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Whenever I write a question, I try to include a lot of information or examples on what code I have and what I want the code to do.

However I feel like I over explain: I asked this question on XAML properties today, and the answer (unfortunately a comment...) is basically:

For WPF, use DependencyObject.SetCurrentValue, for Xamarin, there is no way to achieve that.

Did I really need to make a lengthy post to get this clear and fully satisfying, one sentence answer/comment? I could have also asked "How do I change a value from a XAML control's code behind in a way that preserves a potential one way binding to that property?" It is tiresome to write a long question, and most certainly not appealing to read a wall of text to answer my question.

I do give that amount of context, because my experience so far was that when I don't, I get around 5 comments questioning my general intentions ("Why not create an overload?" - "Because it conflicts with other methods."), asking unrelated stuff ("Why is there an out parameter on a void method?" - "Because the original method is fluent and only in the example the method is void."), re-assuring my code works at all ("Your property is never set." - "Not in these code fragments, but there are others."), suggesting a different code pattern, maybe even asking something that is already implicitly answered by something I wrote ("Did you implement INotifyPropertyChanged?" - "As I said, the binding broke but worked beforehand, so the problem is not something that would cause it to not work at any time.") etc.

It's certainly not a bad thing when people try to help by providing workarounds, but after all, sometimes I want my question to be answered and not my code to be questioned.

How do I pick the amount and pieces of context I give so people trust me that my general intention is alright, but avoid trying to overrule every potential objection in the original question already?

Basically I have the same problem like this poster, but I'm not asking for a new feature, or this one, but I'm also not asking about phrasing so I can get away without any context, but rather finding the right bits of context to make clear what I want and why I want it. (See? I'm doing it right now! I'm only linking these questions because otherwise, from what I expect, some users will read the headline, then mark my question as duplicate of those two and move on, not believing I already read those questions but could not find the answer in).

EDIT To be clear what this question is all about:

The phrasing of elaborated questions cost me 1.5 hours, whereas a short question without context costs me 1 minute.

  • When I only ask the question, I get comments asking about the context. (rightfully so)
  • When I provide some context with stripped examples, I get comments related to the example, which are irrelevant for the actual code. (not helpful)
  • When I include non-stripped examples, I get comments on my methods (usually not helpful)
  • When I include and explain the full context, I need 1.5 hours again.

How do I find a balance?

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    I'm a little lost. What's the unhelpful comment you're referring to? The fact that something that's doable in WPF is simply not doable in Xamarin is just unfortunate (and as a WinRT/UWP developer I can tell you it's a neverending nightmare), but I don't see how it hurts your otherwise lengthy post.
    – BoltClock Mod
    Commented Jan 6, 2017 at 19:03
  • 16
    @bolt He's saying that the comment was actually helpful—in fact, it was the answer he was looking for, and it seems like a waste to have typed out that whole nice question just to get this simple little answer. The question here is, how do I find a balance between simplicity and the right amount of context?
    – Cody Gray Mod
    Commented Jan 6, 2017 at 19:13
  • 3
    @Cody Gray: Oh. Yeah I see where he's coming from now. It's a predicament I personally sympathize with.
    – BoltClock Mod
    Commented Jan 6, 2017 at 19:14
  • Although, yeah, the title of this question does say "unhelpful comments", so I see why you were confused. Maybe I'm wrong. LWChris, care to chime in?
    – Cody Gray Mod
    Commented Jan 6, 2017 at 19:15
  • 2
    @BoltClock Oh, the comment is not unhelpful at all! But the phrazing of the posted question cost me 1.5 hours, whereas the short question w/o context costs me 1 minute. But: When I only ask the question, I get comments asking about the context. When I provide some context with stripped examples, I get comments related to the example, which are irrelevant for the actual code. When I include or explain the full context, I need 1.5 hours again. How to find a balance?
    – LWChris
    Commented Jan 6, 2017 at 19:18
  • 11
    @Cody Gray: It's funny because I actually wrote a rant about something similar the other day (but never posted it). In summary it was about expert or obscure questions getting unhelpful comments from non-experts forcing the asker to have to give them a primer on said expert or obscure topic that the question's target audience would not have needed. Something I like to call "lack of research effort on part of the commenter(s)".
    – BoltClock Mod
    Commented Jan 6, 2017 at 19:19
  • 6
    Like an MCVE for adding a control to a WinForms application? Yeah, asking questions is hard. The person with the question is the least qualified to determine how much is too much or how little is too little. You really have to just do the best you can, trying to put yourself in somebody else's shoes, and let constructive comments guide you in case you miss the mark.
    – Cody Gray Mod
    Commented Jan 6, 2017 at 19:24
  • 2
    @BoltClock: it's for such comments I wished we could downvote a comment as well.
    – Jongware
    Commented Jan 6, 2017 at 19:28
  • @Rad Lexus: I've taken to evaluating certain comment flags for context as a substitute. (Only if I get to them; I don't specialize in comment flags.)
    – BoltClock Mod
    Commented Jan 6, 2017 at 19:30
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    Relevant. Just make sure your post contains enough information to answer, is reasonably scoped, and is otherwise on-topic. Anything on top of that is gravy, but may end up just being noise in the end. Make sure to remove irrelevant information once the question has been successfully answered so future readers don't have to wade through a bunch of irrelevant noise in order to find the meat of the problem and solutions.
    – user4639281
    Commented Jan 6, 2017 at 19:42
  • 4
    @TinyGiant That is a good hint, too! Sometimes people suspect the error to be in a totally irrelevant code part and ask you to post that, too. If it turns out that code has nothing to do with it, you can remove it. "Deflate" the question to relevant parts as soon as it has been answered.
    – LWChris
    Commented Jan 7, 2017 at 19:11
  • 1
  • @Cody Gray: Here's another example of someone having to include a tutorial in an already-clear question because people unfamiliar with the topic were dupe-voting it to a completely unrelated question. The mod-only question timeline shows multiple duplicate flags and duplicate close votes.
    – BoltClock Mod
    Commented Feb 18, 2017 at 4:32

