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I posted a technical question that I was surprised drew angry responses. Sure, I want to be right, but there is more I need to learn and the discourse has been stifled by the anger, and the angry moderator's deletion power.

Milliseconds in VBA Date variable

Lots of my comments were deleted.

I'd like to post another question, like Does anybody know if there is really a difference between VB and VBA Date data type? But it seems like a hot button for these moderators. And I think the angry moderators will just mark it as duplicate anyway. What should I do?

Thanks.

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  • 2
    Likely due to what seems to be stretching a data type beyond it's intended purpose. Yes, it can be done. But it generally should not, if you like maintainable code.
    – fbueckert
    Commented Mar 7, 2019 at 20:45
  • 2
    No one is going to get angry with you over a question topic. Are you sure it wasn't something else? Commented Mar 7, 2019 at 20:46
  • 8
    Only 2 comments of yours, on one of the answers, were deleted. One was deleted by a moderator after it was flagged, you deleted the other comment. That's really not a lot.
    – Martijn Pieters Mod
    Commented Mar 7, 2019 at 20:51
  • I think this is anger: You must really hate your fellow programmers and yourself to violate the encapsulation of data types like that. – this 2
    – Jay
    Commented Mar 7, 2019 at 20:54
  • 1
    Moreover, only 5 comments of yours were deleted, ever, 3 by you, and 2 by moderators (the other because it was deemed obsolete). Note that by moderators I'm talking about elected community moderators like me (note the ♦ diamond next to my name). Everybody else are just community members like you (with perhaps a few more privileges earned through participation. Don't confuse the two groups.
    – Martijn Pieters Mod
    Commented Mar 7, 2019 at 20:58
  • 7
    Last but not least, our community is expected to curate content, which includes voting and closing as duplicates or as off topic, where necessary. Emotions have very little to do with those actions. Don't read anything more into those than just people doing their best to use the site as it was designed.
    – Martijn Pieters Mod
    Commented Mar 7, 2019 at 20:59
  • 8
    The all caps does come across as shouting. If you just want emphasis, consider bold text but use that sparingly. @AndréKool Yep, I had to expand the comments to see it.
    – BSMP
    Commented Mar 7, 2019 at 21:02
  • 4
    Side note, it is better to use italics and bold to emphasize things you are typing as ALL CAPS IS SHOUTY AND ANGRY AND FOLKS TAKE IT NEGATIVELY.
    – user1228
    Commented Mar 7, 2019 at 21:02
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    No, I think at this point you're too invested in this for it to be worthwhile to continue. I'm just going to step out of this entirely, as I don't think there's going to be any good outcome to continuing.
    – fbueckert
    Commented Mar 7, 2019 at 21:55
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    The things I think it makes sense to explain are twofold: 1) moderation isn't angry. Moderation is just moderation. Now the comment is definitely not okay, so you should have flagged it. But.... 2) no matter how wrong or rude someone else is, this never excuses you from the 'be nice' guideline. Ever. And the be nice also talks about stuff like assuming good intentions. That's super important, as it's easy to read too much emotions in a comment on the interwebs.
    – Patrice
    Commented Mar 7, 2019 at 22:16
  • 2
    @Jay: "am I ever not nice in my assertions or replies?" Well, in this very thread, you SHOUTED at people, which is often reasonably interpreted as anger. "the pattern of deletions" One moderator deleted a comment; you deleted another. There is no pattern. Please do not repeat this misinformation about deletion again. Commented Mar 7, 2019 at 22:34
  • 3
    @Jay: "I really invite review" I see little evidence of this in this thread. For example, you say "the dismissal with incorrect arguments". But I see no evidence of "incorrect arguments" here. I see people challenging your assertion that the statements you're talking about are "angry", and I think those challenges are not "incorrect". Indeed, I would say that you have exhibited more anger than anyone else thus far, and it's very difficult to see your position as "inviting review" when you don't even seem to consider the possibility that you are wrong. Commented Mar 7, 2019 at 22:38
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    SO users care a lot about the technical accuracy of info presented at the site. They know what a Date looks like, they have no idea what you look like. Your desire to be right is pretty fundamentally in conflict with the site's goals, the stronger you assert it the more responses you invite. Duty calls. Don't do it. Commented Mar 7, 2019 at 22:50
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    @Jay yes, indeed you can ask that (as separate question on this site). I'd strongly recommend reading some existing posts on subject of "why this @#$#$ deleted my comment/question/answer" so before posting that question. The moderators provided plenty of information on how they handle flags on posts and comments already - if you just ask question without showing that you've read previous discussions you'll have more of "you @#$@ just don't like me" experience which we really don't like you to have. Commented Mar 7, 2019 at 23:01
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    @Jay: we are human beings, not automatons. If all we did was just delete because something is flagged, why have human moderators at all? So yes, we do review ourselves. Note that not all flags are handled by the moderators; certain flag types are handled by the community through review queues (through voting mechanisms), but may eventually be handled by a moderator if left long enough, and some are handled automatically if enough flags accumulate (e.g. 6 spam flags automatically trigger post deletion).
    – Martijn Pieters Mod
    Commented Mar 7, 2019 at 23:17

