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Nov 25, 2021 at 15:26 vote accept Makoto
Nov 25, 2021 at 7:23 answer added NoDataDumpNoContribution timeline score: 12
Nov 3, 2021 at 19:18 history rollback Makoto
Rollback to Revision 2
Nov 3, 2021 at 19:18 history edited Makoto CC BY-SA 4.0
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Nov 3, 2021 at 10:42 comment added Lundin It's strange though, that the company assumes that their potential customers cannot be found among those using meta.so. I'd rather assume that this is the most obvious place to go looking for potential customers, especially long term ones. Though the strategy could be to just trick some confused middle-management at big tech companies into paying for a year or two without actually knowing or caring what they are actually paying for.
Nov 3, 2021 at 10:32 comment added Lundin The company stopped listening to community feedback in public meta several years ago. Any form of community feedback regarding new features, if at all allowed, is taken through private channels, where certain users and/or moderators are hand-picked through some non-public method. If you want community-driven site design, SO is not the right place for you. I'd recommend using the open-source, community-driven, non-profit alternatives instead.
Nov 2, 2021 at 18:29 comment added Kevin B Lack of answers to our concerns, lack of movement on the purpose/guidelines for articles, followed by silence, then a blog post touting it as a success, certainly doesn't help the feedback issue.
Nov 2, 2021 at 18:25 comment added BSMP The blog post seems irrelevant to the feedback issue. I don't understand how pointing out how many members are using Collectives implies that they don't know about the Meta posts.
Nov 2, 2021 at 15:51 history edited Makoto CC BY-SA 4.0
added 221 characters in body
Oct 28, 2021 at 16:08 comment added NoDataDumpNoContribution Just a last thought: I think that corporate culture might not be advanced enough for what you would like to have, i.e. more transparency and more honesty. That might be something that companies and SO in particular might just not be able to deliver.
Oct 28, 2021 at 16:06 comment added NoDataDumpNoContribution Okay, actually I applaud your efforts, though I also think you won't get a straight answer (which is an answer in itself). I basically stopped caring about collectives, and I don't need SO's confirmation that my input is mostly irrelevant. If they don't follow the community's advice, I won't bother with collectives. I think your effort to have an honest eye-to-eye conversation is commendable, but I also think you already have your answer. I prefer to spend my time on things over which I have more influence. In that way I'm actually not "living with it" but rather living without it.
Oct 28, 2021 at 15:56 comment added Makoto The last point I'm going to make on this though @Trilarion, is your concession of "just ignore it". This is the reason we're in this swamp to begin with. The community gets slow-played and engagement doesn't happen as quickly or as earnestly as development does, and so the community stops bothering and stops making noise about it. Then, this cycle repeats itself where feedback stops mattering and we're kind of stewing about it. That "live with it" culture is what we've been suffering for a very long time, and I no longer see any reason or rationale to continue propping that culture up.
Oct 28, 2021 at 15:54 comment added Makoto @Trilarion: To Philippe's response, I'm pretty sure I addressed that in the comments...but in the interest of transparency, a question of, "how do you want us to provide feedback" being responded to as, "of course we listen to feedback, don't say otherwise" really isn't answering anything.
Oct 28, 2021 at 15:52 comment added Makoto @Trilarion: The CEO gets to own this because it was submitted with his name. Moot point on whether or not the CEO actually wrote it. Next, the statement wasn't wrong, but that doesn't make it any less aggravating. It just conveys to me, an onlooker who's been trying to get the company's attention about this for something like four months, feel like this whole exercise is in vain and is pointless; they're going to continue to tout and celebrate the feature while overlooking or ignoring (at least publicly) the criticism or concerns raised by the community. Y'know, the "other" community.
Oct 28, 2021 at 10:53 comment added NoDataDumpNoContribution The given statement isn't even wrong factually, just misleading in that it kind of conveys the message that collectives are thriving, while they aren't. For practical purposes the impact of collectives on the platform is very small currently. "CEO of company is overly optimistic" isn't really news. It happens every day, everywhere (to some degree). Also Philippe answered the last question (maybe not satisfactorily, but still there is some engagement happen).
Oct 28, 2021 at 10:49 comment added NoDataDumpNoContribution "Nothing feels more like salt in an open wound to have the CEO decide to post something..." Makoto with all due respect and please ignore anything I say if you like, you are taking the whole thing too personally. Very likely the CEO didn't write that blog post by himself and this is more or less just a newsletter. Newsletters from companies are usually full of boasting and self-advertisement, far from an impartial, self-critical assessment. The impact of this blog post on collectives or the platform is probably rather minuscule. I would just ignore it.
Oct 27, 2021 at 23:22 history became hot meta post
Oct 27, 2021 at 22:22 answer added Ryan MMod timeline score: 43
Oct 27, 2021 at 22:11 comment added Makoto @zcoop98: This "excitement" you speak of is so far out of touch with those of us who've given feedback on it, that it honestly is negative. It's like our concerns or our questions or our opinions on it simply don't matter. And honestly, if they don't matter, I could live with that too. I just want them to be honest and up-front about it and own that.
Oct 27, 2021 at 22:04 comment added zcoop98 I really do get that; I guess I just disagree with you that that behavior is negative or unexpected in the CEO blog that's celebrating Q3 landmarks. They launched a new platform, and they've clearly communicated that they're excited about it, much more than Meta has been. But a blog post like this is exactly the place for such a remark in my eyes, and the quoted paragraphs follow right after mentions of other paid products (Teams and Advertising). Frankly, I think it would be weird not to mention Collectives where they did.
Oct 27, 2021 at 21:57 comment added Makoto @zcoop98: We're questioning what this is doing or how we're meant to interact with it, and it's being lauded as something to be universally celebrated, as if it's doing something revolutionary. It's like asking the car salesperson why anti-rusting is needed when they're broadcasting that anti-rust treatment is the best thing since sliced bread.
Oct 27, 2021 at 21:55 comment added zcoop98 I understand your question, and I agree that it would be nice to get a real answer from the company, but I don't see what's supposed to be "tone deaf" about the quote you linked. Regardless of feedback reception, I can see why a milestone quantity of members could be seen as something to celebrate or mention... The Company has already made it quite clear that there aren't plans to ditch Collectives at the moment. I guess what I'm asking is really: How does the blog post/ quote relate to your question? How does celebrating x total users equate to being interested or not in meta feedback?
Oct 27, 2021 at 21:35 comment added Scratte When you ask something and you only get vague run-around "answers", then the real answer is almost always "No".
Oct 27, 2021 at 21:29 comment added Makoto @KevinB: I was referring to the Prosus acquisition. Stack Overflow doesn't need to sell itself in that light. Unless you're referring to selling spaces for Collectives, and it's my understanding that this pricing structure hasn't been worked out yet, since they'll also want to transition to work with open-source projects (who may not even have a profit model).
Oct 27, 2021 at 21:26 comment added Kevin B Yes, however, like teams, it's a service that isn't "done" when one or three companies pay for it
Oct 27, 2021 at 21:25 comment added Makoto @KevinB - They've already been bought!!
Oct 27, 2021 at 21:23 comment added Kevin B It's important to paint paid products in a positive light to attract future buyers.
Oct 27, 2021 at 21:18 history asked Makoto CC BY-SA 4.0