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Let me start with a bold claim: The triage queue does not work and the majority of votings are just noise. I think there are several reasons for that and there are very interesting suggestions how to improve, but this is not really the essence of my request.

The point I want to make is: I have the impression that development goals of Stack Overflow shifted recently. In the last few months many cool new exciting features and extensions were announced. I really like them. However, I cannot think of any major improvements to moderation problems since the introduction of triage.

Don't get me wrong, I am a big fan of new features. But I think that improving the core is also important and it is getting too little attention at the moment.

But maybe I am wrong and you are already planning something? Well, we don't know. Is it possible to communicate the short-term and long-term plans of the development of Stack Overflow better, so that the community has a better overview where we are heading in the future?

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  • 6
    they'll let us know in 6 to 8 weeks :D
    – Patrice
    Commented Nov 13, 2015 at 16:09
  • @Patrice We should be more specific- 6-8 weeks after they start or 6-8 weeks before the improvement is to come out? I personally like the latter option myself, and feel it fits better.
    – Kendra
    Commented Nov 13, 2015 at 16:13
  • 1
    @Kendra I've sent that question in a contact form, and they told me they're analyzing it and will come back within 6-8 weeks! (On a serious note, SO's never been the most reliable website for these announcements :P )
    – Patrice
    Commented Nov 13, 2015 at 16:14
  • Do you have any proposals for what improvements they could make? The queues are full and contain a lot of noise largely because this site has 10.5 MM questions and climbing. That much data requires lots of hands-on help, which is why we're having a second moderator election this year, 7 months after the last one. There's only so much that can be automated or delegated to relatively new users (i.e., people below XYZ reputation or without the {whatever} gold badge).
    – elixenide
    Commented Nov 13, 2015 at 16:17
  • 5
    Well, we did have an announcement yesterday on some of our plans.
    – Taryn StaffMod
    Commented Nov 13, 2015 at 16:18
  • @EdCottrell, well I don't have to make proposals, they're all over meta. I can link a few I find promising. But that's not my point here. I am more criticizing that they seem to be largely ignore, although sometimes being very sensible. I think the argument "there are just too much content" is correct, but you can also see it as: "some how we fail to motivate users to help moderating".
    – cel
    Commented Nov 13, 2015 at 16:21
  • @bluefeet, but that's all just shiny new features. Are you telling that there's no interest in improving existing mechanics anymore?
    – cel
    Commented Nov 13, 2015 at 16:22
  • @cel No, that's not what I'm saying. As the post explains, nothing is going to detract us from Q&A - it's our core product. We are always making improvements to the Q&A product; we have features that get sent to the dev team weekly - for example this was completed this week.
    – Taryn StaffMod
    Commented Nov 13, 2015 at 16:26
  • 2
    @cel I'm not saying you "have to make proposals." I'm saying this is a fairly vague and broad complaint if you make it without any proposals. There are, indeed, lots of proposals on meta. Many of them are terrible, many of them are good and already implemented, and many of them are good but possibly forgotten or obsolete. Are there any that you think would be particularly helpful? It would help if you could identify a specific problem and propose a fix for it.
    – elixenide
    Commented Nov 13, 2015 at 16:31
  • @bluefeet, sorry that question was meant more in a rhetorical way. Sure you care about QA. - I surely do not doubt that. But it's hard too get an overview what's actually happening because SO does not communicate well.
    – cel
    Commented Nov 13, 2015 at 16:33
  • @EdCottrell, okay, here you go. My personal pet peeve is e.g. that this has never been implemented. I see virtually no downsides - and a lot potential to improve. meta.stackoverflow.com/questions/289871/…
    – cel
    Commented Nov 13, 2015 at 16:35
  • @cel I think that's a good example and a good question, but I don't think the proposal is a good solution to any actual problem. As I wrote in my answer to that question, a "training queue" is a solution looking for a problem. Much better would be to have the existing queues throw audits at users in an adaptive manner. Seem to be going too fast? Fail a lot? Have some more audits to slow you down. But the queues already do a lot of that.
    – elixenide
    Commented Nov 13, 2015 at 16:40
  • @Patrice 6-8 weeks = we don't really know :P
    – Just Do It
    Commented Nov 13, 2015 at 16:41
  • 1
    @PoolPartyRenekton I know... which is why I posted this ;)
    – Patrice
    Commented Nov 13, 2015 at 16:41
  • @EdCottrell, but the assumption you make is that audits are designed that they sample questions in a similar way as you get them in the real queue. And that's simply not true. In triage you only get very bad ones (known deleted spam) and very good votes (heavily upvoted). They are not representative of what you get in the queue. Yes adaptive reviews would be awesome, but that's much more difficult to implement than a practice queue. Adaptive reviews are almost a generalization of that simpler idea.
    – cel
    Commented Nov 13, 2015 at 16:44

1 Answer 1

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TRIAGE! Funny you should mention that. That's something I've been testing for quite a while, can we talk about it for a moment?

There are a lot of systems in place that decide what goes straight to triage, and what is probably okay to send right to the front page. In each of those systems, there are many knobs to turn for fine adjustment in order to make sure that the right things are going to triage. We do a manual audit monthly on triage outcomes to see what it sent where, and if we agree on the accuracy of how folks voted. Then we talk about where to go from there. It's a system that will require perennial monitoring and tweaking.

The thing is, you have to wait almost two weeks after every tweak to see what the ultimate fate of any given question in a test group ends up being - that's just how long it takes for some stuff to settle on the site. I might have hair left by the time we finish.

Do weeks go by where I don't have time to work on it? Yeah, but it's currently in focus. Triage gets a lot right. We're very communicative about what we're working on that you don't already know about. The absence of minutiae about what we're currently still doing is in no way indicative of a lapse in focus, it's just us not wanting to waste your time with updates that convey basically nothing actionable or of any real interest.

I've said this before but - even if we weren't doing the stuff we've been talking about recently, other problems don't become magically easier to solve. Yeah, we're growing and introducing new things, but not at the cost of ignoring other things.

You can, you know, always just ask us about stuff if you're wondering where we are with it :) We come here when we have something new to report, or we're really hoping to get feedback on something. If we did too much "Yeah, still the same as last week" -- many would stop listening.

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  • Sorry for formulating the question in such a provocative way. To be fair, I never assumed that you suddenly completely lost interest in improvements. But your answer makes me think that you have a completely different view on the problems than I have. I would say that all these improvements of what goes into triage is not very important until the reviewing works. And the lack of progress there frustrates me a little to be honest.
    – cel
    Commented Nov 13, 2015 at 16:58
  • But now that I got your offer to ask any question: I would love to see your opinion on this suggestion :P meta.stackoverflow.com/questions/289871/…
    – cel
    Commented Nov 13, 2015 at 16:59

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