think these question are off topic on SO and even on EE SE or Arduino SE they are problematic since the solution requires troubleshooting, not a simple answer.

The process of transferring the binary built on a PC to a device is sometimes called upload, sometimes download and is usually done with a command line tool (at development time usually invoked from an IDE).

Even if the code is written by the OP and the transfer is initiated from the IDE, is it "a problem with a tool used by coder" if the problem is not with the tool, but with the programmed device?

I don't have the close vote privilege yet on SO, but I flag off-topic questions and I notify SOCVR. The "About general computing hardware and software" doesn't seem right. "Blatantly off-topic" is maybe too much.

Are these question on-topic? If no, what flag should I use?

Examples:

7
  • 2
    This doesn't sound like a programming problem to me. If your harddrive crashes and you lose all the code you did not commit yet, that is a pretty nasty problem to have. But that does not imply questions about harddrive recovery are on-topic on SO.
    – Gimby
    Commented May 18, 2022 at 16:02
  • 15
    @Gimby No, but questions about recovering lost commits from Git are on topic here. Your contrived example about a hard disk crash does not seem related to the specific questions that Juraj asked about, which are definitely about tasks performed by a software developer engaged in writing and debugging code for a microcontroller.
    – Cody Gray Mod
    Commented May 19, 2022 at 5:25
  • Related (also (partly) about microcontrollers and communication): Are questions about [at-command]s on-topic on Stack Overflow? Commented May 19, 2022 at 6:53
  • @CodyGray I'll keep my mind open because it is you, but I don't think that you saying that will stop close votes from rolling in on such questions.
    – Gimby
    Commented May 19, 2022 at 7:13
  • 11
    Yes, @Gimby, I am often frustrated by the number of programmers (and, thus, close-voters) who think that software development consists entirely of web design.
    – Cody Gray Mod
    Commented May 19, 2022 at 7:47
  • @CodyGray, is a question which when 'minimized' can be reproduced as problem off topic on SO still on topic on SO? (for example run not codding specific tool from command line instead of as process from code or IDE). you say "yes it is on topic"
    – Juraj
    Commented May 19, 2022 at 8:00
  • 9
    As Ryan already described, topicality is not assessed ex post facto. You don't figure out what the answer is, determine that it's considered "general computing", and then declare the question off-topic. Questions about tools commonly (and, especially, those about tools exclusively) used by programmers are on-topic here. That includes IDEs, debuggers, flashers, etc. Topicality isn't supposed to be enforced by close-voters; that's only an escape hatch. The design is that the asker should be able to figure out for themselves whether their question is on-topic, by knowing only the topic.
    – Cody Gray Mod
    Commented May 19, 2022 at 9:04

2 Answers 2

16

The first two examples needed to be closed, but not because they were off-topic. Their problem is that they lack sufficient information to debug or even reproduce the problem. We have a standard close reason for that.

The other two questions seem fine to me. They're definitely not "general computing". General computer users don't program their devices or flash code onto them during the process of writing/debugging said code. Such questions might also be on-topic on other sites, like Arduino.SE or Electronics.SE, but overlapping site scopes doesn't justify closing a question on the site where it is asked. Neither question is off-topic for Stack Overflow.

In sum, and as always: evaluate each question on its own merits; don't look for a decision rule that is going to classify all questions about transferring a binary to a microcontroller as on- or off-topic.

2
  • the first two. yes I planed to flag them as "Needs details or clarity" if OP don't respond to comments.
    – Juraj
    Commented May 19, 2022 at 5:28
  • 1
    "Needs details or clarity" also works, but in cases where the specific type of details/clarity that is needed is information to reproduce and/or debug the problem, then I strongly prefer to pick that specific reason, as it gives the asker more targeted, relevant guidance on how to improve their question and get it re-opened. Additionally, I want to note that you should not wait to cast a close vote/flag. If you see fit to leave a comment, that's great, but it should not delay your voting to close. See also: meta.stackoverflow.com/a/260265 and meta.stackexchange.com/a/98026
    – Cody Gray Mod
    Commented May 19, 2022 at 5:31
12

Yes, they're on-topic

It's a problem encountered by a programmer, with a programming tool, as part of programming.

This is similar to why "my IDE throws this weird error; what does it mean?" is on-topic regardless of whether the error is a bug in the developer's code, a bug in the IDE, or because the user is out of disk space. We don't judge a question's on-topic status by its ultimate solution, because it would require the asker to already know the answer in order to figure out what site to ask it on.

9
  • so then just a downvote
    – Juraj
    Commented May 18, 2022 at 17:15
  • 6
    I don't understand why the questions need to be downvoted. Are they unclear or not useful? Do they lack research effort? I mean, I'm certainly not trying to tell anyone how to vote; that's everyone's individual decision. But leaving a comment on a Meta discussion like this essentially states that these questions and others like them should be downvoted, and it comes very close to instructing other users to downvote them, and I just don't see how that it is in any way appropriate.
    – Cody Gray Mod
    Commented May 19, 2022 at 5:27
  • 7
    "I don't like having these questions on Stack Overflow" may be a technically valid downvote reason, in the sense that there's nothing a moderator could or would do if you were using downvotes to express that sentiment, but it's not a very productive approach, in my opinion. It would be rather like me deciding that all Perl questions were uninteresting to me, and thus deserved a downvote. Kinda unfair; Perl programmers might well find them interesting and useful. If a question is missing information or needs improvement, then that's obviously a DV reason, but not basing it solely on the topic.
    – Cody Gray Mod
    Commented May 19, 2022 at 5:28
  • 1
    @CodyGray, yes "not useful" and "lack of research effort" in most cases, because they don't even try to google the error message
    – Juraj
    Commented May 19, 2022 at 5:30
  • 1
    on Arduino SE we have a canonical answer for generic avrdude upload problem so we can close as duplicate. now we need the same canonical answer on SO
    – Juraj
    Commented May 19, 2022 at 5:37
  • 6
    Maybe. With the caveat the "RTFM" duplicate closures aren't really encouraged. The duplicate needs to actually be a duplicate and it needs to actually answer the question that was asked.
    – Cody Gray Mod
    Commented May 19, 2022 at 5:46
  • 1
    @CodyGray, the canonic answer on Arduino SE for avrdude's very general message"not in sync" lists troubleshooting steps.
    – Juraj
    Commented May 19, 2022 at 9:34
  • @CodyGray: There are upsides to using a dup-hammer to close a question as a duplicate, as a proxy for lacking MCVE and otherwise unanswerable (especially in low-traffic tags), as long as the duplicate you choose is likely helpful given the limited info in the question. In that case I'd always comment, too. For me in SO's x86 / assembly tags, I sometimes do that partly because I don't want to waste my close vote on other reasons when it will almost certainly turn out to be a duplicate of something if the OP does bother to clarify. Since you only get one, and can't change it to dup after. Commented May 20, 2022 at 17:35
  • @Juraj I use downvotes for questions that are poorly asked, and close votes for questions that never should have been asked in the first place. When in doubt, I don't do either. Commented May 20, 2022 at 23:13

You must log in to answer this question.

Not the answer you're looking for? Browse other questions tagged .