2 Answers 2

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The post you've linked to is not a question. It is some sort of blog entry combining ranting and sample code.

Proper moderation actions on the post in such case are:

  • close as "unclear what you are asking"
  • possibly downvote if ranting can't be edited out
  • possibly comment explaining that question should contain question.

Desired response from author of the post:

If you have code that works correctly but you are interested in feedback on your code consider CodeReview (also make sure to check they guide for SO users ).

7
  • Maybe I should say "This Looks Like Proof to me, am I missing something?" Would that be a question (with the code)?
    – Jay
    Commented Mar 7, 2019 at 23:46
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    @Jay if that what you wanted to ask... then yes (and it even aligns with the answer provided there). Also open-ended critique of working code is not exactly on-topic on SO and such question could be "too broad"... Side note: based on your comments it is not clear if you actually had a question or was open to possibility that doing what you wanted is not a good idea. Asking good question on SO when all you have is an answer is very hard (by design) - I'd strongly recommend to read link to self-answer guidance in my answer... Commented Mar 8, 2019 at 0:20
  • I am absolutely sincere in trying to find if there is a compelling reason I should not use sub-second time, as it appears to work in that code. No one posted code showing when it does NOT work, only worry and speculation. And some vitriol.
    – Jay
    Commented Mar 8, 2019 at 0:39
  • @Jay: I've never used the API or languages you're using, but I found the answer you're having issues with to be sufficiently "compelling", regardless of whether you can create code where it "appears to work". Indeed, I always find "appears to work" to be a generally poor reason for doing something unless I have no other choice. Even moreso if there are a bunch of functions that say that they don't allow it. As such, it's hard to know what would constitute a "compelling reason" for you. Commented Mar 8, 2019 at 2:29
  • @Nicol Bolas Did you read this link from Microsoft where they explain how to avoid the rounding? If somewhere Microsoft said "milliseconds are deprecated" they would have won long ago. This is compelling to me. link That link says the opposite to me: milliseconds are supported, but you have to know a secret..
    – Jay
    Commented Mar 8, 2019 at 4:28
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    @Jay: "This is compelling to me." Then your question is opinion based. That is, an answer's validity is based entirely on your opinion of what counts as "compelling". I prefer bullet-proof code, where you write code so that it cannot be broken by someone who doesn't "know a secret". This is especially important when such breakage will be difficult to detect and hard to track down. But that's me and how I look at things. We don't want opinion-based questions for this exact reason: they create discussions, acrimony from those whose opinions aren't validated by others, and so forth. Commented Mar 8, 2019 at 5:05
  • @NicolBolas When they infer that milliseconds are unsupported because some functions state they do not support milliseconds, what is that?
    – Jay
    Commented Mar 9, 2019 at 17:54
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Two things to clarify:

  • The users in the context of this discussion are not diamond moderators. Calling them moderators means you're implying that they're diamond moderators, which ain't true - do bear in mind that every user with sufficient rep can moderate content by up or downvoting on it.

