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Jared Smith
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TL;DR

We'llYou are absolutely correct that with varying cultural expectations we'll never make everyone feel welcome, plus some people expect for some reason to be handled with extra care they neither deserve nor need. We just need to make a statistical shift in the percentage of people who feel unwelcome.

Longer answer:

At the risk of repeating myself, I think we're being overly concrete in our discussion of this topic. My understanding is that we're trying to shift a statistical trend over time and thousands of people, not have a deterministic algorithm that lets us 'be nice' in every conceivable situation where little Billy's tiny feelings might be hurt. Maybe I've misunderstood the goal here, but there will always be false positives where we hammer down on someone interested who just happened to (through ignorance or temporary carelessness) ask a bad question and false negatives where we let a bad question slide (through lack of policing or deliberate inaction). The powers that be seem to want to turn the dial towards the false negative end.

I also think the phrasing thing is a bit of a red herring. Consider this question and the following possible responses:

I need to build an e-commerce site what do I need PLEASE HELP!

Responses:

  1. Stackoverflow is not a code writing service!
  2. QQ ya noob/RTFM
  3. Closed with no comments and 3+ DVs for being off-topic/too broad
  4. This site is for specific programming questions and does not recommend tutorials. That's pretty broad: is there a specific piece of it you're having trouble with?

1 & 2 while perhaps true are not exactly welcoming, doubt there's much controversy there but people do write such responses. Heck, I write those responses when I see someone with enough rep to know better write a crappy question. Number 4 is probably the desired response, and while it may seem like a lot of effort for a throw-away question it's pretty general purpose and can be copy-pasted over and over.

The problematic one is 3: that's totally within the rules but is kind of harsh from the perspective of a new user. We should probably try to turn those into 4.

TL;DR

We'll never make everyone feel welcome, some people expect for some reason to be handled with extra care they neither deserve nor need. We just need to make a statistical shift in the percentage of people who feel unwelcome.

Longer answer:

At the risk of repeating myself, I think we're being overly concrete in our discussion of this topic. My understanding is that we're trying to shift a statistical trend over time and thousands of people, not have a deterministic algorithm that lets us 'be nice' in every conceivable situation where little Billy's tiny feelings might be hurt. Maybe I've misunderstood the goal here, but there will always be false positives where we hammer down on someone interested who just happened to (through ignorance or temporary carelessness) ask a bad question and false negatives where we let a bad question slide (through lack of policing or deliberate inaction). The powers that be seem to want to turn the dial towards the false negative end.

I also think the phrasing thing is a bit of a red herring. Consider this question and the following possible responses:

I need to build an e-commerce site what do I need PLEASE HELP!

Responses:

  1. Stackoverflow is not a code writing service!
  2. QQ ya noob/RTFM
  3. Closed with no comments and 3+ DVs for being off-topic/too broad
  4. This site is for specific programming questions and does not recommend tutorials. That's pretty broad: is there a specific piece of it you're having trouble with?

1 & 2 while perhaps true are not exactly welcoming, doubt there's much controversy there but people do write such responses. Heck, I write those responses when I see someone with enough rep to know better write a crappy question. Number 4 is probably the desired response, and while it may seem like a lot of effort for a throw-away question it's pretty general purpose and can be copy-pasted over and over.

The problematic one is 3: that's totally within the rules but is kind of harsh from the perspective of a new user. We should probably try to turn those into 4.

TL;DR

You are absolutely correct that with varying cultural expectations we'll never make everyone feel welcome, plus some people expect for some reason to be handled with extra care they neither deserve nor need. We just need to make a statistical shift in the percentage of people who feel unwelcome.

Longer answer:

At the risk of repeating myself, I think we're being overly concrete in our discussion of this topic. My understanding is that we're trying to shift a statistical trend over time and thousands of people, not have a deterministic algorithm that lets us 'be nice' in every conceivable situation where little Billy's tiny feelings might be hurt. Maybe I've misunderstood the goal here, but there will always be false positives where we hammer down on someone interested who just happened to (through ignorance or temporary carelessness) ask a bad question and false negatives where we let a bad question slide (through lack of policing or deliberate inaction). The powers that be seem to want to turn the dial towards the false negative end.

I also think the phrasing thing is a bit of a red herring. Consider this question and the following possible responses:

I need to build an e-commerce site what do I need PLEASE HELP!

Responses:

  1. Stackoverflow is not a code writing service!
  2. QQ ya noob/RTFM
  3. Closed with no comments and 3+ DVs for being off-topic/too broad
  4. This site is for specific programming questions and does not recommend tutorials. That's pretty broad: is there a specific piece of it you're having trouble with?

1 & 2 while perhaps true are not exactly welcoming, doubt there's much controversy there but people do write such responses. Heck, I write those responses when I see someone with enough rep to know better write a crappy question. Number 4 is probably the desired response, and while it may seem like a lot of effort for a throw-away question it's pretty general purpose and can be copy-pasted over and over.

The problematic one is 3: that's totally within the rules but is kind of harsh from the perspective of a new user. We should probably try to turn those into 4.

Source Link
Jared Smith
  • 21.9k
  • 19
  • 26

TL;DR

We'll never make everyone feel welcome, some people expect for some reason to be handled with extra care they neither deserve nor need. We just need to make a statistical shift in the percentage of people who feel unwelcome.

Longer answer:

At the risk of repeating myself, I think we're being overly concrete in our discussion of this topic. My understanding is that we're trying to shift a statistical trend over time and thousands of people, not have a deterministic algorithm that lets us 'be nice' in every conceivable situation where little Billy's tiny feelings might be hurt. Maybe I've misunderstood the goal here, but there will always be false positives where we hammer down on someone interested who just happened to (through ignorance or temporary carelessness) ask a bad question and false negatives where we let a bad question slide (through lack of policing or deliberate inaction). The powers that be seem to want to turn the dial towards the false negative end.

I also think the phrasing thing is a bit of a red herring. Consider this question and the following possible responses:

I need to build an e-commerce site what do I need PLEASE HELP!

Responses:

  1. Stackoverflow is not a code writing service!
  2. QQ ya noob/RTFM
  3. Closed with no comments and 3+ DVs for being off-topic/too broad
  4. This site is for specific programming questions and does not recommend tutorials. That's pretty broad: is there a specific piece of it you're having trouble with?

1 & 2 while perhaps true are not exactly welcoming, doubt there's much controversy there but people do write such responses. Heck, I write those responses when I see someone with enough rep to know better write a crappy question. Number 4 is probably the desired response, and while it may seem like a lot of effort for a throw-away question it's pretty general purpose and can be copy-pasted over and over.

The problematic one is 3: that's totally within the rules but is kind of harsh from the perspective of a new user. We should probably try to turn those into 4.