3 Answers 3

54

If you're able to explain your question to the point that a rather terse sentence provides the answer that you're looking for then ...

You're doing it correctly!

We discourage folks from answering with comments (even though they are helpful) because comments are ephemeral by nature; there's no guarantee that a comment is going to stick around, and the question itself still shows as not having an answer unless more actual answers are posted and upvoted.

Try to encourage the person to elaborate a bit in an answer, and don't hesitate to answer the question yourself giving credit to the commenter and expanding on it a bit if they don't seem interested in answering themselves.

The amount you have to put in depends, it's the minimal amount you think is needed for someone else to walk into your problem and know everything that you do about it. In some cases, that might be a brief paragraph of details and some notes about your configuration. In other cases, it might be a bit of a story explaining how you arrived at trying whatever it is you're trying to do - especially if it seems like an odd way of going about it.

It's hard to give a blanket answer. Just know that very clear questions with an exceptional amount of context tend to really help other people as time goes on, because they can quickly determine if the problem you were facing relates to what they're trying to do.

Over-explaining is never a waste of time, it's just sometimes excessive of what was actually required. But for a collaborative knowledge base like Stack Overflow - that's okay, and thanks for being awesome.

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    IMO it should be noted that if information is irrelevant or repeated elsewhere, it should be excluded, and any information that is found to be irrelevant after the question has been answered should also be removed to reduce the amount of noise future readers have to wade through to find the meat of the problem and solutions.
    – user4639281
    Commented Jan 6, 2017 at 19:44
  • 2
    I already tried to encourage him to re-post his comment as answer, so I can accept and credit him. So far no reaction. I will wait until tomorrow evening, and if it's still unanswered then, I'll go ahead and copy that sentence to an actual answer and add something like MDSN links to the method docs and a highlight on pitfalls when calling it.
    – LWChris
    Commented Jan 6, 2017 at 20:15
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    I totally forgot to consider that any details in my questions are not only relevant for those who answer my question, but also to those who have the same problem. That actually really sheds a different light on my "problem" of overexplaining. Thank you.
    – LWChris
    Commented Jan 6, 2017 at 21:08
  • "from leaving terse comments as answers" ...I think you mean "from leaving terse answers as comments"
    – kettlecrab
    Commented Jan 7, 2017 at 1:04
  • 2
    @Anon234_4521: English grammar is weird. Somehow, both of those sentences can be interpreted to mean both of those things. Commented Jan 7, 2017 at 17:43
  • @tim-post edited your answer a bit to get rid of ambiguity of expression related to answers vs comments, hopefully I didn't change the intent.
    – eis
    Commented Jan 9, 2017 at 7:37
  • For beginners, there's often the situation when we don't know the correct terminology for the solution we are looking for (even more so, if English is not the first language). So, there is a high chance we'll post too much information trying to explain the idea in some convoluted, long way, when it could be expressed in a few sentences, if only we knew what is the exact thing we are looking for (in which case, probably we would find the answer on the Internet without asking the question at all). Commented Jan 27, 2021 at 10:37
22

Please, write the full thoughtful question.