  • If your question truly is a dupe, then the most appropriate action for it would be to close it as a dupe. Being upset about this fact isn't constructive.

To the comments - they're neither constructive nor helpful. Saying that you must "hate your fellow programmers and yourself" is inflammatory, even if the message that was trying to be conveyed was more innocuous. Flag a moderator to clean those up since they don't need to be here.

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  • Thanks, is there a shorthand for "community member with privileges"?
    – Jay
    Commented Mar 7, 2019 at 23:49
  • 2
    @Jay: Everyone eventually gets the privilege to down vote, so no, not really.
    – Makoto
    Commented Mar 8, 2019 at 0:21
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    I guess.... 'user '? It mostly covers it
    – Patrice
    Commented Mar 8, 2019 at 0:24
  • I mean a user who can mark a post "duplicate" and edit your question and delete peoples comments?
    – Jay
    Commented Mar 8, 2019 at 0:47
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    @Jay: Yeah, those are still users. Everyone gets that privilege with reputation.
    – Makoto
    Commented Mar 8, 2019 at 1:20
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    @Makoto: Only diamond moderators can delete comments. Commented Mar 8, 2019 at 2:29
  • 1
    @NicolBolas: I thought that if enough users mark a comment as "unfriendly" or "harassing", then the comment can be automatically deleted. Commented Mar 8, 2019 at 18:46
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    Yes, a preponderance of flags from regular community members can cause a comment to be deleted. Also, there are regexes they allow a single flag to delete a comment if its contents match a particular pattern (e.g., “+1 thanks”). @hov
    – Cody Gray Mod
    Commented Mar 8, 2019 at 21:48
  • I am forming the impression that some users treat Stack Overflow like a video game, and gang up on perfectly respectable answers and downvote them "because they can." Are diamond moderators wise to this and responsive when they see it?
    – Jay
    Commented Mar 9, 2019 at 17:58
  • @Jay: Wise to what? I have only very rarely seen an SO answer get significantly downvoted when there was nothing wrong with it. In pretty much every case I can recall, an answer that received downvotes had something that was at least arguably wrong with it. Furthermore, we generally don't police votes; as long as you're voting for the content rather than the user, it isn't anyone's business. Commented Mar 9, 2019 at 18:12
  • I cannot help but notice that the attentive non-moderators with privileges quickly deleted my non-inflammatory posts they regarded as unhelpful, but left in place the inflammatory ones that were against my point.
    – Jay
    Commented Mar 9, 2019 at 18:13
  • @Jay: Since this question starts with a statement about comment deletion that is patently untrue, as verified by a diamond moderator who can see which comments were deleted and why, it is difficult to take your statement at face value. Commented Mar 9, 2019 at 18:15
  • I regret if I unintentionally disrespected anyone by not knowing the difference between (diamond)moderators, and "community members with privileges".
    – Jay
    Commented Mar 9, 2019 at 18:22
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    @Jay: That wasn't the issue I was referring to. You claimed "Lots of my comments were deleted," when in fact only two comments were deleted, one of which was deleted by yourself. One comment is not "lots"; therefore, you significantly exaggerated the number of comments of yours that were deleted. As you can imagine, if someone has already been caught exaggerating the number of deleted comments, that damages the credibility of any future statements about deleted comments. Commented Mar 9, 2019 at 18:37
  • I regret that I used the word "many" when I was accidentally including supportive comments by others, my comments on the previous post that led to this post, and edits to the question performed by non-moderator member with privileges.
    – Jay
    Commented Mar 9, 2019 at 19:41

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