The question gets written once, but read dozens or hundreds of times by experts thinking about answering it, and hundreds or thousands of times by later users finding it via search. The average1 over all 19 of your questions is 313 views each, and they aren't dead yet, they will continue accruing views for years.

If you spend an hour and a half (90 minutes, 5400 seconds) writing a question, that's less than 18 seconds per visitor. Your viewers save far more than that:

  • Experts save by not having to ask clarifying comments, read through a page of others' comments and your responses, come back when you respond to comments, and/or write answers that cover multiple divergent interpretations of your question. Guesstimate: saved 2-5 minutes each, unless compiling your code is required, in which case: saved 10-15 minutes by using your minimal complete compiler-ready example instead of building their own

  • Future visitors with a different problem save by seeing your problem is different by reading just the question, not the question plus comments plus answers. Guesstimate: saved 1-3 minutes each

  • Future visitors with the same problem save by having a useful formulation of the question and better answers. They don't have to ask a new followup question, or try answers that misinterpreted the question and went down dead-ends. Guesstimate: saved 15-20 minutes each

It isn't a zero-sum game. Time spent by the author/asker saves an order of magnitude more time in the long run.

Yes, this shifts the cost to the person being helped (where it belongs, honestly), but in exchange for that extra effort by askers, they get a more awesome SO, with more searchability and better answers. Remember even question askers read more questions than they ask.

And as for the issue of Nash equilibrium / the payout to you personally comes from other people writing good questions, not from putting time in yourself, that's why the gamification rewards well-explained questions with upvotes.

But don't do it just for the upvotes, do it so when you look in the mirror you see a contributor, not a help vampire.


1Potential meta effect noted, and minimized by using an average and not the view count from only the question in question (under 100 when I did the computation, so I don't believe meta is throwing off the average). Also, because viewership data from older questions is more meaningful.

0

In addition to the other answers here, for long questions/answers I always try to emphasize the actual one-line of the question (or the answer, as the case may be), either by bolding the line, or including a TL;DR section at the top of the question/answer. A user who is interested in further detail/context can read the entire text.

For example, because the word EDIT appears in bold in your question, the eye is naturally drawn to it, and it serves as a nice summary of the previous wall of text.

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    I don't agree, there should never be a need for TL;DR in a question. Either the question contains enough information or it contains too much information. If people can answer the question without reading all of it, then it contains superfluous information. If they can't answer the question without reading all of it (which is often the case), there can't be a TL;DR either.
    – Lundin
    Commented Jan 9, 2017 at 11:57
  • @Lundin The OP doesn't know -- and often cannot know -- what part of the context is definitely irrelevant; that is the issue under discussion here. Perhaps TL;DR is a misnomer, because from the OP's perspective everything needs to be read; but by emphasizing the central part of the question itself, it avoids wasting the reader's time with what the reader knows to be irrelevant detail.
    – Zev Spitz
    Commented Jan 9, 2017 at 13:49
  • 3
    I disagree with this answer only for the fact that it encourages people to put the word EDIT in questions/answers. If you need to make something bold, make the important part (the question itself) bold, not random words like "EDIT". Commented Jan 9, 2017 at 18:47
  • I feel that those who are too lazy to read a whole question to thoroughly understand the problem, should probably not answer questions on SO. The demand for TL;DR sections is something I attribute to lazy people, not professionals.
    – LWChris
    Commented Jan 11, 2017 at 14:56
  • @LWChris: sometimes the extra explanation is only needed for people who don't understand the question or know the answer, to ward off downvotes / unhelpful comments. The people who can actually answer may grok it from a short summary. It's really helpful to know what the actual question is first, so you know what to look for while skimming through the background info to check that you correctly grokked it in the first place. Best case for me as someone that answers questions is the real question first, then all the background. Don't bury real question in a big paragraph somewhere. Commented Jan 13, 2017 at 23:21

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